350z tires....G35 too?

Shocks, springs, sway bars, coliovers, bushings, brakes, wheels, tires - This is the place to discuss G-Series suspension modifications!
The G35 Spot
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Joined: Mon Aug 11, 2003 11:34 am

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So I was reading that there is a class action lawsuit being filed against Nissan for the problem with it's front tires/alignment. Would this be applicable for the G35 coupe too? I experienced the same problems, uneven wear, lots of road noise and so on. Is anyone familiar with this, let me know if you are.

Thanks,

Jay


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rydwhite
Posts: 3271
Joined: Fri May 30, 2003 3:43 am
Car: 2003 G35 Coupe

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I haven't heard of any problems with the G35. Check out the TSB's, there may be something in there.

Q45tech
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Car: 1990 Q45 342,400 miles 22 years ownership with original engine
1995 G20t 5 speed 334,000 miles 16" 2002 wheels - 205/50/16 Sr20ve vvl

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Common effects of VERY aggressive suspension [high negative camber] and lack of rotation and frequent alignment checks and fine adjustments with Premium ultra performance directional tires.

What happens when you try to sell a quasi entry level performance luxury car to the masses. Their ignorance of automotive engineering [what happens when you squeeze engineering on a budget] and their limited pocket book makes them grasp at straws [whine and sue] to avoid paying for wear and tear items........first the brakes, now the tires, soon it will be the shocks and suspension bushings and oil changes.

The solution is to let customers pick their tires and get factory off the hook. A disclaimer that the car has performance tires that wear strangely and fast should be signed before being allowed to purchase the car............but alas it is easier marketing wise to just raise the price a few thousand each year.

vq35de
Posts: 211
Joined: Fri May 16, 2003 4:20 pm
Car: G35 Sedan Leather 6MT

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first off, Q45, I agree with you on the ignorance of the ignorant. to some, spending 1000 dollars on tires every 8 months is absurd but to me that is the price you pay

but I do have one point to beef with you about. the z's suspension is not very agressive. The max they allow the z to go from the factory is 1.5 degrees negative and the nominal is around 0.5 degrees negative. This hardly counts as aggressive or extreme. AS HAS BEEN POINTED OUT BEFORE, IF YOU WANT YOUR Z OR G COUPE TIRES TO LAST LONGER, ROTATE THEM SIDE TO SIDE BY HAVING THEM DISMOUNTED AND REMOUNTED FROM THE RIM ON OPPOSITE RIMS.

i run with 1.5-2.5 degrees negative camber and ZERO toe and I get even treadwear, even when I forget to rotate every 5k miles and go 7 or 8 k miles. The harder you drive the better the aggressive camber setups will wear as the outside of the tire spends more time in contact with the ground. lots of highway driving will kill a negative camber zero toe tire real quick, so take some back roads and hit the curves hard. it will wear faster but more evenly and safer.

Q45tech
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Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2002 3:19 am
Car: 1990 Q45 342,400 miles 22 years ownership with original engine
1995 G20t 5 speed 334,000 miles 16" 2002 wheels - 205/50/16 Sr20ve vvl

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Don't confuse static negative camber with the total camber curve and the high caster.............this is what eats tires.

The 90Q has a static -0.7 camber and 6.5 degrees of caster........at 3" roll the total suspension camber increases to negative - 3.2 degrees .............in a turn with wheel at 22 degrees it can be Negative 6.0 degrees.

BMW [97-01 Q, LS, etc] have medium caster but no camber gain due to MacPearson strut front suspension.

vq35de
Posts: 211
Joined: Fri May 16, 2003 4:20 pm
Car: G35 Sedan Leather 6MT

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so since the Z has less body roll its camber shouldn't go that far negative even during transition rolls?

That is my take on it.

it doesn't really matter to me. all I look at is my overall handling and occasionally tire temps with a pyrometer after hard driving. tire wear is secondary to me. i try to slow it down but they are supposed to wear quick, if you are wearing the correct ones for a G35's personality.

True performance nuts trade out their tires almost immediately after purchase anyways, did mine at 8 months.

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rydwhite
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Car: 2003 G35 Coupe

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Yeah, I'm not quite there as a performance nut yet. I spent my money on the car and the wheel and tire upgrades have to wait. I am treating in steps, wheels/tires, suspension, exhaust/headers, etc... I need the money first to be able to switch out tires within a year of getting the car.

nab911
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Joined: Thu Jul 03, 2003 9:33 am

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Whoa.. the Z car problem is just the fact that the suspension pulls out of alignment alot. You get free tires if you take it back up there... period. My friend works at NISSAN and he brings home those feathered tires all the time. In fact we are selling them at $20 a piece if anyone wants em... 225/50R17 i think... there is just a little feathering but make GREAT drift tires. Perfect tread.

