BREAKING NEWS: Nissan Skyline Seized

[turbonxsx]

agree

[VandrelSOUSA]

How many people are actually willing to help $$$$$$$?

Its all about dollar$ and $en$e kids. It$ going to take money to fight it. If people are willing to throw some money, then the start of something cohesive can happen, if not its just a bunch of internet nothings... love lists, hate lists.

I have thought about this a lot, a lot longer than anyone else. I know the in's and outs, and things can be done, but it is slow. It is costly.

People don't want to pony up the cash. After all, look at all the places that have gone and copy what Motorex did in regards to import and legalization...all those guys... I mean no one.

Anyone who knows me knows I have had a "thing" for Skylines for many years now. But seriously, now, let's think about priorities. We are trying to reduce the size of government so it can focus on more impactful activities. Compared to reforming the FDA, Immigration, the DEA, and the ATF, for example, I see no value in wasting the government's (and my) money right now to legalize the importation of a car that's set up for left-lane driving and generally only marketable to kids who don't have the money to buy/maintain one in the first place.

Is it a dream of mine to own an R-34 vSpec II? Absolutely. Should it take priority over improving the testing protocols for new oncological medications? No.

To those who are having their ILLEGALLY POSESSED cars seized by the government -- I'm sorry. It's a tragedy. But not because you lost your car -- it's a tragedy that it will be crushed instead of being eligible for me to buy and drive myself 15 years from now. You knew what you were getting in to. You knew the risks. Don't belly-ache over being made the government's b****. Ask anyone who has ever grown "just a little harmless weed for medicinal purposes" and gotten busted. Ask anyone who has come over here from Mexico to work in order to put food on the table for their family. Ask anyone who has gotten a ticket for driving faster than the posted speed limit even though the road was flat, wide and dry and no other cars where anywhere around.

It is what it is. You played a dangerous game and you lost. End of story.

I respect your opinion, however you are comparing apples and oranges. Purchasing a motorvehicle from another person is not the same as growing a well known illegal substance that everyone in the country is educated on daily. Exceeding the posted speed limit while operating a motorvehicle is far different in that you are reminded every 200 yards or so with a sign displaying the speed limit. These simple things are included in your every day life.

You mentioned priorities of the government, yet you seemed to have missed the point that right now the government has made it a priority to spend your tax dollars to collect some cars up off the streets and then auction them for profit, profit that you as a tax payer will never see. Now ask yourself, is that right? Should we all roll over and let "the man" take our hard earned money so they can benifit further off of it? Are you ok with the fact that the government has a budget approved strictly to "get them off the road"? I know I'm not and I will tell you this, when I came to be the owner of my car I wasn't very versed in the laws and regulations of importation like I am today, I wouldn't have been able to tell you what a HS-7 was let alone a bond release but I sure as heck spent my hard earned paychecks from the government on a motorvehicle while on active duty in the Marine Corps and preparing to deploy overseas for combat operations. Should we blame the owners for not being legal-eagles prior to purchasing a motorvehicle that in most cases carried a valid state certificate of title? I'm not sure about you but I don't know anyone that carries a NHTSA cheat sheet in their back pocket so they can quickly research laws and regulations that are mostly absurd and excessive. Much can be argued about individual responsibility but little can be said regarding common knowledge, which is 2 people conducting a sale of a motorvehicle that carries a valid state title.

I see no value in wasting the government's (and my) money right now to legalize the importation of a car that's set up for left-lane driving and generally only marketable to kids who don't have the money to buy/maintain one in the first place.

No one is talking about legalizing anything here. We are not discussing crash testing or anything of the such that would cost ANYONE money other then the people who own the cars presently. It's everyone's right to have a fair trial, though no charges are implied nor expected, we as citizens have the right to challenge the laws regardless of the opinion of anyone. Many people saw last years AZ immigration law as a problem and to be quite honest all of us within SOUSA have a problem with the NHTSA/EPA restrictions.

There is a lot of behind the scenes work going on presently that you do not see or hear about. Do not be so quick to judge and throw people under the bus because you assume conditions are similar to what they have been in the past years. I can promise you that the objective is not to cost the tax payers any money, because quite frankly we pay taxes just the same as do you and everyone else. The big picture was depicted fairly well in the article if you bothered to read it all.

