2007 M45 Audio upgrade

[adrdsouza]

I've got the '07 M45 with the 8 speaker Bose system. It has the following setup

2 speakers in the front door
2 tweeters (in the door behind the side mirrors)
2 speakers in the rear doors
1 speaker above the screen and
1 speaker in the center of the rear deck

From what i've read the front and rear door speakers are 6.5 inch and can be swapped with 2 ohm coax speakers. What i want to do however is:

1. Run components with the woofers in the front doors and the tweeters where they currently are. What size are the tweeters? Are they easy to swap out?
2. Run co axials in the rear doors.
3. add a sub instead of the speaker in the rear deck. What size are these?

Since i have the bose amplifier, i want to remove that and run a new amp. Perhaps a 5 channel amp (2 front, 2 rear, 1 sub). From where do i take the line level input? I have read that i need something like the cleansweep, but those are expensive. Are there any cheaper options?

Is anyone running a setup like the one i want?

[adrdsouza]

I'm sorry. I just saw Tdot's post and he's covered pretty much everything.
Just a few additional questions for Tdot.

If i run the hertz in the front, both the woofers and the tweeters fit without any mods right?
Where did you take the speaker input from? Did you disconnect it at the bose amp? I'm confused about this bit. Also is there a cheaper filter/ tuner? I though the cleansweep was expensive at about $260 but the rockford you got is $500+
While i want a sub i don't want to sacrifice trunk space. Do you know what size the speaker in the rear deck is and whether i can replace it with a free air sub?

[TDot]

1/ yes
2/ spliced into the wires coming out the bose system, use the fsm for audio to determine which wires. BE SURE to take note of which setup you are looking at in the fsm because there are about 4 different configurations based on your car package and you dont want to cut the wrong wire based on a different package.
3/ i wouldnt know which processor to point you towards, i only looked at the pricier ones for my specific purposes.
4/ as for the sub, i would recommend against free air; i was originally going in that direction (two good examples are here, one in the rear deck, and the other in the pass through. I was going to do the latter for best response, positioning, and more sub options) but decided against it after talking to a few knowledgable people who have experience with free air. I dont remember what it was specifically, but what they said made sense. But anyway, of course you can replace it with free air...that's what's there already. If i remember correctly it's a 10", I remember seeing a nice pioneer shallow mount (although i doubt it will be that much better...its all physics), or cut out the trunk covering (if placing in the rear deck) and put a traditional sub in. If you listen to hip hop, reggae, r&b, dance, I would go with a 1'x1'x1' ported box (it fits very neatly under the rear deck), other genres i guess free air is ok.

[adrdsouza]

Thanks Tdot.

When you say you spliced into the wires coming out the Bose system, is that at the back of the av unit or did you do it just before it enters the amp?
Is there separate wiring for front, back and subwoofer?
I'm thinking of running an amped sub in an IB config in the factory location. I am cool with cutting through the carpet for a bigger sub to hang out so it doesn't have to be a shallow mount sub. When you say '1'x1'x1' ported box (it fits very neatly under the rear deck)' Do you mean i still put it in the factory location and put a box on the bottom of it?
I've read nothing but good things about the Acoustic Elegance IB10 subs in an Infinite Baffle setup. I'm coming from a pioneer champion pro 1000 Watt RMS sub in a ported box in my previous car and i've realized that i'm really not into boomy bass as the bass on that sub was always dialed quite low. I want something that has accurate bass reproduction but is better than the factory sub cause i can barely hear that. The box occupied most of my trunk and rendered it pretty useless and i'm not that bothered about getting another box.

[TDot]

1/ the harness coming out the amp



2/ theres wires for each speaker, bit they arent ligned up in a "traditional" way on the harness, thats why I say again, be sure to consult with the fsm for your particular car and features.

3/ yes, my original box fit perfectly in the corner under the deck.


i wouldnt build a box around the shelf (around the sub hanging on the shelf), thats not a good idea.

If you want accurate, solid, none boomy and if you were to do the small box, i recommend the IDQ10 in my build thread.

[adrdsouza]

Thanks for your inputs Tdot. I really appreciate it!

With regards to line level input. I thought you eventually bypassed the Bose amp. So your signal goes through the Bose and then the Fosgate processor?

I Think I'm going to stick to your IDQ recommendation. They fit in small boxes and the reviews are amazing. I've had my eye on them for a couple of years as well. I think i might go with the 12" since the recommended intermediate volume (1 cu ft for the 12") is lower than the 10" 1.1 cu ft) and i could even go smaller if required.

Do you have any experience with or opinions on Image Dynamic components?

