Brown Milky stuff on oil dipstick

[mikess]

Today's update: The dipstick was thoroughly cleaned after I took those pictures yesterday, and it seems after doing a little bit of driving yesterday and some today morning I checked again and sure enough some of that white pasty stuff had started to form already. The ambient temperatures here were pretty good, spring like, over 10 degrees celsius most of the day, had to do a few more errands around town, which involved little highway and some in town city driving. Well, to my surprise when I retired the car in the evening and took a look again, there was no pasty stuff on the dipstick. Could be due to the above zero temperatures today or maybe what was left of the condensation is being burned off slowly and it's the end of it. I've decided to wait a fe more days and check again to see if the white pasty stuff returns. If it comes back i'll take more pictures and report back.

[AZhitman]

I'm almost wondering whether it might not be worth it to do an oil analysis. It's not expensive, and it might give you some info that could save you some $ down the line (like, a week after the warranty expires).

[ImStricken06]

I'm almost wondering whether it might not be worth it to do an oil analysis. It's not expensive, and it might give you some info that could save you some $ down the line (like, a week after the warranty expires).

yo boss-man! thanks for swinging in. i believe that was brought up before. i hope your expertise can inspire the OP into acting now, and fast!

whatever the OP decides to do, I'd do it fast. if it is in fact some sort of gasket/seal, its obviously not leaking 'THAT' bad. before it completely fails, thus causing (the image posted below), id act now & fast. get that O.A. asap, so you can hand the service manager PROOF that this is not normal (because you know darn well, they will try the "its normal" routine on you.) you could literally blow a seal any second while the engine is running. and as i have stated before, right now its just a gasket/seal. make it any worse and the dealer will try and blame YOU for making it that much worse. I have seen dealers lay claim that the owner allowed a small problem to become worse, and the dealer will only cover the initial problem.

YOUR CAR IS UNDER WARRANTY, WHY ARE YOU EVEN HESITATING??

[mikess]

Well guys, I've taken your advice and ordered a sample kit from Blackstone Labs. However, I just wanted to update everyone on what's happening. Like I said in the earlier post that when I checked the dipstick last evening the white paste was no longer there. It didn't come back.

Today morning there was frost on everything and it was slightly below 0, however, it got warmer as the day went by. So, since yesterday evening I didn't touch the dipstick and did wipe it off before putting it back in. So, this morning I took some short trips like less than 2kms and then took some longer ones around 5-7 kms. And during those trips the operating temp on the dashboard showed normal, all heated up. Just now, I came home and took a look at the dipstick to see if that white haze had come back and I'm happy to report that the dipstick was very clean. Only nice clean clear oil and no sign of whitish haze or paste.

Now, this has also gotten me thinking, that I had never had such a problem and my driving patterns were the same (very short trips). I was trying to think when and why this started to happen. Even after third oil change done at the stealership, it wasn't immediately like this, however, I did know that they had overfilled the oil by a bit maybe a quart at the most. However, it wasn't causing any brown milky oil condition. This actually all started when one day I went to start my car in the afternoon, not the day's first start. And the car didn't start in the usual crank time. Maybe this flooded the system and on second and third try the car didn't start again, eventually I had to do a longer crank and the car finally started. After this occurrence, the first time I checked the oil is when I noticed a brown milky oil residue towards the "full" hole on the dipstick, the oil below that looked fine. So, immediately thinking that it's condensation I took the car on a spirited drive on the back roads bringing it up to operating temperature and doing a couple of wide open throttles. Came back and check the oil and the brown milky residue was gone. After that whenever I checked the oil there was no coffee colored oil on the dipstick but a haze much above the full mark, like the one I showed in the picture. Eventually, a few days later the same hard starting thing happened again. and again I got that brown pasty stuff on the middle of the dipstick. Finally I decided to change the oil and filter, and used full synthetic QSUD and Wix filter. After a few days of driving noticed the oil was clean and clear on the part of the dipstick that you used to read level but a white hazy buildup was happening a couple of inches above the "H" mark on the dipstick, you could say in the middle of the dipstick the part which is way above the H mark, eventually that haze would turn into white pasty stuff. That's when I posted these pics here. Now, since I've changed the oil I've had no problem starting the car and it starts on first try and as I've reported above the white haze/paste that was happening is not coming back anymore, from the looks of it, it doesn't seem like it will come back either.

