Career Decisions- Advice Needed (Particularly from the older folks)

[vicki]

Up until last week, I've always wanted to be a corporate lawyer since I was ten. Maybe something involving international relations, perhaps contract negotiations and stuff like that between Japanese companies and a large American corporation. Something along those lines... but lately I've been really sitting down and evaluating what's important to me and thinking about what I want to accomplish in my life.

Basically, I want a job that will allow me to maintain my upperclass lifestyle without being dependent on my parents. However, I don't really like the people and attitude that comes with wealth. Let's just say that wealthy people aren't really the nicest and considerate people. A recent talk with my "dude" also made me think about my personality. I'm pretty much a hippie at heart. I'm more of a humanitarian than a hot shot lawyer but I don't know what I want to do.

I think my main goal in life is to eventually be able to teach in a village in Cambodia. I want to make enough money to travel the world and be able to do the things I love without worrying about paying the bills, etc.

So basically, my questions are:

How did you decide what you wanted to be? How much did income levels have a bearing on your decision? Are you happy with what you do now and does it allow you ample time and resources to do recreational activities that you love?

Thanks.

-V

[Zydeco]

Alls I can say is dont be come a cook, we get paid jack droppings, but you get lots of time off if you want.Good luck with ever you decide.

[nismofly]

im 18 so im even younger than you, but the way i look at it is if you want to be sort of higher class make sure it will be something you will enjoy. me, im going to be a pilot just for fun, it just so happens that after a few years of building up seniority you can be making quite a bit flying for the airlines

[vicki]

I love cooking and find it to be therapeutic but if I had to do it for a living, I'd be mad stressed and won't enjoy it as much. My dad's owned restaurants. If I ever want to become a chef, I'd just buy my own restaurant.

[gabossie]

Well, for me, I do what I love. Contrary to popular belief, architects are generally not wealthy and always work obsene hours. It's a labor of love. Everything is a matter of priorities. Just do what you love, not what makes you the most money, unless you are one of the many that simply love money, then what you love IS what makes you the most money. Lifestyle is not a direct result of income unless you choose it to be so.

[rydwhite]

Well I have a story that may be of some interest. After my freshman year of college I decided I wanted to be an attorney mostly because the law and politics interested me. Nothing really to do with money even though the money was nice. I wanted to have a job that revolved around subjects I found interesting. I ended up getting a job as a paralegal and after working in the legal environment for 6 years I decided that I did not want to become an attorney. I did not want to invest my life to my clients which is essentially what needs to be done in order to be successful. I worked around attorneys who were putting in 80-90 hour weeks and were stressed too much. I decided that I didn't want to be like that. I wanted to enjoy my life and I couldn't do that being an attorney. I have since found myself a job in a growing medical device company where I can still be involved in law in some capacity and have a much greater carreer path. I enjoy what I do and as extra added bonus' the pay will become much better in time than I could have done as an attorney and I don't have to work 80 hour weeks. So, I am happy on all carreer fronts in that I like my job, I like the potential for future growth of the company and thus my carreer and I don't have to kill myself and be under much stress in order to be successful.

In essence don't follow an old dream becuase it was a dream. Follow your heart and dreams that you currently have. There is nothing worse than becoming an attorney because it was an old dream in order to make the money to sustain your lifestyle and then realize that you are surrounded by student loans that you must pay off that will not allow to just quit and start a new carreer. Material objects and money are nice to have, but they aren't worth it if they force you to sacrifice your happiness. You've got to make yourself happy and enjoy life. Don't get caught in the loop that so many people do.

[GoinBoostYey]

I may not be an older person, but I am almost 21(nov 15 =) ) So here is a thought... Maybe not a corporate lawyer, but maybe a lawyer who does good for a big firm like pro bono cases to help the little guy versus the big guy.

[JESTER]

I'm 28, dont know if that qualifies as older. I work for the government as a 9-1-1 operator and dispatch police, fire, and ems.

I hate my job with a passion. I want to work for myself, but dont have a clue doing what. I find that there are so many adults, far older than me that still dont know what they want to do for a living for the rest of their life.

Has to be some kind of genetic draw back. To be my age, and have no ideal which way to go.

So Vicki, if you figure this one out, let me know. The best advise I can give anyone is stay out of debt. so when you figure out what you want to do, you wont be tied into a job and unable to quit for fear of debt.

[AZhitman]

I think that in today's economy, it's not so much "what you want to be when you grow up" but where life simply leads you.

I graduated with a degree in Psych/Crim Justice with intentions of working for the Feds as a profiler or negotiator. Worked all through college in the mental health field in a Psych ER. Come to find out just before graduation (way too late) that the Feds want accountants and biz majors. Nice.

