car wont start HELP!!!!!!

[kmckis1029]

I decided to try moving the front grounding point to the bolt under SBD's original point thats on top of the factory grounding... so its "independent" of the factory ground point that "caused his car not to start"

i moved it, let the car warm up and idle... i got a quicker rev and the same smooth shifting...

i know that bolt under the original factory point is basicly the same point, it all connected to that same part of the engine block...

But wht did infiniti split the factory grounding points with two seperate wires in the front of the engine?

it must have some effect or difference for them to do that.

the new point is circled in red... click pic to make it larger...

[SteveTheTech]

I think it would make sense to put that front mounting point ontop of the existing making sure the original ground is still contacting block. If you are going to increase the number of grounds it makes logical sense to have it there anyway.

[kmckis1029]

i left the factory grounds in place... i just moved the SBD grounds below to the screw holding the bracket that holds a coolant hose....

i mounted the bracket on top of SBD's wires, so that the wires directly touch the block and the bracket is on top in it original position. so now its the two factory grounds and SBDs grounds in a triangle.

[smockers83]

So where's the original grounding point with Nate's kit that we're talking about that supposedly doesn't make sense? And the new grounding point is on the black bracket?

[kmckis1029]

yeah i moved mines behind the black bracket to make sure SBD's wires directly touch the block... then remounted the black bracket on top of SBD's wires using his supplied longer bolt... i will post a pic tomorrow what i did.

[kmckis1029]

here is what i changed on the front grounding point... Nate i have to say also that my car is now even more responsive since moving this grounding point behind the black hose bracket...

like i said before i know this is basicly the same point, since its all to the same part of the engine block... but why would infiniti split the two black wires in the first place? might be something to it

All i can say is it improved your grounding kit in my car... here is what i moved...

click pictures to get full view

[smockers83]

Interesting, I have a kit in which it looks like Nate essentially modeled his after that utilizes that same ground point with the two black wires, but with even more wires. Will have to check this out.

[4drmadness]

so are you planning on keepin it this way or going back to SBD'S

[kmckis1029]

im leaving it this way... my car likes it... and its just following suit with what infiniti already did when they split those four black wires into two grounding points...

[Draknier]

Believe it or not i just spent 5 houre's trying to fix my freinds g35 it would crank but not start and its twin turbo, being a ASE certified mechanic i went through every thing, from gas, to air to fuel, and then spent a aditional 2 houres on line till i found this article,. im amazed to say that after grabing his replacement key and putting it in the ignition the car started right up.put the original back in and would just crank again.inserted the spare key again just to be sure and VOLA! it started.so the key losing its magnetic signature should definitely not be over looked

[pfarmer]

I wasn't saying that do not take it that way. Take a deep breathe Nate.

I was curious if there was anything in near or on the steering column that may effect a voltage signal. Something like a key chain RFID tag will alter the transmission of the encoded key signal. I should have clarified.

Maybe not directly related to an Infiniti, but at least one car manual for a competing car has a warning about using a cell phone charger when attempting a start with its keyless system.

Perry

[pfarmer]

I think it would make sense to put that front mounting point ontop of the existing making sure the original ground is still contacting block. If you are going to increase the number of grounds it makes logical sense to have it there anyway.

The issue I see here is the concept of 'stacked grounds'. If you have a stack then you have all of the resistance in the stack. While the resistance is typically minimal for signal purposes it can create a situation of circular currents. A better method would be a grounding block.

Perry

[pfarmer]

im leaving it this way... my car likes it... and its just following suit with what infiniti already did when they split those four black wires into two grounding points...

Think about this as a stack of resisters. If you have 4 wires and the bolt is at the same potential as what it screws in then the top and bottom wires will be at the same potential and the two inbetween will be at whatever resistance the connectors from the top and bottom wires add into the stack. In the case of signal transmission you now have a situation of circular currents. If you split 4 wires to 2 stacks of 2 you minimize this possibility.

