Another Pathfinder Stereo Install Question

[skulboep]

I am a proud new owner of a 2002 Pathfinder LE, but after purchase realized that my vehicle's headunit was plagued by the infamous ERR3 problem. Being an audio enthusiast I didn't really care as I planned on upgrading the stereo system anyways.

After doing a thorough google search and reading numerous posts on nicoforums, I've found that most posts deal with stereo installations that involve either 1.) replacing the factory head unit while retaining the existing Bose amps and speakers or 2.) replacing the Bose speakers yet attempting to drive aftermarket speakers with the existing Bose amps. I wish to do neither and am having trouble finding answers to my questions.

I plan on installing a new headunit (Pioneer AVH-P4100DVD 7" DVD receiver), new speakers all-around (Polk MMC6500 components in front and Polk MM650 coaxials in rear) all driven by an Alpine PDX 4.100 amplifier. Because the amp is relatively compact, I planned on installing it in the rear left panel where the rear speaker Bose amp is located.

My primary question involves wiring. When sending speaker wire out from the amp, can I simply splice into the existing factory speaker wires prior to where they run into the Bose amps (the Bose amps would obviously subsequently be removed)? I would still have to run speaker wire all the way up to the front doors (since this is where the Bose amps driving the front speakers are located), but in general would make installation much easier and help me avoid having to completely rewire (and gut) the entire vehicle.

I would appreciate any help/input/advice from anyone who has installed a complete aftermarket system (head unit, speakers and amp) in their vehicle. I would consider myself a beginner-intermediate in terms of car stereo installation but don't really feel comfortable completely gutting or rewiring a vehicle like Injun did in his Pathfinder (on DIYMA forum).

Oh and one last question: how do you get the rear panel off that covers the rear Bose amp?

Thanks in advance for the help, it is very much appreciated!!!

Erik

[TheReplay]

do not know the answer to your question but what what a great topic as i am wondering it too.

Sure anyone can run new speaker wire to every speaker, but who really wants to if the factory wiring is adequate.

I want to do the same as you, run new amp, new HU and new speakers, but i dont want to run new power wire to the amp if i dont have to, or new speaker wiring if the existing is good enough.

All i can tell you is from my research on here its hard to find a definitive answer as most people have either 1: just added a sub 2: just changed the head unit and used other equipment in conjusting with the bose 3: never had the bose unit to begin with.

[mda185]

You really should run new wire from the amplifier to the new speakers. The factory wiring is probably only 18 or 20 gauge and it will have a significant amount of resistance compared to using 12 or 14 gauge speaker wire. If the speaker wire has even 1/2 ohm resistance between the amp and the speaker, you will degrade the control the amp has over the speaker cone significantly. This is more of an issue with 4 ohm speakers than it is in a home stereo with 8 ohm speakers. I will be running new speaker wires from my rear mounted amplifiers to the new front speakers in my install. I will use 14 gauge. Many pro audio installers will tell you to use 12 gauge but IMO, that is overkill.

I am a EE and have been doing my own installs for a long time. I started modifying cars and stereos when 8 tracks were still a factory option.

[skulboep]

Point very well taken about laying the new speaker wire, but one very significant question: How big of a pain in the a** is this in a 2002 Pathy? I (unfortunately) have not done many installs (2 to be exact, neither of which involved laying new speaker wire) and certainly don't feel perfectly comfortable gutting and rewiring the entire vehicle.

[tigwelder]

Hi for me the biggest pain was fishing 14 gauge speaker wire through the rubber grommets in the doors it just takes persistance.I am also using an alpine pdx 4150 similiar to yours and morel hybrid ovation components in the doors.I originally started out with a four speaker system but I was more impressed with just the fronts by themselves I found it to be much better,I have the tweeters mounted in the kick panels.

[chaonis]

I did the work on my 94 300Zx and here is what I did:1. Replaced the head unit, put the amp behind the glove box. 2. replace all the bose speakers with after-market speakers.3. reuse the factory speaker wires and be a happy listener for almost 10 years.

A few notes: 1. Place the amp close to the head unit so minimum rewiring is needed. Plus, the power cord will be shorter, thus less noise on the power input. 2. I am happy re-using the factory wiring since I am not pumping the max out of the speakers anyway. You might want to try the factory wiring first and if you don't like it, you can do the rewiring later. Nothing to lose. Just be very careful about the polarity of the connection.