So I find myself stuck in a rut in mental health, working as a case worker and then a sup of a clinical case management team. Lots of "do-gooding", very little reward.

I go back for my Master's in Crim Justice Admin and find myself responsible for the oversight of all the Probation Dpeartments in the state. Good gig, but again - lots of effort, little reward (hard work + beauracracy = no change).

Long story short, i find myself working as a Special Investigator and running a successful Internet forum for some kickass people. How did I get here? No clue. But I like to think I'm making a difference. Not getting rich, still leading a lower-middle-class existence, but happier than ever.

Go figure.

Guess I'll figure out what I want to be when I grow up WHEN I finally grow up.

[HashiriyaS14]

Speaking of law, I had an interview at Latham & Watkins yesterday.

No, not for associate, it's in their finance department, I'm only 23 with no law degree. I may try to weasel my way into actually doing law there someday. If so, hello R-34!

Sorry to jack your thread;)

In other news, their summer associates (one step up from interns) get $2,400/WEEK. Nuts huh?

[NY94J30]

Well I have a story that may be of some interest. After my freshman year of college I decided I wanted to be an attorney mostly because the law and politics interested me. Nothing really to do with money even though the money was nice. I wanted to have a job that revolved around subjects I found interesting. I ended up getting a job as a paralegal and after working in the legal environment for 6 years I decided that I did not want to become an attorney. I did not want to invest my life to my clients which is essentially what needs to be done in order to be successful. I worked around attorneys who were putting in 80-90 hour weeks and were stressed too much. I decided that I didn't want to be like that. I wanted to enjoy my life and I couldn't do that being an attorney. I have since found myself a job in a growing medical device company where I can still be involved in law in some capacity and have a much greater carreer path. I enjoy what I do and as extra added bonus' the pay will become much better in time than I could have done as an attorney and I don't have to work 80 hour weeks. So, I am happy on all carreer fronts in that I like my job, I like the potential for future growth of the company and thus my carreer and I don't have to kill myself and be under much stress in order to be successful.

In essence don't follow an old dream becuase it was a dream. Follow your heart and dreams that you currently have. There is nothing worse than becoming an attorney because it was an old dream in order to make the money to sustain your lifestyle and then realize that you are surrounded by student loans that you must pay off that will not allow to just quit and start a new carreer. Material objects and money are nice to have, but they aren't worth it if they force you to sacrifice your happiness. You've got to make yourself happy and enjoy life. Don't get caught in the loop that so many people do.

I find it curious, as someone that is attending law school, that you have the tradiitional limited conception of attorneys. The profession of attorney is not limited to those that work in large private firms - or even those that appear in the courtroom, for that matter. In fact, the largest firm in the world is the JAG Corp, and they aren't working 100 hour weeks, grinding for billable hours. There are myriad opprortunites with a JD - as you obvioulsly know - that do not require being locked into the corporate lifestyle, yet still allow you to be an attorney. Ultimately, I think that it often comes down to the public/private distinction.

However, though the money is typically quite a bit less in the public/public interest realm, the experience is invaluable, and upward mobility - if you are so inclined - in the private sector can be aided by an initial stint in the public sector. That is to say that after 3-5 years of tangible experience makes one a far greater asset than 3-5 years of document examination and brief writing on the partnership track.
Modified by NY94J30 at 1:19 PM 10/28/2004

[nsrZ32]

Well I'm not exactly "older" but I am most likely older than a good portion of the members on here.

I had wanted to be a teacher since I was little. I have always thought it would be a great job and in substitute work while going to college for it I absolutely loved it. The fact that my Dad was a teacher probably also had something to do with it.

Regardless, one of my best friends who is a couple years older than me, graduated with a teaching degree for highschool (like I wanted to) and 2 years into it got accused by some girl of fooling around with her. Now he didn't do anything, he's not that kinda guy and he's engaged. Anyways, he went through lots of stress and drama and lost his job even though nothing was proven. They let him go as part of a "cost saving cut." So that put a huge question mark in my mind.

Since I was little I have always loved cars. Well upon much thought I decided to abandon the teaching thing. No money, no jobs to be had, questions regarding the quality of things. So now I am signed up to take classes at OTC to become a ASE Master Technician with specialization in High Performance and Racing. I have zero questions about it, and the pay isn't bad once you hook up with a major manufacturer. I'm ending up with having a real passion of mine as a job.

Money is secondary in life. As long as you have enough to be comfortable you'll be ok in my opinion. Being happy is the most important thing.

