bang for the buck mods on rb20det..suggestion

[blues14]

ok, once a year, I get to sink some more cash into my rb20 s14. I already have intake, 3'' downpipe and exhaust. what should i do next?my power goal is relatively low,,,, looking for around 220 whp. i am trying to stick with stock turbo and injectors.my ideasFMICcamgears w/dyno tuning ebc w/ dyno tuningfuel management w/dyno tuning?????????

[Yellow4g63]

ok, once a year, I get to sink some more cash into my rb20 s14. I already have intake, 3'' downpipe and exhaust. what should i do next?my power goal is relatively low,,,, looking for around 220 whp. i am trying to stick with stock turbo and injectors.my ideasFMICcamgears w/dyno tuning ebc w/ dyno tuningfuel management w/dyno tuning?????????

220hp get a FMIC and crank the boost to 12psi and you should hit that mark. a AFC wouldn't hurt either anf a FPR. then when you get sick of that go for 300 with a turbo and injector upgrade

[matt_calgary]

well lets see, I have a MBC, FMIC, 3" down pipe, 3" test pipe, 3"RS*R exmag, fuel pump, AFPR. At 13PSI with a boost leak, I made 219rwhp on the mustang dyno. Everything else is stock.

Chances are that if you got low numbers the first dyno run its because your cat is clogged and the stock KA exhaust is crap. I tried a run before, basically same setup minus test pipe and RS*R exhaust and made 140HP on the same dyno but on about 10 PSI. haha who knew the cat and exhaust could free up so much HP!

[themadscientist]

My personal tried and true formula for 250HP RB20 (take note, this is on J-spec 100 octane pump gas).Complete tuneup; fuel filter, plugs, clean coil contacts, remove spark plug valley cover, clean AFM, pipes and TB. Set idle and timing, clean injectors.Full exhuast; muffler, straight pipe, front pipe and tubular outlet.decent FMIC, I can do it with the stock sidemount but you can't get the gas I can, chill out.SAFC and adjustable FPR. The OE 260cc squirts will just support 250HP, tweak the fuel.The stock 20 turbo will support 250HP at about .9 BAR. Above that you are chopping air and accelerating the demise of the turbo. If you can get an RB25 turbo it will do the same job with less stress on the turbo and the response is fine.I have done this basic setup to three seperate RB20s and had a lot of fun with no problems. If you know what you are doing I would bet you could get a daily driven 300HP RB20DET by adding a bigger Garrett T3 turbo and a set of 444cc GT-R injectors to this basic setup. No cams, no metal head gasket. I would expect the RB20 AFM to be running out of ability to measure the air you are moving past this point and it would be a good idea to think about a Z32 one.

[Nameless EJ6]

I see no reason why his original ideas wouldn't net him atleast 220.

Throw in some new spark plugs.

Forget the camgears tho. Kinda unnecessary unless you have aftermarket cams. Just extra bling. If you did use them to make an adjustment on stock cams, it ain't gonna give ya much.

[Wulfgang]

Forget it all and get a *slightly* larger turbo. Same boost, same injectors, no fuel management, and no FMIC needed.

I know you said no turbo upgrades, but seriously, that is all you need, and it could cost less than that FMIC (if you use RB25 turbo). 220 whp is cake with an RB20. You're only looking for about 20 whp. You could also get this just by bumping up boost slightly with a boost controller, but the turbo would give you room to upgrade later.

[rbsileighty]

Forget it all and get a *slightly* larger turbo. Same boost, same injectors, no fuel management, and no FMIC needed.

I know you said no turbo upgrades, but seriously, that is all you need, and it could cost less than that FMIC (if you use RB25 turbo). 220 whp is cake with an RB20. You're only looking for about 20 whp. You could also get this just by bumping up boost slightly with a boost controller, but the turbo would give you room to upgrade later.

I'd do a FMIC for future growth instead of a turbo... Hybridone put down 230rwhp on stock sidemount with 12-13psi with my old motor in his old S14.5... on a mustang dyno I think... he had no converter... not sure what you're running exhaust wise (test pipe or not) as that will make a big difference.

turn your boost to 12-13, FMIC and I didn't see fuel pump and regulator in the mix... if you don't have them... get them.

I agree on the tuneup like the scientist said... but I would throw a new O2 in there as well if you don't know how old yours is...

[blues14]

i do have a walbro 255 fuel pump, and i am running a test pipe. I have never had the car on a dyno, so i dont really know what i am running at currently. I have heard that 190whp is what i could expect with intake and exhuast only. i am really starting to consider the rb25 turbo, but i know the cooler intake air temp from an fmic would make a higher boost level safer. decisions decisions:) I spent 350 bucks on my custom downpipe, so i definately want a turbo that will bolt right up. I am also running at 20 degrees with the auto ecu on my 5speed. i tried running the 5speed ecu after converting, but it runs like crap above 5k on my motor. thanks for your input guys. i just want to be sure my rb s14 is faster than my buds red top s13:)

[gawdzilla]

you wont really be able to take much advantage of cooler intake temps if you can't turn up the boost (due to limitations of your turbo)... imho fmic's are a little overrated, especially if you are going to be adding a lot of piping by keeping the stock crossover intake manifold.

for bang for the buck, i suggest going with the rb25 turbo. they shouldn't be difficult to source either...

then if you're really having heat issues do something simple like adding a spray nozzle in front of your side mount to cool it down:)

[Yellow4g63]

lets not forget about heat soak. That pos smic feels good when the car hasn't warmed up yet. after it dose bye bye power. You should just get your car dynoed so you know what your working with and stop bench racing lol.