I'm theorizing that this problem could of been a result of fuel being dumped into the oil due to the failed and hard start. Or I came across some bad gasoline. Another thing that coincides with this whole ordeal is that this all started happening after I started to exclusively use shell gasoline, because I was told it was top tier. So, it could be that the two shell gas stations I was using constantly could of had bad fuel, water in fuel problems.

I will definitely get a UOA done to get a more decisive answer to this, but these are some of my thoughts as to why I had been having this issue.

[mikess]

Also, I did call the stealership and explained to them the issue and they kept saying that they have never seen a head gasket go bad on these engines and it's most likely condensation from short trips, even though I kept telling that the short trips is not a new thing, so, why would it start now all of the sudden. Then they gave me an option to leave it there for diagnosis and if it didn't turn out that and gasket or seals were the problem, I would have to pick up the bill which could easily be more than 200 bucks because they would need at least a couple of hours to diagnose this problem

[rogue12_sl]

I have the same issue with my 12 Rogue. I am very anxiously looking to see what you can find as I also live in Toronto area. I just did an oil change with Pennzoil Platinum and a wix filter. My wife uses the Rogue primarily and each run is just over 6 KM (4 miles). Really hoping the issue is related to short trips, thus not having the opportunity to burn off the excess moisture and gases from the oil.

[mikess]

I have the same issue with my 12 Rogue. I am very anxiously looking to see what you can find as I also live in Toronto area. I just did an oil change with Pennzoil Platinum and a wix filter. My wife uses the Rogue primarily and each run is just over 6 KM (4 miles). Really hoping the issue is related to short trips, thus not having the opportunity to burn off the excess moisture and gases from the oil.

Did you get the pennzoil platinum on sale at CT? They have a sale on the 5 liter jugs with an extra 5 dollar off coupon which brings the price to around 25 bucks including taxes. Please post some pictures of your dipstick if you get a chance. Also, do you get the milky haze/paste on the dipstick the first time you check the oil after some time or is the actual oil on the dipstick creamy/milky?

Another thing that I think might of helped me get rid of this problem ( I checked again today and pleased to say no more pasty dipstick ) is that I started to wipe of the oil from the black rubber o ring on top of the dipstick really well and it could of provided a better seal that way. One theory I had as to why the middle of the dipstick was turning white pasty was that maybe when the engine cooled down after a drive it was sucking in cold moist air from the dipstick tube opening due to the dipstick not making a good seal.

[rogue12_sl]

will take a pic later today. Have been using Mobil one full synthetic since the 2nd oil change for the rogue but wanted to use a different brand this time around. I actually got the oil from walmart in US and definitely not the one they sell at CT. Was like 21 US when I got it. This can't be related to oil but may be condensation. I always clean the rubber sealer part each time I check oil and make sure it is in place properly. Been doing my oil changes and other DYIs for almost 2 decades and this is the 1st.

Yes, it is the milky haze/paste on the dipstick the first time you check the oil after some time and definitely not when I check oil inside the engine or drain it from the oil pan.

[rogue12_sl]

The situation is really odd and I've been doing a bit of research on this hoping to get to the root cause. I do have "blue" coolant that Nissan calls the "long life" coolant. Both the radiator and the coolant reservoir have no coolant missing from it. If the coolant is leaking from the head gasket, it has to be so little that I can't visually verify. mikess, I'll get some pictures when I get home this evening so you can see how this looks in my situation. I may have to wait for the next oil change to send a sample to do a proper used oil analysis.

I got this Rogue in July of 2012 and really hope I can find the issue, if one exists, before the warranty runs out. Replacing/redoing the head-gasket is a big and an expensive job, if I am not mistaken

[mikess]

I'm not losing any coolant either and I don't see any oil residue under the rad cap either. However, I've heard that there can be coolant or moisture issues due to a cracked head has well, it's been reported previously of people having a hairline crack in the head or block which again might cause this issue.

I've already ordered a UOA kit from Blackstone Labs, and will be taking a sample the next time I do my oil change to see if anything turns up there. Again checked the dipstick today and it was clean and clear of any pasty stuff.

[rogue12_sl]

Thanks. Those hairline cracks are impossible to locate and usually a good radiator sealant can fix them permanently. Never done it personally, but heard from 3rd parties I have to say.

So I came home to take the pictures of the white stuff but could not find any trace of it after pulling the dipstick. It was driven about 4 miles this morning after warming up and did that same mileage back in the evening to get back home.

I did put a band new air filter yesterday as part of my 2 year routine maintenance but that can't affect this I am guessing. anyway, I'll let it run this way and check it over the weekend again to make absolutely sure. Ultimately I will also order that kit so I can do that oil quality analysis to compare notes.

