A "Case" in point on "COVID deaths"

Post by **PalmerWMD** » Thu Dec 17, 2020 2:51 pm

https://www.ericpetersautos.com/2020/12 ... -in-point/

From EPautos:

Automotive News has published a piece about the death of Pennsylvania car dealer owner Jack Thompson of old age – at the age of 89 – which was headlined “Due to COVID-19.”

This “case” highlights much that is wrong – with malice, deliberately – about the way “cases” are tabulated.

While Thompson’s death is sad, it is not aberrant. Eighty-nine-year-old men tend to die Because they are eighty-nine.

Not “Due to COVID-19.”

It is one of the several pathologies of our time – of this year – that the death of a man almost 90 is taken as unnatural. As cause for outrage.

A year ago, the death of an old man would have been taken as natural. Old age tending to result in death.

If you could separate out the deaths of every person over the age of 80 that occurred this year from the COVID-19 Count, you would find that almost no one has died from unnatural causes this year.

It is perhaps true that “COVID-19” was the straw that broke the camel’s back – but there would have been other straws, absent “COVID-19.” The very elderly aren’t imperiled just by “COVID 19.” They are imperiled by practically everything because they are elderly. It inheres in the condition.

Have a look at the actuarial tables. At the projected chances of death of anyone who is more than 80 years old, over the course of the next 6-12 months. Not from “COVID-19.”

From old age.

Almost all the deaths “due to COVID-19” are due to old age, usually compounded by other infirmities that all by themselves tend to result in . . . death.

When my 84-year-old mother dies I will be sad – but not shocked or even surprised. Because she’s 84.

Not 54.

Few seem to want to want to discuss – let alone accept – the inevitability of our mortality but it is time to end the delusion that we will live forever and that the death of anyone almost 90 is other than a natural occurrence, like the leaves turning brown and falling to earth each fall.

It is sad when an elderly person succumbs to old age. But it is part of life. Just as getting sick used to be.

That it has become cause for shutting down life is a measure of the sickness afflicting America.

The average life expectancy of a man is about 82 years. Thompson lived seven years beyond the expected. He had a good – and very long – life. Characterizing his death as “due to COVID” is a lot like characterizing the turning of the leaves from green to golden and then brown in the fall as being “due to maleficent spirits.”

Which is precisely what we are dealing with.

The evil people who are terrorizing the public over “the virus” are the Julius Streichers of our time. Instead of Jew-baiting, sickness-baiting. Blame everything on “the virus,” including inevitable, natural deaths. Foment anger at people who aren’t willing to literally play along – by wearing absurd religious vestments and performing bizarre rituals – imputing to them a callous disregard for life – the ne plus ultra of gaslit morality inversion.

Jack Thompson did not die in the prime of life. He died at the end of his life. Just as the widow of astronaut John Glenn also died at the end of her natural life at the age of 100.

Of course, obits characterized her death as “due to COVID” as well.

How much longer does the circus stay in town?

Post by **VStar650CL** » Thu Dec 17, 2020 7:26 pm

Very -- very -- well said.

But -- don't get me started on the "whys" for the Feds sitting on kilotons of monoclonal antibodies (free for the asking!) that hospitals for some reason won't request and use to treat early. Or Ivermectin, which has stemmed the spikes in whole countries when used to treat early. Yet doctors here continue telling patients to go home and quarantine and get "sick enough" before we treat them. Small wonder our death rates are higher at the moment than many places in the third world, and they would likely be higher even without the bogus numbers. Lots of 89 year olds are being "statistically used", yes, but at least some of them shouldn't be dying for another year or two, if we would medically un-constipate ourselves and use what we know to work, early and often. I know the politics is poisonous, but is that a reason for malign neglect? Is there a Hippocratic Oath that means anything, or isn't there? For that, to my thinking -- I might add, the thinking of a conceivably-vulnerable 66 year old -- for that I see no excuse.

Post by **Rogue One** » Thu Dec 31, 2020 4:54 pm

Mysterious Disappearance of Flu in San Diego Prompted Call for Audit of COVID Records
As it turns out, recorded seasonal influenza cases have literally nosedived by 98% across the globe.