I will say this and I want you all to sit and think about it, when ICE was asked "What exacally is the difference between now and when the car is 25 years old? It's still the same car when it's 25 years old" Their response "You know, the government has some funny rules", not that I completely expected ICE to have the direct answer to that question since I already knew the answer anyways which is.... nothing. Mechanically and technically there's no difference, the only change in the situation is that the government can no longer regulate or "collect" from that vehicle, ie: money. Furthermore there would be no issues if the same motor from said vehicle was installed in a 25 year old vehicle, at 21 years of age the EPA can't regulate the emissions systems but again that doesn't magically make the vehicle any different, it's still the same.

[AZhitman]

Vandrel, first off, thanks a TON for your insight and sharing your situation with the community...

I'm not sure if you're at liberty to say, but I'm curious: Are you currently subject to any legal action, fines, or pending consequences (other than the seizure of your property) as a result of this?

[VandrelSOUSA]

Vandrel, first off, thanks a TON for your insight and sharing your situation with the community...

I'm not sure if you're at liberty to say, but I'm curious: Are you currently subject to any legal action, fines, or pending consequences (other than the seizure of your property) as a result of this?

And thank you for the support

As to your question, nope, nothing, nodda. Strictly a property seizure that if I wish to I can tell them I don't care to bother exporting the 'shell' they seized and that they can destroy it at no cost to me. I'm a consumer caught in the mix.

The main focus and direction of this effort sits in the lap of the government presently, either they want to play ball or they want to try their luck. Bottom line is eventually someone somewhere has to pitch a convincing arguement on why they should continue to receive funding. When the time comes, actions will occur in either directions using all available resources among the vast network.

It is truly amazing when you learn just how far and deep a network within a community stems.

[tyndago]

http://vehicleimport.blogspot.com/2009/ ... es-on.html

EPA

B. (2) Engine not in Vehicle or Chassis

EPA regulates the entire vehicle, not individual parts, for cars, light trucks, and motorcycles. If an engine is not installed, and is to be used in a car, motorcycle, or light truck, it may be imported as an automotive part. No approval or Customs bond is required by EPA. Importers should be aware, however, that replacement of an engine in a U.S. version vehicle with an engine of a different type or model year which is not currently covered by an EPA certificate or will be covered by an EPA certificate prior to introduction into commerce may violate EPA regulations.

The production, sale and importation of automotive bodies alone (i.e., no chassis, engine or transmission) are not regulated by EPA since such units are not considered "motor vehicles" under the Clean Air Act. EPA form 3520-1 is not required for imported automotive bodies. A motor vehicle from which the engine has been removed is still a motor vehicle and is not considered a body.

DOT- NHTSA

A disassembled vehicle that is shipped without an engine and transmission is treated for importation purposes not as a motor vehicle, but instead as an assemblage of motor vehicle equipment items. Such an assemblage can lawfully be imported into the U.S., provided any equipment included in the assemblage that is subject to FMVSS, but was not originally manufactured to comply with that FMVSS or was not so certified by its original manufacturer, is removed from the assemblage prior to entry into the U.S. Equipment items that are subject to the FMVSS include tires, rims, brake hoses, brake fluid, seat belt assemblies, glazing materials, and lamps, reflective devices, and associated equipment.

[Jesda]

I feel so safe. Thanks, trade protectionism!

[Encryptshun]

Vandrel, I acknowledge your points but I won't belabor my position because it would be boring and would just further detract from the thread. But you took the time to post something thoughtful and non-inflamatory and you deserve a response.

1) I am never in favor of the government depriving anyone of life, liberty, or property without due process of law.
2) I would LOVE to see imporation laws around these vehicles de-stricted (once Washington has remove its head from its arse).
3) I agree that the government is wasting money on these headline-grabbing boondoggles.
4) I sincerely wish you had not lost your car.
5) Ignorance of the law is no excuse. You had a car you shouldn't have had and the government seized it. If you'd owned an illegal firearm the government would have seized that too. Ditto if you'd imported some hash from Amsterdam believing it to be legal here.
6) I am all for a private enterprise taking it upon itself to challenge the government (like what MotoRex was trying to do before they stepped over the line) and then being able to reap the rewards for their hard work. If you start a company to do just that, I will VOLUNTEER my time to help you get started.

[audtatious]

I find it relatively retarded that R32-34's and even S15's cannot be imported in this day and age as they are not competing with new models and they are much safer than older vehicles that are on US roads. Maybe the nanny-Gov should go ahead and confiscate all older vehicles that do not/did not have airbags, disk brakes, seat belts, or other safety items implemented when they manufactured?