[skulboep]

tigwelder and mda185,

Where did you guys mount your amplifier (namely the PDX) and exactly how much vehicle "gutting" had to be done in order to lay new wire with your amplifier location? I was initially thinking about the space beneath the rear driver's side panel (where the rear Bose amps are mounted now) but have received numerous recommendations to place it under the passenger seat. I'd prefer to stay out of the rear "secret compartment" beneath the carpeting. After much research and consideration, I think I am indeed going to completely rewire the speakers but want to do this as least invasively as is humanly possible. Can you guys help me out here?

[tigwelder]

My bass amp is where the rear stock bose amp was located and my pdx is in the secret compartment under the carpet.To run speaker wiring I pulled up the door sill plastic ,removed kick panels ,remove both rear plastic interior panels and pull back the carpet where needed.Its fairly straightforward but it can be time consuming the first time,also I mounted the changer in the left rear compartment.Hope this helps

[Empty V]

I putt my sub amp under the carpet in the secret compartment but cut holes and put vents in their place as to hopefully add ventilation. Here's where I put my door speaker amp:

[skulboep]

Empty V:

Love your install, a couple questions though:

1.) Where did you run your speaker wire from the amp to the right side rear and front speakers?

2.) Did you see any need to techflex your wire runs?

3.) Nice work getting the amp into that rear left compartment...it does look a little crowded in there, however, and I'm guessing my skills at fitting even a small PDX in there may be sub-par. Exactly how big of a pain in the a** was the amp install?

4.) Are you running 2 power cables from the battery to each amp or simply running 1 cable to a distribution block that splits into a cable for each amp? If the latter, where did you house your distribution block?

5.) Did you sound deaden your doors? Why or why not?

6.) Any tips for fishing speaker wire into doors?

Thanks again for your help, your install looks great and is very similar for what I want to do.

Erik

[mda185]

1.) Where did you run your speaker wire from the amp to the right side rear and front speakers?

2.) Did you see any need to techflex your wire runs?

4.) Are you running 2 power cables from the battery to each amp or simply running 1 cable to a distribution block that splits into a cable for each amp? If the latter, where did you house your distribution block?

5.) Did you sound deaden your doors? Why or why not?

6.) Any tips for fishing speaker wire into doors?

Sorry I have not been online for a couple of weeks and missed your follow up questions. I know the above is for Empty V but will tell you what I did in case it helps you.

I ran my speaker wires under the carpet. It was easy after I took the front seats out. This is easy to do. 4 bolts hold each seat and the electrical connectors under the seats are easy to see if you tilt the seat sideways after unbolting. The trim panels in each doorway also hold the carpet down. Once these are removed, it is easy to lift the carpet enough to run speaker wires along the side of the car. I did not use techflex on the speaker wires. This is a nice cosmetic thing to do but not necessary.

I mounted my amps in a false floor I built for the rear cargo area. I am using amps that run hotter than the PDX and I felt I needed to build an amp rack with cooling fans. My system is bi-amped up front and will have a subwoofer amp in the future. It is not show quality but it is very functional and that is all I cared about. I can take pictures if you are interested.

I used a fused distribution block. I ran 4 gauge from the battery to the dist block and 8 gauge from the block to the amps. It is housed in the false floor amp rack I built.

I installed sound deadening in my front doors and will probably do the rear ones this spring. It made a significant difference in the ambient noise levels in the car. In particular, it seemed to reduce the higher frequency background noise near the windows. I am guessing that the foam I applied damped noise that was coupling into the windows. It is very hard to measure this but my wife noticed the difference immediately and she was not aware of what I had modified. Sound deadening the doors is also important because it damps out reflections that would otherwise couple into you speaker cones and muddy the sound. That is why I applied a butyl damping layer and a foam layer. The foam is what aborbs sound wave reflections. I have another post on here that describes the sound deadening process I followed.

[Empty V]

Good info MDA

1.) Where did you run your speaker wire from the amp to the right side rear and front speakers?

Under the carpet is a good spot

2.) Did you see any need to techflex your wire runs?

Nope

4.) Are you running 2 power cables from the battery to each amp or simply running 1 cable to a distribution block that splits into a cable for each amp? If the latter, where did you house your distribution block?

1 0AWG wire to a distribution block

5.) Did you sound deaden your doors? Why or why not?

All 4 doors, tailgate and the ceiling, next is the floor. It makes a huge difference in sound quality inside the vehicle and blocking out road noise.

6.) Any tips for fishing speaker wire into doors?

Sometimes wire lube helps but that stuff can get messy.