[blues14]

i read a post a while ago with somebody saying he could hardly notice a difference with the rb25 turbo over the stock rb20 turbo.

[rbsileighty]

The stock interheater really needs to go for reliability reasons... more or less what yellow said... you'll thank yourself on a hot summer day out on the track

I wouldn't buy a turbo unless you need to... if you can hit your power goal with your stock turbo then stick with it

[blues14]

yah, I suppose i would need a fmic eventually anyways, might as well go in the correct order. Would it be best to find a fmic with in and outlet on the same side? i would love to be able to connect the fmic piping to the existing smic piping.. any fmic sizing reccomendations? I have heard that bigger is not always better with fmic bucause of possible pressure drop.

[matt_calgary]

Yes that is correct about pressure drop and size. This has also been the case with people using the Greddy intake on a stock RB20DET and has resulted in an overall lose in power...just an excuse to get a bigger turbo

Just check out this website comparing Spearco and Griffin:

http://roadraceengineering.com...s.htm

As for the inlet/outlet position, in my opinion, and what I should have done, is to first determine when you plan on upgrading the intake manifold to a front facing manifold, if ever. A top-bottom cooling intercooler would work best if you plan on keeping it stock, same side inlets/outlets. If your thinking front facing manifold, obvious choice is either side.

I have a stock turbo, cooled by a FMIC, with 2.5" piping as the hotpipe, and 3" piping going to intake. Obviously more power means bigger piping. Hope that helps

[blues14]

so with a power goal of 220whp and the fact that i will stick with the factory intake manifold, I wouldn't need some huge intercooler. 2.5'' piping with a fmic core of about 30''w X 9''h about 2.5-3'' thick should do fine. right?

[Carl H]

so with a power goal of 220whp and the fact that i will stick with the factory intake manifold, I wouldn't need some huge intercooler. 2.5'' piping with a fmic core of about 30''w X 9''h about 2.5-3'' thick should do fine. right?

getting a super tall core will HINDER performance as the part of the core thats not exposed to air will essensialy become a large heat sink and will not cool down EVER and you will loose power.you should also remember that the largest intercooler isnt always the best.the core i have is 24l 3.5w 6.5h, and it fits perfectly in the stock s14 bumper location.get a fmic where the CORE (not endtanks) fills up the opening of the bumper that you are going to use on the car, that way it will be efficient and still cool the charge, but not be a parasitic power loss because it cant cool down due to no air movement.

[matt_calgary]

so with a power goal of 220whp and the fact that i will stick with the factory intake manifold, I wouldn't need some huge intercooler. 2.5'' piping with a fmic core of about 30''w X 9''h about 2.5-3'' thick should do fine. right?

Well you need to decide something. Is 220hp going to be your pernament goal? Because if it is, I'd suggest getting nothing at all but a bigger downpipe, test pipe and exhaust with tuning. A cone filter might help a bit too.

However, if logically you want more power then a FMIC is a great start. I agree with the size of Carl H's intercooler and is basically the same as mine. Only thing I've found is thicker is better. 24" wide is perfect for S13 and S14 stock bumpers, I had my cut out a bit wider (s13) but nothing drastic. 5-6ish is good height wise.

Get a Griffin intercooler with top-bottom flow if your staying with stock manifold. Let us know what your thinking, 220 is not a high goal at all.

[RB20DETodd]

i read a post a while ago with somebody saying he could hardly notice a difference with the rb25 turbo over the stock rb20 turbo.

That was me, and the best bang for the buck mod is a manual boost controller haha

[rbsileighty]

Thicker is not better... the air has to much time to heat up by the time it exits the core, so only go thicker if you need to...

The unexposed part of a large intercooler is still working if you don't have it pressed up against the bumper... only so much air can move through the exposed part and the rest will move up the core (and around without ducting) and through the top of the core (again some over without ducting at the top).

Surface area is key... read up on radiators and you will see this in there more than likely. Intercoolers are the same thing... heat exchangers are heat exchangers more or less

A good example of this is look at how many cars today have less than full exposure for their thin, tall and wide stock radiators...

[mugengsr]

the stock intake manifold will handle whatever your going to make with the rb20det untill you open the bottom end up .. im buildint an rb24det for my skyline this winter and am keeping the stock manifold because it is very efficient.. and the stock side mount is fine till your injectors run out of steam anyways ..