This improbable phenomenon has led a number of experts to ask, “Has Covid killed off the flu?”

Minnesota legislators say COVID-19 death totals have been inflated in their state, call for an audit
Two Minnesota state representatives are calling for a national audit of the published coronavirus death totals nationwide, claiming that the figures have been inflated by including individuals who died of obviously non-illness related reasons (like car crashes) after they had a positive test for the novel coronavirus.

Post by **VStar650CL** » Thu Dec 31, 2020 5:39 pm

Rogue One wrote: ↑
Thu Dec 31, 2020 4:54 pm
Two Minnesota state representatives are calling for a national audit of the published coronavirus death totals nationwide, claiming that the figures have been inflated by including individuals who died of obviously non-illness related reasons (like car crashes) after they had a positive test for the novel coronavirus.

Why on earth are we surprised? Do I need to suggest to anyone, "Follow the money?" There's free $fed and $state for anything and everything that says "COVID". My wife is a hospital IA, she tells me that except employees, they haven't given a flu shot on her floor in weeks, or run a flu test. Pretty obvious why. There's no money in flu prevention or treatment. Now that we've created a "black market" for COVID diagnoses and treatment, I won't be a bit surprised if the next step is COVID Al Capones. That is, if we don't already have some in DC and certain state capitols. Ugh!

Post by **telcoman** » Fri Jan 01, 2021 7:32 am

VStar650CL wrote: ↑
Thu Dec 31, 2020 5:39 pm

Why on earth are we surprised? Do I need to suggest to anyone, "Follow the money?"

No surprise here.
This is a predictable result of giving unwanted, unneeded tax cuts to the wealthiest Americans (Socialism for the Rich) sharply increasing the national debt, and a failure to properly confront the worst pandemic in a century.
Huge job losses, long food lines,falsely claiming Covid 19 was a hoax, promoting a useless drug (Hydroxychloroquine) (https://www.drugs.com/hydroxychloroquine.html), a incompetent and unqualified president telling people to try injecting bleach, a failure to follow science, and now you are worried about vast numbers of Americans trying to stave off bankruptcy due to the failure of our present government trying to repeal the ACA and deny proper healthcare to all Americans.

I'm not surprised!
I see better days on the horizon in another twenty days.

Current US cases 19975978
Current US deaths 345844
Source Johns Hopkins/NBC News

Post by **VStar650CL** » Fri Jan 01, 2021 8:05 am

telcoman wrote: ↑
Fri Jan 01, 2021 7:32 am
This is a predictable result of giving unwanted, unneeded tax cuts to the wealthiest Americans

Oh, yeah, tax cuts cause cancer too. News flash, greed knows no party.

Post by **Rogue One** » Sat Jan 02, 2021 11:08 am

We Had the Vaccine from the Start—You Just Weren't Allowed to Take It
The vaccine, a triumph of medical science known as mRNA-1273, was designed in a single weekend, just two days after Chinese researchers published the virus's genetic code on January 11, 2020.

Post by **telcoman** » Sat Jan 02, 2021 12:14 pm

Rogue One wrote: ↑
Sat Jan 02, 2021 11:08 am

We Had the Vaccine from the Start—You Just Weren't Allowed to Take It
The vaccine, a triumph of medical science known as mRNA-1273, was designed in a single weekend, just two days after Chinese researchers published the virus's genetic code on January 11, 2020.

Too bad we don't have a president that knows how to organize an orderly Federal distribution and a nationwide vaccination program. Trump has surrounded himself with those that will praise him but are as incompetent as he is.

Current US cases 20205931
Current US deaths 348617
Source Johns Hopkins/NBC News

Post by **VStar650CL** » Sat Jan 02, 2021 12:32 pm

telcoman wrote: ↑
Sat Jan 02, 2021 12:14 pm
Too bad we don't have a president that knows how to organize an orderly Federal distribution and a nationwide vaccination program. Trump has surrounded himself with those that will praise him but are as incompetent as he is.