[rydwhite]

I find it curious, as someone that is attending law school, that you have the tradiitional limited conception of attorneys. The profession of attorney is not limited to those that work in large private firms - or even those that appear in the courtroom, for that matter. In fact, the largest firm in the world is the JAG Corp, and they aren't working 100 hour weeks, grinding for billable hours. There are myriad opprortunites with a JD - as you obvioulsly know - that do not require being locked into the corporate lifestyle, yet still allow you to be an attorney. Ultimately, I think that it often comes down to the public/private distinction.

However, though the money is typically quite a bit less in the public/public interest realm, the experience is invaluable, and upward mobility - if you are so inclined - in the private sector can be aided by an initial stint in the public sector. That is to say that after 3-5 years of tangible experience makes one a far greater asset than 3-5 years of document examination and brief writing on the partnership track.

Modified by NY94J30 at 1:19 PM 10/28/2004

I agree whole-heartedly with your statements above. There are plenty of other opportunities in life to use a JD. Those other opportunities can open up many doors that would not have been aforded to someone without the JD and experience. However, be careful with your career path. You do not want to fall into the category of so many other people who are unhappy and stuck in their current situation with no real way to get out.

I have worked as a research and IP paralegal for 2 mid-size firms (30-40 attorneys) in Indianapolis which both coincidentely have gone through dissolutions and mergers with large Indianapolis firms (200+ attorneys). Thus, I do have a bit of a sour taste for the law firm environment. I have worked with many attorneys who are not happy in their work. Actually, if I had to quantify, I would say that 70% of the attorneys I know are not happy. When in such an environment for a lengthy period of time, you start to become somewhat jaded as to the career. I know several attorneys who have left a private practice to work for city and state governmental agencies hoping to find the fulfilment of what was missing from the private sector only to find that they have twice the work and half the pay and are even more stressed out than working for a firm trying to come up with their billable hours.

As for the legal profession as a whole, I have nothing but positive things to say about it. One of the attorneys I worked closely with at the last firm I was with joined one of her clients as General Counsel. She is much happier now than she was working the demanding schedule required by her clients at the law firm. I followed her to the company and became Project Manger and in January will take over as VP of Regulatory Affairs. I am continuing to get my JD and MBA and will apply those in my new position with the company. However, I do not plan to ever practice law. There is a wall in the legal profession. Once you have become an attorney there is really nowhere else to go. You have reached your pinnacle in just a few years out of school. There are of course goals to set such as becoming a partner, managing partner, et al., however, you are still basically doing the same thing at the same level just with more client responsibility and money.

What I was getting at in my previous post was that she shouldn't follow a career path that was once a dream (corporate lawyer) if she is not fully behind it now. There is no need to follow an old dream because it was a dream. The corporate law environment is a tough place and has limited means for growth or escape while a young attorney. Opportunities present themselves later in the cycle. So, do not follow the old dream in order to use it as a temporary solution to maintaining financial well-being unless it is something that has to be done.

Find your true passion and follow it. It may not be the most financially satisfying thing that you could do, but it is such an essential part of who someone is. Career satisfaction is very important. Don't settle. Go out and make your opportunities, don't let corporate society dicatate what you can do. You have to have a dream, a passion and make sure that you make you who you want to be. Make yourself and make yourself happy.

[JDMaholic]

im 18 so im even younger than you, but the way i look at it is if you want to be sort of higher class make sure it will be something you will enjoy. me, im going to be a pilot just for fun, it just so happens that after a few years of building up seniority you can be making quite a bit flying for the airlines

YOU WILL NOT GET A JOB AS A PILOT!!! trust me, two of my roomates, and most of their friends that graduated from Purdue in the past year or are going to in the near future and none of them have jobs. I have to hear them ***** about it all the time. They said not one person in their major that graduated got a related job. One of my roomates fathers was a pilot for I think United so you would think he had an in, but nope. His father just took a 50 percent paycut and was happy he didn't lose his job. Their cutting down on the number of pilots and things are getting computerized, plus military people have more hours in and will likely get hired first. Not to discourage you, but I have seen lots of my friends have the same dream/goal and had near 4.0 GPA's and ended up just wasiting 4 years of their life. Being a pilot isn't as lucrative as it used to be, and getting a job is extremely difficult

[skydragoness]

YOU WILL NOT GET A JOB AS A PILOT!!! trust me, two of my roomates, and most of their friends that graduated from Purdue in the past year or are going to in the near future and none of them have jobs. I have to hear them ***** about it all the time. They said not one person in their major that graduated got a related job. One of my roomates fathers was a pilot for I think United so you would think he had an in, but nope. His father just took a 50 percent paycut and was happy he didn't lose his job. Their cutting down on the number of pilots and things are getting computerized, plus military people have more hours in and will likely get hired first. Not to discourage you, but I have seen lots of my friends have the same dream/goal and had near 4.0 GPA's and ended up just wasiting 4 years of their life. Being a pilot isn't as lucrative as it used to be, and getting a job is extremely difficult

Agreed. My cousin is a pilot for American Airlines, because of the paycuts the company is doing, he's getting paid less than his wife. Which she works as a full-time restaurant manager.