[rcturner]

Take it out and drive it 100 miles. The moisture will probably be gone. It takes at least 20 miles to get the oil up to temp and to start dissipating the collected moisture. This is not an unusual issue in cold climates. Some engines are much more prone to it than others.

[ImStricken06]

Thanks. Those hairline cracks are impossible to locate and usually a good radiator sealant can fix them permanently

do NOT ever, ever, ever use radiator sealant-can fix. that stuff is garbage that only causes more problems. it clogs radiator passages like crazy.

[mikess]

Yeah, don't put anything other than what's recommended in your car. I've never used any oil additives or coolant repair type additives in my cars ever. The only thing I might do is use Gumout Regane Complete fuel system treatment every 10 000 kms. That's it.

[lne937s]

Thanks. Those hairline cracks are impossible to locate and usually a good radiator sealant can fix them permanently

do NOT ever, ever, ever use radiator sealant-can fix. that stuff is garbage that only causes more problems. it clogs radiator passages like crazy.

Just want to add some support to this. When you realize what is in these sealants, it will make a lot of sense. One thing typically found is a solution of fine clay. This clay will get into cracks and clog them. However, it also can coat coolant passages (reducing cooling efficiency) or even clog them (potentially ruining your engine).

The other thing typically found is some kind of silicate (aluminum silicate, sodium silicate, etc.). This will get hot and will basically form glass that can seal small cracks in things like a head gaskets... but you don't ever want it to get past your head gasket and into your oil. In fact, this is the same stuff they used to irreparably destroy engines in Cash for Clunkers.

Basically, if your car has a leak and is worth less than the repair would cost, you can give it a shot as a last resort vs. scrapping it. But the risk is not worth it on a car you wan to keep and the damage from using it may end up costing more than it would have cost to repair the leak properly in the first place.

[ImStricken06]

a lot of these use fine metal shavings. when those wet metal shavings contact oxygen from the crack/failed gasket, it begins to quickly grow rust. that rust can seal the problem... but now you have very rusty gunk flowing through your radiator clogging your radiator lines. its also allowing the water pump to grow rust as well.

[rogue12_sl]

Thanks for the overwhelming support against using the radiator sealant. I actually have never used it in any of my cars ever so thanks again for the info. After the oil change, new air filter and a bottle of seaform in the gas tank, I have not seen any white stuff on mid section of the oil dipstick.

mikess, Before I did the oil change a week ago, my last change was done exactly 5 months ago and did approximately 1600 miles during that time. That was with mobile 1 full synthetic and a Purolator PureONE filter. Fact is, no matter the the total mileage, there is moisture buildup in the crankcase due to short trips. I think if this driving pattern is not broken, I'll have to change oil more often (3 months + time frame). I suspect your problem is the same. I will continue to monitor this and update your thread if I find anything else.

[Qashqai]

The oil cap after the oil change.



Note: no milky stuff on the dipstick, only on the cap.

I brought my own 5 lt oil and they overfilled by putting all 5 lt (I believe). The oil was nearly half inch above the top bended part of the oil stick after I checked it.

I syphoned the excess oil (nearly 400-500 ml), take the level down to MAX hole. Closely watching the condition. I hope the milky stuff will disappear soon...

From now on, I will change my own oil.

[ImStricken06]

i also dump the whole 5qt bottle into my engine. i do 5k oil changes, and with the PCV system taking some oil out, its fine.

plus our engine isnt a high rpm engine - so there is no risk in blowing out seals with an over filled engine.

473ml is only half a qt

[DTASFAB]

A vacationing penguin is driving his through Arizona when he notices that the oil pressure light is on. He gets out to look and sees oil dripping out of the motor. He drives to the nearest town and stops at the first gas station.

After dropping the car off, the penguin goes for a walk around town. He sees an ice-cream shop and, being a penguin in Arizona, decides that something cold would really hit the spot. He gets a big dish of ice cream and sits down to eat. Having no hands he makes a real mess trying to eat with his flippers. After finishing his ice cream, he goes back to the gas station and asks the mechanic if he's found the problem. The mechanic looks up and says "It looks like you blew a seal."

"No no," the penguin replies, "it's just ice cream."

[ImStricken06]

A vacationing penguin is driving his through Arizona when he notices that the oil pressure light is on. He gets out to look and sees oil dripping out of the motor. He drives to the nearest town and stops at the first gas station.