Is there any subject you won't turn into an excuse for political mud-slinging? Give it a rest.

Post by **telcoman** » Sat Jan 02, 2021 3:09 pm

VStar650CL wrote: ↑
Sat Jan 02, 2021 12:32 pm

telcoman wrote: ↑
Sat Jan 02, 2021 12:14 pm
Too bad we don't have a president that knows how to organize an orderly Federal distribution and a nationwide vaccination program. Trump has surrounded himself with those that will praise him but are as incompetent as he is.
Is there any subject you won't turn into an excuse for political mud-slinging? Give it a rest.

The subject is Covid deaths and a president that is incapable of dealing with the sharply increasing infections and deaths now at a rate of a death every 10 minutes.
The rest will come in another seventeen days when Trump is out of office

Current US cases 20350019
Current US deaths 349625
Source Johns Hopkins/NBC News

Post by **VStar650CL** » Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:57 pm

Give it a rest, please.

Post by **telcoman** » Mon Jan 04, 2021 10:37 am

VStar650CL wrote: ↑
Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:57 pm
Give it a rest, please.

Rest time and recess is over!

telcoman wrote: ↑
Sat Jan 02, 2021 3:09 pm
The subject is Covid deaths and a president that is incapable of dealing with the sharply increasing infections and deaths now at a rate of a death every 10 minutes.

I need to make a correction

The rate of Covid deaths of one every 10 minutes was for the state of California.

The rate of Covid deaths in the entire United States is approximately one per minute and over three thousand per day.

What are Trump and his flunkie Pence doing about this pandemic? Pence appears to be hiding and Trump is attempting to urge the secretary of state of Georgia to commit election fraud.
Sad!

Current US cases 20649941
Current US deaths 351774
Source Johns Hopkins/NBC News

Post by **Rogue One** » Mon Jan 04, 2021 11:07 am

telcoman wrote: ↑
Mon Jan 04, 2021 10:37 am

VStar650CL wrote: ↑
Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:57 pm
Give it a rest, please.
Rest time and recess is over!

telcoman wrote: ↑
Sat Jan 02, 2021 3:09 pm
The subject is Covid deaths and a president that is incapable of dealing with the sharply increasing infections and deaths now at a rate of a death every 10 minutes.
I need to make a correction

The rate of Covid deaths of one every 10 minutes was for the state of California.

The rate of Covid deaths in the entire United States is approximately one per minute and over three thousand per day.

What are Trump and his flunkie Pence doing about this pandemic? Pence appears to be hiding and Trump is attempting to urge the secretary of state of Georgia to commit election fraud.
Sad!

Current US cases 20649941
Current US deaths 351774
Source Johns Hopkins/NBC News

Howie, absolutely nothing you've stated here is true.

Post by **VStar650CL** » Mon Jan 04, 2021 1:27 pm

Rogue One wrote: ↑
Mon Jan 04, 2021 11:07 am
Howie, absolutely nothing you've stated here is true.

Since my "party" is common sense and I detest partisan BS and partisan propaganda about equally, I was trying, very politely, to not have to point that out. Now that it's been pointed out anyway, I'll return to not pointing it out.

Give it a rest, Howie. Please.

Post by **telcoman** » Mon Jan 04, 2021 1:39 pm

Rogue One wrote: ↑
Mon Jan 04, 2021 11:07 am

telcoman wrote: ↑
Mon Jan 04, 2021 10:37 am

Rest time and recess is over!

I need to make a correction

The rate of Covid deaths of one every 10 minutes was for the state of California.

The rate of Covid deaths in the entire United States is approximately one per minute and over three thousand per day.

What are Trump and his flunkie Pence doing about this pandemic? Pence appears to be hiding and Trump is attempting to urge the secretary of state of Georgia to commit election fraud.
Sad!

Current US cases 20649941
Current US deaths 351774
Source Johns Hopkins/NBC News
Howie, absolutely nothing you've stated here is true.

Thanks for letting me know that.