[GEO]

The best job to go into is owning your own Air conditioning and heating business.

[driverdriver]

I won't even give my age. Lets just say while most of you where still being made by your moms and dads, I was partying in the 80's.

After highschool, I went to university, I really wanted to get into a robotics engineering or computer engineering program (all the rage in the 80's, especially after the hit movie "Short Circuit"), but my marks weren't quite high enough, so ended up in a political science program with particlar attention to international development. While in university I completed my Poli-Sci degree and also took some courses in computer science and robotics partly as electives in order to graduate and partly out of interest. Since there werent many conventional jobs in the 80's (unemployment was like 10% or higher), I ended up working for a NGO (non-governmental organization) and I travelled basically all over South America and Africa, doing everything from building wells, building simple water filteration plants, fixing NGO vehicles, to building schools. I enjoyed helping other people and learned a lot of life skills, including negotiation skills, diplomatic skills and patience. I also learned about politics and corruption. Frusterated that my "do good" work wasn't helping people as much as I like, I left, came back home and took some night courses in computer sciences (all the rage in the late 80's). I was kind of discouraged and frusterated by people as a result of my NGO experience.

I was hired by Price Waterhouse Consulting before I had finished my courses. They gave me an excellent salary by 80's standards(I think my good Karma had to do with my salary) and in a couple of years I was able to afford a new Porsche and a downtown condo (I was living the 80's life) as well as pay off my university debts. I kept in touch with my familiy and all my friends since child hood and stayed away from the pretentious people who wanted to be "opportunity" friends lured by my sudden wealth.

I continued working in the IT industry, most of it as a consultant on my own through the 90's. I'm still in the industry. But rather than writing code, I'm on the business end of things. Its career evolution along with a change in my career interests.

I guess life isn't made out if one career, rather many different careers, as we grow old and evolve our careers and interests change. It has basically been like that for everyone I know or grew up with.

Don't worry about the money, do what you like and the wealth will follow.

I still do good deeds, but instead of doing it half the world away, I do it locally in my community.

[base9se]

I am 25 and currently in school to become a Mechnical Engineer. I was a chef for 6 years, still cook at home every now and then. I based my decision to go & pursue an engineering degree because I am a type of person that always like to innovate or redesign things. I love to know how things work. My first love was to become an architect, but it did not seem to challenge me enough. I don't know why. I did not base my decision to become an engineer because of how much it pays. I just love coming up with new ideas. It just comes naturally to me. I am happy with my decision, because right now I am doing a Co-op which i love. I like what I'll be doing when I get out of school.

[Bubba1]

So basically, my questions are:

How did you decide what you wanted to be? How much did income levels have a bearing on your decision? Are you happy with what you do now and does it allow you ample time and resources to do recreational activities that you love?

Thanks.

-V

Hi Vicki. I'm older so I'll take a crack at it. I knew pretty early on that I wanted to be in business, and that's the career path I chose, and it's been rewarding. I was probably most influenced by my father who was an honest small business owner who enjoyed his work, and kept his business from expanding too much in order to have quality time the family. Great role model for me.

Yes, I am happy with what I do now but it took several years of long hours, initially very low pay and a lotta travel to get my career to the point where I can set my schedule to maximize time with my family, and have money for fun vacations and hobbies. I had no money when I first graduated college to do any of the expensive hobbies or travel the way I do now, but you always adjust to your means. I still had fun. Patience and persistence are wonderful concepts.

Pay was irrelevent to me for a first job out of college. Getting experience was my focus. And you'll find that after the first job, your degree will become less important than your work experience. Trust me.

Everyone is different, and you'll find that MANY people end up with successful careers that have nothing to with their college majors. Succeess is really not about money. It's finding something you enjoy doing and get paid for doing it, and balancing that career with family and friends.

Good luck

[JESTER]

Side note:

I have a lawyer friend that makes a decent living. He does realistate. He is a partner for a small local realistate company, and a reserve police officer. Great guy.

You can do so much with a JD. You can get into all areas of buisness. Just think for awhile. The possiblities are endless.