However when you go beyond 4 wires you may want to go with something like one of these:

http://www.americanbassusa.com...d=203

This is a better solution then even stacking 2 since in a stack of 2 you can still have a different potential due to the resistance of the bolt. With a block you have the block at the same potential for all connectors applied to the block which can be critical when it comes to signal transmission. Depending on the number of connectors it also may be the cheaper way to go when you add in parts and labor.

Perry

[kmckis1029]

ok so you are agreeing with me moving it?

i didnt want the grounding kit to intefere with the four wires... no other wires that were connected with Nate's Kit where spit off into four wires like that... so it was logical for me to leave it alone and move the wire once i noticed.

I have had no electrical problems to date... and no infiniti tech has said anything bad about having a grounding kit on my g35x... I love my grounding kit!

[pfarmer]

ok so you are agreeing with me moving it?

i didnt want the grounding kit to intefere with the four wires... no other wires that were connected with Nate's Kit where spit off into four wires like that... so it was logical for me to leave it alone and move the wire once i noticed.

I have had no electrical problems to date... and no infiniti tech has said anything bad about having a grounding kit on my g35x... I love my grounding kit!

I have several issues with grounding kits. One is that they typically leave the original grounds in place and add additional grounds without being engineered to take in consideration issues such as circular currents. For signal grounding the ground should be no larger than necessary to carry the current flow, most kits go way beyond this. Most kits used stack grounding and that is a big no-no for the reasons I mentioned above.

Assuming the stock grounds are properly in place some proof of a ground kit doing anything would be to measure the actual grounding they are suppose to provide. In service this would be to measure the current flow through the ground cable, voltage differentials, and resistance differentials with the stock negative to the battery lifted.

When I look at the 2 sets of 2 the reason to me is obvious, avoid the issues with stacking, but to provide as close as possible equal potential grounding without the use of a grounding block which in this case would add cost with minimal benefits.

So yes it is wise to leave these alone, they have been engineered this way.

Perry

[kmckis1029]

wow this is the first time you have agreed with me on this subject

this is a break though!!! (please dont burst my bubble)

[pfarmer]

wow this is the first time you have agreed with me on this subject

this is a break though!!! (please dont burst my bubble)

Only in so far as we are speaking of the stock wires.

Perry

[kmckis1029]

well ill take it!!!!!

[pfarmer]

well ill take it!!!!!

One thing I am looking at is getting a LCD oscilloscope, they have come down to where they are almost affordable. I have several older ones that will work, just a little inconvenient.

I am not a fan of these kits largely because I see many design errors in most. One thing to avoid is running a ground that may have circular currents next to a any cable that provides a signal as it may introduce noise into that cable.

Here is an example of one you can hear. You connect up an old 12 AM radio and you have ignition noise. Now you figure well I can provide the 12 plus lead using a coax cable with the outside grounded on both ends since the source of noise is usually the power lead to the radio. Since these addons typically run through the engine compartment you now have picked up all this electrical noise and introduced it to the power lead. Now disconnect one end of the shield on the coax and the issue goes away.

Introduction of noise into an AM radio disrupting your listening pleasure is a whole lot different then introducting noise into a system that controls how the car functions.

To me if you want to 'smooth' out your power flow, I would use the electrical devices that are designed for that purpose. The problem here is that this could be hazardous to your cars health if there are systems designed to instantly shut off when the vehicle is shut down especially without the use of blocking diodes on every connection to the device/module.

This doesn't mean that if you think you have a grounding issue that you should not check this out and fix it. I have seen issues before due to repairs on the car where grounds were compromised. If found replace them with the appropriate size, although often all that is necessary is to clean up the connections. If it is a chassis issue then locate where the ground fails and add as short of jumper ground wire as possible to fix the issue (bonding). For example I have seen headlight issues where the ground was disrupted to the headlight housings.

Perry