Trump lawyer slams Georgia Secretary of State Raffensperger for 'secretly' recording 'confidential' call
Trump attorney Kurt Hilbert says the call was a 'confidential settlement discussion'

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump- ... ntial-call

So was that a phony phone call that is being played on every news network of Trump attempting to urge the Georgia Secretary of State commit election fraud?

Who is responsible for the rapidly increasing Covid cases and deaths?
Who is responsible for the nationwide distribution and vaccinations of the American People?
What is the Trump Health plan that he promised?
I guess you just have a better news source?
I really appreciate your accurate information.

Current US cases 20678411
Current US deaths 356842
Source Johns Hopkins/NBC News

Post by **Rogue One** » Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:11 pm

Sigh. How did you come to the conclusion that I thought the phone call was "phony"? Do yourself a favor and listen to the entire call, not the doctored BS the MSM's been pushing. Then you'd know that Trump did not attempt to urge the Georgia Secretary of State to commit election fraud. But you wont as the truth doesn't fit your narrative, does it?

You seem hell-bent on blaming everything COVID related on Trump. Tell me, do the Democrats get a free pass for inviting a COVID-positive representative from Wisconsin to a super-spreader event (aka the mass swearing-in for most House members into 117th Congress)? Where's the mandatory 6ft social distancing?

Here's some COVID info you're apparently not aware of...

"Cycle thresholds" (Ct) are the level at which widely used polymerase chain reaction (PCR) test can detect a sample of the COVID-19 virus. The higher the number of cycles, the lower the amount of viral load in the sample; the lower the cycles, the more prevalent the virus was in the original sample.

Numerous epidemiological experts have argued that cycle thresholds are an important metric by which patients, the public, and policymakers can make more informed decisions about how infectious and/or sick an individual with a positive COVID-19 test might be. However, as JustTheNews reports, health departments across the country are failing to collect that data.

Here are a few headlines from those experts and scientific studies:

1. Experts compiled three datasets with officials from the states of Massachusetts, New York and Nevada that conclude:“Up to 90% of the people who tested positive did not carry a virus."

2. The Wadworth Center, a New York State laboratory, analyzed the results of its July tests at the request of the NYT: 794 positive tests with a Ct of 40: “With a Ct threshold of 35, approximately half of these PCR tests would no longer be considered positive,” said the NYT. “And about 70% would no longer be considered positive with a Ct of 30! “

3. An appeals court in Portugal has ruled that the PCR process is not a reliable test for Sars-Cov-2, and therefore any enforced quarantine based on those test results is unlawful.

4. A new study from the Infectious Diseases Society of America, found that at 25 cycles of amplification, 70% of PCR test "positives" are not "cases" since the virus cannot be cultured, it's dead. And by 35: 97% of the positives are non-clinical.

5. PCR is not testing for disease, it's testing for a specific RNA pattern and this is the key pivot. When you crank it up to 25, 70% of the positive results are not really "positives" in any clinical sense, since it cannot make you or anyone else sick

So, in summary, with regard to our current "casedemic", positive tests as they are counted today do not indicate a “case” of anything. They indicate that viral RNA was found in a nasal swab. It may be enough to make you sick, but according to the New York Times and their experts, probably won’t. And certainly not sufficient replication of the virus to make anyone else sick. But you will be sent home for ten days anyway, even if you never have a sniffle. And this is the number the media breathlessly reports… and is used to fearmonger mask mandates and lockdowns nationwide…

Post by **telcoman** » Tue Jan 05, 2021 8:02 am

Rogue One wrote: ↑
Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:11 pm
as JustTheNews reports, health departments across the country are failing to collect that data.....

That is all I need to know.

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/just-the-news/

"Founded in February 2020, by John Solomon, Just the News is a conservative website that reports on political news through podcasts, videos, and textual content. According to their about page, “JusttheNews.com is committed to just reporting facts from journalists with a long record of public trust and excellence.”

John Solomon serves as the Editor-in-Chief. Solomon was formerly a journalist with The Hill, leaving the paper in October 2019. Solomon’s reporting has been described as conspiratorial and pro-Trump. Other notable staff is Sharyl Attkisson, who is currently the host of the TV show Full Measure, and David Brody from CBN News."

