a little confused on the crank collar issues...

[johnzm]

alright i have searched and searched.

i have come to some conclusions based on recent and past threads, i am still confused to as t mine would have this issue or not

i have an RB20the FAQ at the top does not mention anything but the very early ones as having the issues

carlH in another thread mentioned that if the timing cover has the RB20 stamp on it, that it most likely will have the problem. does that mean that timing covers without that stamp are going to be ok?

the FAQ at the top also mentions nothing of the RB25 having the problem, but one of the threads i saw actually had a picture of an RB25 crank that was fixed.

i also read that it was a recall in the 93.5 year. does that mean that mine could have possibly already been fixed by nissan?! does anyonwe know if they do bearings and stuff while they fix it? and is there any wayt o tell on the outside of the block if the service has been done?

it looks like my car has a H2 stamp on the vin tag (i guess its an 89 then?) so "theoretically" it should have the problem, unless the covers are a clear indication of if it does or dosent.

also is the oil pan just permatexed on or am i going to have to replace a gasket when i take it off?

thanks alot guys for any input u have

[gawdzilla]

The information as to whether or not the crank collar problem exists is definitely NOT written in stone. The best way to find out is to take off your timing belt, drop the pan, and pull the oil pump.

As far as I know, there is no Nissan recall for the oil pump. All the solutions I have seen have been aftermarket. Since RB20 motors are the earliest motors along with the 26, I would assume yours would have the bad collar.

If your crank is hurt, it is VERY obvious upon first glance.

This is not hard if you are planning to do the regular swap maintenance, such as water pump, new timing belt, etc.

The oil pan on all RBs is a liquid gasket, aka RTV/permatex/nissan orange goop- you pick. If you pull the pan, just redo the gasket with one of those and bolt it back on.

[Acuratechva]

double post sry
Modified by Acuratechva at 6:00 PM 1/31/2006

[Acuratechva]

As far as I know, there is no Nissan recall for the oil pump

so oil pump is what causes this? can it be fixed by replacing it?

when i searched only solution on RB26s i saw was replacign teh collar

so there is no way to find out ahead of time before buying an RB20?

is there any way to tell by the vin plate like this?

[Carl H]

fwiw ALL rb20's have the short crank issue, for most its not a problem but for those of us revving past the stock redline or at high hp levels tis a good idea to get the crank collared.from what ive read and researched all r33 and up rb26's have fixed cranks to cope withthe problem along with a redesigned oil pump to suit.rb25 s1 motors are affected but not the s2 motors (subjective as there are s1.5's out there....).but like mentioned above best bet is to drop the pan pull the pump and take a look at the drive, if its no more than say 5mm of engagement on the oil pump then its a short drive it should be obvious if it is or not.

[Kansei240sx]

Most people just replace the pump with an N1, which mildly solves the problem, and if you get alot of money you get either the trust or JUN oil pump, the collar isnt so much the problem as its the gears in the stock unit, The gearing in the JUN and Trust oil pump, or even the N1 pumps more OIL than the stock unit at higher RPMs so there isnt so much starvation of oil. Racing teams have been doing this in japan for years, instead of modifying the crank, the OIL pump is replaced to one with a more stable and higher output of oil pressure, and oil output. Such as with the TRUST AND JUN.

[Carl H]

Most people just replace the pump with an N1, which mildly solves the problem, and if you get alot of money you get either the trust or JUN oil pump, the collar isnt so much the problem as its the gears in the stock unit, The gearing in the JUN and Trust oil pump, or even the N1 pumps more OIL than the stock unit at higher RPMs so there isnt so much starvation of oil. Racing teams have been doing this in japan for years, instead of modifying the crank, the OIL pump is replaced to one with a more stable and higher output of oil pressure, and oil output. Such as with the TRUST AND JUN.

almost but not quite.the n1 pump is not the end all be all fix for oiling issues.the problem is that using a short snout crank on any rb oil pump it can slip and destroy the gear regardless, putting the n1 pump on will not solve that problem.also using a pump designed for a 'long snout crank' on a 'short snout' one can cause the pump to break even faster.the n1 pump raises the pressure but does not increace flow, it has teh same flow as a std rb26 pump, only reason you would drop it on is to get better oil pressure and what not.if you are going to use an n1 pump idealy it needs to be used on a long snout crank or a short snout one that has been collared or extended, either way its not a good idea to drop one on and go.lots of discussion on this one topic on skylinesaustralia, look for yourself.