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GeeThreeFive
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Joined: Thu Oct 02, 2003 6:43 pm

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You only have the 225's? If you had a little wider I would be interested. I wonder how much it would be to ship a set to Calif.I've got 255's on now but I would like to go to 275's.

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MOTOP
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Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2003 8:44 am
Car: 04 G35 sedan

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Q45,

You are saying that brakes thing was whining too?

I got 11k miles out of brand new car before front pads were at 1.5mm and rotors needed to be resurfaced.

Heck, POS drilled/slotted rotors with axis metal masters lived for twice this time on my 240sx with much more agressive breaking pattern.


Q45tech
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Car: 1990 Q45 342,400 miles 22 years ownership with original engine
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The major area where you can decrease braking distance is in the FIRST half to 1 second time from the instant brakes are applied. Assuming you already are using the stickiest tires obtainable.

Most humans don't apply full force instantly but the leg force builds up over the half second while you are traveling 88 feet per sec.

Using special pads with higher friction at lighter loads gains you 15 even 20 feet [60>0] at the expense of faster pads wear.

This is Nissans "Brake Assist". Ultra soft pads yield shorter 80-60 to zero stops.

Owners must decide if the brakes are too good for their pocket books, Nissan has let owners off the hook till 30,000 miles by covering the first set or two.

I use MM pads on my Q [4th set] for mountain driving and can assure you they are not as instant stoppers as the Q oem pads [pretty close but no cigar] but have less cold friction. [traded off for increase hot friction]. Cold being relative as the pads typically run under 150F when not applied even in summer.

Study the coefficient of friction of various pads vs pad temperatures and you will see the problem.

Everyone wants performance till they get the bill for it.


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MOTOP
Posts: 278
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2003 8:44 am
Car: 04 G35 sedan

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Q45,

I agree with you that people should be ready to pay for performance. But if they are warned.

I'd have had no problem with buying new brakes every 12k miles if there was a note on my car sticker, saying that it is equiped with sport package and performance brakes which wear twice as fast as normal ones. The same way it tells me that this car gets bad mileage in the city. And this is what I think the warranty addresses, the fact that Nissan didn't make an effort to communicate to buyers the fact that those "best in class" brakes also have shortest in class life. Did you see they increased the size of pads/rotors on 05 G35, this could have been done from the very begining if they didn't want any disclaimers to be put on the car.

I suspect the same thing is happening with tires. People only take under consideration treadwear index on them and not other characteristics, like driving pattern, camber/toe etc.

Q45tech
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Posts: 14365
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2002 3:19 am
Car: 1990 Q45 342,400 miles 22 years ownership with original engine
1995 G20t 5 speed 334,000 miles 16" 2002 wheels - 205/50/16 Sr20ve vvl

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The lack of engineering expertise in US automotive Consumers is appalling, no wonder we'll all be working for the Chinese in 30 years and be glad to get our rice bowl and bicycle.

BMW used to have the worst wearing dustiest brake pads in the world.........but this time they let the G35 beat them on equal car weight braking distances............can you say lets sucker the Japanese in.

It's amazing after 14 years of never changing brakes [90-96Q] and having the worst wearing brakes in Japan [on equal weight cars] Nissan is finally getting it.............shows what happens when the G35 sold 140,000 units since launch and someone beat the __________ out of the accountants at least on brake cost reduction.

They still won't be good enough to please as the pad area is the key and really hard to make them stable with more than 9-10mm thickness. Stopping rotor warping is easy compared to pad wear and short stopping distances.

Government warnings to the great uneducated masses...........How we ended up with tire pressure monitors.

Warning buying cheap tires is bad for you health and may get you killed.What happended to individual responsibilty for education.

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PalmerWMD
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Joined: Mon Apr 29, 2002 3:14 pm
Car: 2004 350Z

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I like the idea of teh stock set-up being real soft.

We had the exact same issue in the early 90 w/ the G50 Q45's.

In response to customer complaints slower wearing pads were introduced .The g50 was the class leader in braking at the time as well..

Minor hi-jack.

Dennis: was it 2 or 3 or even more part#'s for G50 brake pads? After customer complaints of too quick wearing/dusting..?

Fred...


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