"Failed Fact Checks

Virginia’s new method for testing for coronavirus may significantly delay the state’s reopening – Partly False
COVID-19 is close to losing its epidemic status in the U.S., according to the CDC – False
Yale epidemiologist: Dr. Fauci running ‘misinformation campaign’ against hydroxychloroquine – False
“Dr. Anthony Fauci appeared to acknowledge that large numbers of positive COVID-19 cases may arise from oversensitive tests that pick up mere fragments of the virus rather than active, viable infections. If true, many patients may have been receiving false-positive test results” – Inaccurate"

https://www.wired.com/story/coronavirus ... -theories/

You and other Trumpers are driven to the conspiracy web sites.

I'll just stick to The New York Times, Washington Post, The CDC, and Dr Fauci, Johns Hopkins, and my primary care Dr. for accurate Covid information

Current US cases 20825423
Current US deaths 353640
Source Johns Hopkins/NBC News

Post by **VStar650CL** » Tue Jan 05, 2021 8:30 am

Post by **Rogue One** » Wed Jan 27, 2021 2:10 pm

A rather interesting read...
REPORT: CDC Apparently Changed COVID Criteria That Inflated Fatalities 10-Fold

Well, though the overwhelming prevalence of comorbidities on death certificates fingering COVID-19 does, indeed, also finger the CDC for not just cooking the books, but doing so in ways that likely violated federal law, the problem isn’t nearly as straightforwardly simple as Candace Owens and most other folks took it to be.

Israeli behind ‘game-changing’ Covid nasal spray says it’s 99.9% effective
Gilly Regev says her 'hand sanitiser for the nose' is inexpensive and can be distributed to poorer countries to stop the spread of the virus.

Post by **Rogue One** » Fri Feb 19, 2021 8:17 pm

Johns Hopkins Medical School Professor Wonders Why No One Is Talking About the 77% Decline in New China Virus Cases
"There is reason to think the country is racing toward an extremely low level of infection. As more people have been infected, most of whom have mild or no symptoms, there are fewer Americans left to be infected. At the current trajectory, I expect Covid will be mostly gone by April, allowing Americans to resume normal life."

Post by **VStar650CL** » Fri Feb 19, 2021 9:14 pm

T-cell activation to the rescue. I've been saying since February that nobody could measure it, but there was no other rational explanation for the spiky behavior. Sometimes I really hate being right.

Post by **Rogue One** » Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:14 pm

Post by **VStar650CL** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:52 am

Unbelievable. This whole thing will over by April and here's the Ivy League scrapping spring sports. "Follow the science" my asstronaut, these people are just plain nuts.

Post by **VStar650CL** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 5:56 pm

From the scuttlebutt I hear at the hospital where my wife works, there hasn't been a single fatality in Arkansas of anyone who was vaccinated prior to an admission, regardless of age or risk factors. Arkansas is tiny and rural and maybe not the best laboratory, but still. What I glean from the Israeli study doesn't seem to address this, it covers rate of disease and rate of hospitalization but I didn't see any conclusive data about subsequent mortality. Is this because the Pfizer vaccine is near 100% effective in preventing death when administered prior? Does anybody know if this has been analyzed?

Post by **telcoman** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 6:34 pm

VStar650CL wrote: ↑
Sun Feb 28, 2021 5:56 pm
From the scuttlebutt I hear at the hospital where my wife works, there hasn't been a single fatality in Arkansas of anyone who was vaccinated prior to an admission, regardless of age or risk factors. Arkansas is tiny and rural and maybe not the best laboratory, but still. What I glean from the Israeli study doesn't seem to address this, it covers rate of disease and rate of hospitalization but I didn't see any conclusive data about subsequent mortality. Is this because the Pfizer vaccine is near 100% effective in preventing death when administered prior? Does anybody know if this has been analyzed?