[ahardb0dy]

"Hi for me the biggest pain was fishing 14 gauge speaker wire through the rubber grommets in the doors"

they actually sell a tool, (2 actually, different sizes, one is big enough to run 4 gauge power cable thru), that is designed for installing wire thru rubber plugs or grommets, my first one the smaller one I bought off of a tool truck second larger one I ordered, they def make life a lot easier.

here is a link to both of them they are called wire insertion tools:

http://www.matcotools.com/Cata...age=1?

[skulboep]

Hi all,

Thanks for all the responses. Finally got a chance to get back to NICOclub after the holidays - with a couple days off I officially began tearing my Pathy apart. Thanks to you all here are my plans:

- Alpine PDX 4.100 mounted under front passenger seat- Polk MOMO 6500 components mounted in front doors and Polk MM651 coaxials in rear doors using custom EFS mounting rings- Tweeters fitted into A-pillars --> will remove factory tweeter grill in pillar and drill appropriately sized hole to fit Polk tweeter- Elemental Designs eDead sound deadener in all 4 doors- Wiring run through center console and under carpet - 14 AWG for speakers, 4 AWG for amp, no distribution block for now, no techflex- Pioneer AVH-P4100DVD headunit in dash (THANK YOU SANTA!!!!!)

So far I have removed rear door panels, front passenger seat, A-pillars, factory radio and center console. Managed to crack my center console on removal as I neglected to notice a hidden screw and pulled a little harder that I probably should've - the console is currently in the basement under clamps being glued. Let me know if you guys see any issues with my installation plans or ideas - I've tried to base them off of the advice that I've gleamed from this thread and others on NICOclub. Any other suggestions/tips/criticism is of course greatly appreciated.

Lastly, the only piece of equipment that I haven't purchased as of yet is the PDX 4.100 amp. After seeing these units sold for as low as $260 on Amazon, I take issue paying full retail at $499. I know that Amazon's distributors (Pacific Stereo and Audio Online) aren't "authorized" resellers, but they do include 1-year warranties. Has anyone had any issues with these retailers or any other "unauthorized" internet retailers? I've heard horror stories about places scratching off serial numbers and not accepting returns, but figure that any place that sells through Amazon has to be at least half-way legit. Let me know if you guys have any experience in this arena.

Thanks again and very happy holidays.

Erik

[WINNIPEGS_MOST_WANTED]

Hey bro, looking forward to pics!

The HU will look great; I've got the 3100 in mine:http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2551558/3

Don't forget the toggle switch so you can watch while you drive

[Empty V]

Hey bro, looking forward to pics!

The HU will look great; I've got the 3100 in mine:http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2551558/3

Don't forget the toggle switch so you can watch while you drive

Why would he need a toggle switch, just perform the bypass.

Billy

[WINNIPEGS_MOST_WANTED]

I thought the HU had a short sleep built into it, so that the bypass would need to be toggled on/off after the vehicle has been started. Now I will have to test this with my setup...

[Empty V]

I thought the HU had a short sleep built into it, so that the bypass would need to be toggled on/off after the vehicle has been started. Now I will have to test this with my setup...

I'm not sure what the short sleep is but the bypass should be permanently on. It tricks the deck into thinking that the parking brake is on which enables the DVD player and ability to change nav settings. I did this on my AVIC-D3, AVIC-z3 and my buddy's AVIC-F900BT. I'm guessing it's the same for all of their DVD/Nav decks but I could be wrong.

Billy

[skulboep]

I definitely plan on bypassing the parking brake for my AVH-P4100. No toggle switch is necessary, just a simple relay from an auto parts store. Here's a youtube link showing the mod:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8HCcNy9QQQ

I plan on taking some pics the install during the process and at completion. I am considering starting a separate thread detailing the build (will post the link here if that's the case).

WINNIPEGS_MOST_WANTED: How did the AVH-3100 fit in your dash opening? Did you have to use the included plastic frame to get it to fit right? After eyeballing the unit, it appears to be a little small to fill the 2002 Pathy dash opening. I trial fitted the black plastic frame around the 4100 and it doesn't fit as snuggly as I would have hoped.

Any other recs for where to buy the Alpine PDX 4.100? I want to save money but don't want one that has a missing birth sheet or the serial number scratched off. Perhaps this is asking too much?

[WINNIPEGS_MOST_WANTED]

Yes I did use the trim. There was a 1 maybe 1.5 mm gap on each side of the HU without it. The trim itself doesn't fit snugly. I positioned the trim where I wanted it and used double sided tape to hold it to the HU during the install. Once the dash is back together there is enough pressure from the Pathy's dash that the trim won't move.