[BoostFab]

absolutely, regardless the oil pump upgrade, the crank driver still an issue. if you guys rev past the factory redline all the time like when you're auto-x, consider having the crank modified or installation of an aftermarket collar. my last rb20 was driven hard and hangs out at redline pretty often and it was fine for years and still drives fine up until today.

and from the look of things, you guys probably melt a piston before you would break the oil pump gears.

[Acuratechva]

ok someone please tell me if i understood this correctly.

Crank COllar issue actually becomes an issue in racing habitat , but for a daily driven car that sees factory redline every now and then (for me at least once a day) this is nothing i need to worry about.

And to solve / upgrade this i need to remove factory crank collar and press in an aftermarket unit from places such as Takakaira.com

am i correct on most of this?

EDIT: i jus looked on and they only sell collars for RB26!!! what do i do and where do i get one for rb20 anybody know
Modified by Acuratechva at 2:41 PM 2/1/2006

[BoostFab]

really, if you keep the revs within factory limits you shouldn't have an issue...

factory crank doesn't have any colar, the oil pump assembly just fits over the oil pump drive aka "snout".you can send your crank to crankshaftspecialist.net and they'll extend the snout for you. this is the idea of an aftermarket crank-collar, you still need machining of the crank to fit an aftermarket collar.

[Carl H]

ok someone please tell me if i understood this correctly.Crank COllar issue actually becomes an issue in racing habitat , but for a daily driven car that sees factory redline every now and then (for me at least once a day) this is nothing i need to worry about.And to solve / upgrade this i need to remove factory crank collar and press in an aftermarket unit from places such as Takakaira.com am i correct on most of this?EDIT: i jus looked on and they only sell collars for RB26!!! what do i do and where do i get one for rb20 anybody knowModified by Acuratechva at 2:41 PM 2/1/2006

yeah you've the right idea for sure.basicaly if you are going past factory redline or the car will be seeing lots of rev changes its a good idea to do it while the motor is being redone.as for the crank collar bit the jun collar will work on ANY rb motor, same fitment as the rb26.if you wait a bit i will be starting a group buy on some australian made collars that are the same fit and finish as the jun ones but at a reduced cost compared to the jun units.more info will be posted when i get my collar on it and how you can order one.carl

[Acuratechva]

thanks for the info guys.

Carl, when will you be starting that GB? i got a short time span i need to get my rb done withing 6 weeks bc thats how long person wanting to get my engine is willing to wait so the clock is kicking my ***

[jdmser]

Totally post up when the gb starts I'm pulling the motor out soon to do this. I never even hit my rev limiter. Missed the whole drag season last year. I'm ready to get this done.

[Reignman]

Carl,

I would be interested in these collars also. I just pulled off the oil pump and found this. Notice the nice crack running down the collar on the oil pump. At least it looks like the crank is ok.

[Reignman]

Heres what the inner rotor on the oil pump looked like.

[Carl H]

holy crap, i'd heard of it happining but thats BAD.i will see about getting the gb started here this week, proly will run a short stint (week or so) and then if all goes well then perhaps a 2nd one will go thru.thanks for the pics tho.

[Phat_Optimo]

Send them to Crankshaft Specialist. I got a job there about a month ago. That is my crank in the picture above. We can do more than fixing the snout. We also knife edge, shave the couterweights, chamfer oil holes, straightening, balancing, polishing, and if you spun a bearing we can even fix that. Hopefully I can get mine finished this week and get some pics up. Its going to be nice.