That is exactly why it is important for every American to be vaccinated. The now three vaccines prevent hospitalizations even if you contact Covid.
I received my second Moderna vaccination shot a few hours ago today.
Many studies of this virus are underway and it is important to follow the science. My seven year old grandson already had the virus and tested positive. He had 103 fever for two days and after that he was fine. His younger sister missed three weeks of kindergarten and was not happy.
As you probably know the Pfizer vaccine is limited to the locations (usually hospitals) that have the proper freezers to keep that vaccine at the proper cold storage temperature.
The Moderna vaccine can be stored in regular freezers .

Israel is far ahead of the United States mostly due to our late start in not having a plan for distributing the vaccine until after January 20th

Current US cases 28,603,688
Current US deaths 512,984
Source Johns Hopkins/NBC News

Post by **VStar650CL** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 6:42 pm

telcoman wrote: ↑
Sun Feb 28, 2021 6:34 pm
That is exactly why it is important for every American to be vaccinated. The now three vaccines prevent hospitalizations even if you contact Covid.
I received my second Moderna vaccination shot a few hours ago today.
Many studies of this virus are underway and it is important to follow the science. My seven year old grandson already had the virus and tested positive. He had 103 fever for two days and after that he was fine. His younger sister missed three weeks of kindergarten and was not happy.
As you probably know the Pfizer vaccine is limited to the locations (usually hospitals) that have the proper freezers to keep that vaccine at the proper cold storage temperature.
The Moderna vaccine can be stored in regular freezers

Agreed, but none of that answers the question.

Post by **Rogue One** » Fri Mar 05, 2021 4:41 pm

Lockdowns don’t work: comparing Florida and California

: EurCITAXcAYKXuw.jpg (51.56 KiB) Viewed 775 times

Post by **telcoman** » Fri Mar 05, 2021 5:10 pm

What the media does and you do not is provide confirmed and accurate information.

https://www.cnn.com/interactive/2020/he ... and-cases/

Reported cases and deaths

The figures below are based on data from the Johns Hopkins University Center for Systems Science and Engineering. These numbers are updated every 15 minutes and may differ from other sources due to reporting times. For up-to-the-minute updates, follow our live coverage.
Location Cases ...per 100K people Deaths ...per 100K people
California 3,588,884 9,083 53,647 136
Texas 2,686,121 9,264 45,042 155
Florida 1,936,207 9,015 31,522 147
New York 1,674,767 8,609 48,109 247
Illinois 1,194,630 9,427 22,947 181
Georgia 1,019,509 9,602 17,815 168
Ohio 976,150 8,351 17,268 148
Pennsylvania 946,734 7,395 24,255 189
North Carolina 870,142 8,296 11,445 109
Arizona 823,384 11,312 16,269 224
New Jersey 806,370 9,079 23,521 265

Andrew Cuomo is having some problems but he has never been accused of grabbing women by their pu$$y like Trump bragged about on tape.

Current US cases 28,885,512
Current US deaths 522,606
Source Johns Hopkins/NBC News

Post by **VStar650CL** » Fri Mar 05, 2021 5:24 pm

Here we go again.

Post by **VStar650CL** » Fri Mar 05, 2021 6:14 pm

Since y'all insist, here's some strictly non-partisan food for thought:
1) "To be safe," every brain surgeon will advise you to wear a helmet everywhere for the rest of your life.
2) No one but clinicians who actually work on a COVID floor should be listened to regarding treatment, they've all thrown the sink at this bug and they know what works. People without that experience should keep their mouths shut.
3) All bugs naturally evolve to become more contagious but less lethal. Killing the host has no Darwinian benefit to any bug, infecting more hosts does. Of course the "new strains" are more contagious. Of course they will also be less lethal.
4) Right now, any good statistician can tell you more about the state of COVID than any medical expert. Statistically, the disease is approaching herd immunity whether we understand the reasons or not. My personal bet is on unrecognized and untestable T-cell activation, but you can pick your own favorite pony. The numbers are dropping precipitously, and absolutely nothing to come out of the mouth of any "MD expert" explains it.
5) Ben Franklin opined that any population which values safety over liberty will end up with neither and deserve what they get. He was right, and as of now, we'll deserve it.

A "Case" in point on "COVID deaths"

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