After dropping the car off, the penguin goes for a walk around town. He sees an ice-cream shop and, being a penguin in Arizona, decides that something cold would really hit the spot. He gets a big dish of ice cream and sits down to eat. Having no hands he makes a real mess trying to eat with his flippers. After finishing his ice cream, he goes back to the gas station and asks the mechanic if he's found the problem. The mechanic looks up and says "It looks like you blew a seal."

"No no," the penguin replies, "it's just ice cream."

lololololol

[mikess]

Well Guys, It's back. I just checked the oil today and noticed a little bit of milky coffee colored oil towards the full mark of the dipstick. And now I have another theory on this. My car was in for repair and also, it was quite cold here yesterday, close to freezing temps. I think that this phenomenon is a result of short runs, I'm sure they started and took the car into the garage in the dealership and maybe started it a couple of times for testing which resulted in short time periods and also it was cold yesterday. I'm leaning more towards the cold weather. I think this causes condensation in the oil. Because if it was a head gasket, the condensation would not disappear after a long drive or in warmer weather.

[rcturner]

Take it out and drive it 100 miles. The moisture will probably be gone. It takes at least 20 miles to get the oil up to temp and to start dissipating the collected moisture. This is not an unusual issue in cold climates. Some engines are much more prone to it than others.

Go drive it and get it up to temp. The problem will go away.

[lne937s]

Looks like ethanol/fuel condensation-related to me. While ethanol may be fine for many applications, it likes water and (like all fuel) will get into your oil.

I realize that Canada has an ethanol mandate, but if you can get gas without it (or at least less of it), I would give that a try. Overall, the issue isn't as much with the mandated minimum blend. But if the fuel is left to sit for a while (in your tank or the filling station's storage tank), ethanol will attract water, sink and you can end up with more than stated blend at the bottom of the tank. And some stations blend in more ethanol (which is subsidized and less expensive) and charge you for regular gas.

There are test kits you can try. If you are really concerned about it, try a couple of tanks of E0, which is used for marine and aviation fuel.

[kerrton]

I'm hesitant to blame this on short trips and cold weather. I live in Alberta, Canada and am the king of multiple short trips on my Rogue. I have kids, the school, daycare and my work are all within 2-6 km away and I make multiple stops each morning and after work. We've had terrible cold winters the past few years, and I've never seen even a hint of milky residue on my dipstick. I do run Mobil 1 full synth oil, but regardless of oil type I don't think you should see a milky substance on your dip stick.

But there is a pretty easy test, like was said earlier, take the car on a 30+ minute hard rip, get it good and hot, rev the crap out of it then check the oil after it's sat for 20 minutes and see what you observe. If the milky residue is gone it supports your guess that it's related to short, cold trips.

Looking at the previous picks of the oil change, that is a ton of white crap draining from the oil pan, that does not look good. My guess is there is a slow coolant leak in to your oil, a small amount of coolant can contaminate a large amount of oil and it would take a while to notice a lower coolant reservoir level. I'd try to very closely monitor the coolant res level, which I'm sure you're already doing. It should start to drop soon if you are in fact losing coolant into the oil across a bad gasket.

[Dv8tion388]

Searching online I stumbled across this thread and wanted to add my experience. I run E85 exclusively for years. I take short trip all most 90% of the time. I do let the car warm up to full operation temp every time its started, but still, most miles I put on per trip is generally under 10 miles. I do heat up the oil in many trips because i'm usually testing or tuning, and with a 1,000whp GT-R its hard not to heat up the motor quickly. Lately we've been testing startup once a day. The car idles for around 10 minutes and that's it for the day.
I check the dipstick as I routinely do and its milky at the top as well. I have no loss of coolant or history of over heating. This motor has 9k on a brand new built motor and oil changes are roughly done every 1000-2000 miles. Each time I change the oil I've sent a sample to Blackstone. Last sample was in October; the oil was clean thumbs up all around per usual. Since my discovery last night, I took a sample and Fedex'ed it today to Blackstone. Last night I opened the exhaust midpipe to do some work and I noticed condensation. Car had been off for at minimum of 24 hours. Its in the low 40's to nearly freezing here most nights and mornings with it getting into the 50's/60s during the day. When i drive or idle it, its only in the morning or evening.After a drive, the oil isn't milky, it takes hours to form. My fuel tank, is clean as is my 10 micron post filter. I use Lucas e85 fuel cleaner/stabilizer.
Bottom line, this issue seems to be related more to Ethanol than coolant.Its entirely possible I could have a failing HG, but i doubt it.

~Dv8