Pitiful.

[Rev_D21]

America: Land of the Free. If we want to drive Skylines then we drive Skylines. Hey feds, try cleaning your own house before you try cleaning mine! f***!

[Amays U G37S]

I hope to see some offical action and response from government personnel!!!!!

[Didderson]

Show me where to petition and sign. I joined SEMA, do we have a NICO club option or just use individual membership toward lobbying? Lol.
I will follow this story as it pertains to my interests of owning a skyline in the USA. Vandrel, thank you for investing your time and money into something you shouldn't have to for the benefit of (hopefully) all importation enthusiasts!

[AZhitman]

Show me where to petition and sign. I joined SEMA, do we have a NICO club option or just use individual membership toward lobbying? Lol.

Thanks Didderson, good to see the LK getting involved.

Here ya go, buddy:

The SEMA Action Network (SAN) is a nationwide partnership between vehicle clubs, enthusiasts and members of the specialty auto parts industry who want to protect their hobby. SAN was designed to help stamp out legislative threats to the automotive hobby and pass favorable laws. SAN regularly:

Rallies the support of 3,000-plus car clubs, thousands of individual contacts, and 100-plus publications, with an estimated reach of 36 million enthusiasts nationwide, amplifying SEMA’s political voice on issues affecting the specialty equipment auto parts industry.

Sends out action alerts to generate an abundance of responses to state and/or federal legislative actions and regulatory proposals.

Issues timely updates of legislative and regulatory developments.

THERE ARE NO COSTS, FEES OR HASSLES to participate in the SAN. The concept is simple: SEMA provides detailed, regularly updated information on legislative and regulatory issues that impact your hobby. The more hands that touch this information, the more eyes that read this information and the more people that stand up and do something about this information…the more effectively we protect our hobby. If action is required, we will urge SAN members to contact legislators and regulators to express support or opposition to a particular bill or proposal that directly affects the automotive hobby.

The Specialty Equipment Market Association (SEMA), is a non-profit trade association composed of more than 6,800 member companies including manufacturers and distributors, representing the specialty equipment automotive industry. All combined, the markets add up to over $34 billion in retail business annually. On behalf of our industry, we are fighting to preserve the rights of enthusiasts to use and enjoy their vehicles.

United groups of automotive hobbyists are a proven political force. To date, SAN efforts nationwide have resulted in positive outcomes on a wide range of issues, including vehicle scrappage ("clunker") laws, equipment standards, registration classifications, emissions-test exemptions, and hobbyist rights. You can be certain that these issues will continue to pop up at the state and federal level in the future. You can make a difference by joining SAN now!

The information SAN provides you:

Timely notice of legislative/regulatory developments in your state and nationwide trends.
Sample letters to forward to state legislators urging specific action.
Talking points for conversations and meetings with state legislators.

We hope you will join the SAN, which currently has contacts in all 50 states and the District of Columbia. If you would like to become a contact, fill out the SEMA Action Network (SAN) application by directing your browser here. If you have questions about the program or need further information, contact Mike Dingell at miked@sema.org, SAN Director.

[gzrecoil]

Vandrel, I acknowledge your points but I won't belabor my position because it would be boring and would just further detract from the thread. But you took the time to post something thoughtful and non-inflamatory and you deserve a response.

1) I am never in favor of the government depriving anyone of life, liberty, or property without due process of law.
2) I would LOVE to see imporation laws around these vehicles de-stricted (once Washington has remove its head from its arse).
3) I agree that the government is wasting money on these headline-grabbing boondoggles.
4) I sincerely wish you had not lost your car.
5) Ignorance of the law is no excuse. You had a car you shouldn't have had and the government seized it. If you'd owned an illegal firearm the government would have seized that too. Ditto if you'd imported some hash from Amsterdam believing it to be legal here.
6) I am all for a private enterprise taking it upon itself to challenge the government (like what MotoRex was trying to do before they stepped over the line) and then being able to reap the rewards for their hard work. If you start a company to do just that, I will VOLUNTEER my time to help you get started.

I strongly disagree with point 5.

If you register your firearm with the local and state government, you know if it is stolen. Now if you know you are buying a stolen fire arm and don't register it, that is a whole different story.

1. These cars are not stolen
2. These cars are legally registered as Nissan Skylines in their respective states, and they are also legally INSURED as Nissan Skylines. Nobody is swapping 240 vins, these are legitimate registrations.
3. You should not have to be an expert at various over reaching government agencies clashing regulations. There are no rules in black and white, any that are can be interpreted in many different ways. You should not have to be well versed in laws to buy a car that is already confirmed as registered and insurable. In my state at least, that along with inspections and emissions (which these cars pass), are the only requirements.

I do believe these cars should be legal, and I do know that this is outrageous that these actions are taking place with our deficit where it is.

14.9 TRILLION DOLLARS

Divide that by the amount of people who have a job... How much does each person owe to the government if we had to pay it off tomorrow? Or even over 30 years like a mortage...

[chrischeezer1]

Vandrel
I would like to help, anyway i can.
please contact me chrischeezer@hotmail.com lets talk

[skydragoness]

I'm glad the federal government is on this because it means they solved war, poverty, and recession and simply worked their way down their list of priorities.

This is rather ridiculous..

[S13_love]

I find it relatively retarded that R32-34's and even S15's cannot be imported in this day and age as they are not competing with new models and they are much safer than older vehicles that are on US roads. Maybe the nanny-Gov should go ahead and confiscate all older vehicles that do not/did not have airbags, disk brakes, seat belts, or other safety items implemented when they manufactured?

Pitiful.

This is EXACTLY what I was thinking too.

I've seen this thread/article pop up in quite a few different forums (and even in a couple of blogs) so far...

Edit: I take that back...I meant "A LOT,'" not "quite a few."

[AZhitman]

Good deal - Please help us get the word out EVERYWHERE.

The more people read this, the more that will get involved. And we all vote (or at least we all had better vote!)

[tyndago]

You are going to hear me say this a lot.

Money.

The Kaizo owners are more than $15k in, and nothing has even gone in front of the government yet. That is with me contributing a lot of my time to help.

If you want to do it as an actual force, you would need to hire several people, have a lawyer on payroll, and deep pockets. You would be contributing money to a lot of powerful people. You would have a lobbyist pushing your causes. You would be spending a lot of time in Washington DC.

SEMA doesn't care about it, the only people that really care about it, are the owners, RIGHT AFTER THEIR CARS GET SEIZED.

[AZhitman]

Thx Sean, but we disagree on that part.

We were just successful in passing legislation to exempt all vehicles 25 years old and older from Arizona’s mandatory biennial emissions inspection and maintenance program.

SEMA Political Action Committee and SAN are FAR more numerous than Skyline owners, and WAY more vocal.

[EL MAMITO USMC]

What can YOU do to help?

First: GET INVOLVED. Find out what YOUR state's legislators think of this issue.

Second: join us at SEMA's Action Network: http://www.semasan.com/san/join.aspx
NICOclub has been a proud member for nearly 8 years, and they're the ONLY organization that's actively defending our rights as automobile enthusiasts.

Third: Write letters to your local elected officials, and those in Washington. Let them know that we do NOT support their wasting taxpayer money chasing down our fellow law-abiding automotive enthusiasts.

i just joined and im passing down this info on all the forums that im member.. thanks for all the help guys...

[gzrecoil]

A friends r32 was just seized these dirty poopyhead need to be put in their place...

Who?

[proto45]

Just joined SEMA and posted it to my facebook. Posting on IWSTI.com and local forums as well.

[AZhitman]

Great work, thanks guys!!!

Each time we reach out and share this info, it spreads faster than you think.

[turbonxsx]

A friends r32 was just seized these dirty poopyhead need to be put in their place...

Who?

My buddy Who lives in Farmington NM Josh

[Fenris]

14.lots defficit, people want cars...

Any good business man can see an opportunity here.

You can pay money and get a Class 3 license to own a machine gun, why not have a "Grey Market" license.

Pay the Govt 2k/year per skyline, govt gets revenue, people get awesome cars, everyone happy...

Wait... government and smart business never work the same...

[Encryptshun]

My buddy Who lives in Farmington NM Josh

Weird. I actually know a guy who grew up in Farmington.

[turbonxsx]

Really whats the guys name???

[Encryptshun]

Really whats the guys name???

Brandon Rainbolt.

He is a few years older than you and moved to Missouri in probably 1990.

[turbonxsx]

Nope i dont know who you speak of...

[klh6686]

Wow this is amazing, I could understand not allowing you to register it, or forcing you to de-register it. But seizing and saying you can't own one at all? WHAT IN THE f***?!