[TDot]

As far as bypassing the bose, yes and no. I have a media center setup feeding the fosgate directly through the optical input. Then i have the Bose feeding the fosgate through the line level. That way at anytime i can flip the switch of the fosgate from inside between my media center and the car audio/nav/voice stuff(someone might want to throw in a cd or i might want to listen to the radio). I also configured the bose to feed the center speaker the nav voice and phone while in media center mode. But as far as regularly listening to music feeding from the bose to another amp, no my setup isnt like that and i personally dont recommend it. But its all all a matter of budget, time and preference anyway.

No i dont know anything about IDs components.

[adrdsouza]

Sorry i'm still a little confused about what you don't recommend?
I'm trying to figure out if i can get the signal that feeds into the sound processor before or after the bose amp. In another post a few members have tried getting the input pre bose amp and lost control over volume. I guess there is some processing that happens within the bose amp and i have to take the input signal from after it passes through the bose amp. I'm going to add a sound processor before the aftermarket amps and not directly from amp to amp if that is what you thought i'm saying.

[TDot]

I dont recommend having the bose amp being a part of your music. One amp feeding another amp is not good no matter what processor you put inbetween. Some people dont mind the quality, some people do (me)...especially since (in my opinion) this bose is crap.

You can pick the signal up before the amp but you will lose voice nav/phone/auto volume/etc. and i believe total volume control. The audio goes into the amp strictly 2 channels left and right; your processor would be responsible for splitting it into 5 channels so it needs to be a good one to avoide phasing. If you go with a processor capable of splitting it into 5 channels for your front, rear, and sub, that processor most likely comes with a remote so you can control the volume from inside. You just have to decide if you're willing to lose the other stuff. I dont know how much you ACTUALLY use that stuff, but i dont think you'll miss it.

If what people say is true and only music comes directly from the headunit what you can try is take the left and right audio before the bose input, and then take the ch 1 & 2 speaker output, splice those together and feed your processor. That will give you
1/ your music untouched by the bose.
2/ your voice navigation/phone and volume control of them (not your music) from the headunit
3/ the nav/phone however would now come out all the speakers instead of just the front.

Now everything i just stated is strictly based on reading the schematics and my years of doing stuff like this. I didn't actually test this scenario out, but i havent been wrong in anything I've attempted so far lol. So take care on how you cut wires in case it doesnt work as you...or I...expect so you can solder it back if anything. Also, I'm saying this based on 2008+.

[adrdsouza]

Thanks for your input Tdot!

I watched a demonstration on the JL cleansweep where it basically takes a signal that is not flat and makes it flat. I will feed it the signal from after the bose amp. I don't have either phone or nav but if i need to buy a processor to feed the pre bose signal to the amp, i might as well get the cleansweep to flatten the post bose amp and feed it to the aftermarket amp.

I've decided on the following setup

Image dynamics IDQ65CS components in the front and Image dynamics CTX65 co axials in the rear doors running off a Pioneer class D 100 Watt RMS x 4 channel amp.
IDQ12 v4 sub running off a JBL MS-A5001 500 watt RMS moblock amp in the trunk.

My only concern is the mounting depth of the rear speakers. It's listed at 2-3/4" top mount depth and 2-7/8" bottom mount depth. Do you know if it will fit or whats the maximum size of speaker that the rear doors can tale?

[EZEMaxima]

Thanks for your input Tdot!

I watched a demonstration on the JL cleansweep where it basically takes a signal that is not flat and makes it flat. I will feed it the signal from after the bose amp. I don't have either phone or nav but if i need to buy a processor to feed the pre bose signal to the amp, i might as well get the cleansweep to flatten the post bose amp and feed it to the aftermarket amp.

I've decided on the following setup

Image dynamics IDQ65CS components in the front and Image dynamics CTX65 co axials in the rear doors running off a Pioneer class D 100 Watt RMS x 4 channel amp.
IDQ12 v4 sub running off a JBL MS-A5001 500 watt RMS moblock amp in the trunk.

My only concern is the mounting depth of the rear speakers. It's listed at 2-3/4" top mount depth and 2-7/8" bottom mount depth. Do you know if it will fit or whats the maximum size of speaker that the rear doors can tale?

Any updates as I too want to upgrade my speakers and possibly addd aftermarket amps later.

[TDot]

Just wanted to correct something if it has any bearing. Picking up the audio before the amp does not impact control of the volume in your case since you do not have the other bells and whistles in your package.

What i would personally do is simply buy the amp and speakers, grab the wire before the bose, split it and feed the aftermarket amp directly. Dont worry about flattening the frequency response yet. See what it sounds like and verify the volume control works (the av control is what determins the main audio output not the bose...according to how I've read the fsm. The bose comes into play when you have the other stuff and the music needs to be cut or automatically adjusted). Remember, the frequency response "that needs flattening" is usually tuned to the acoustics of the car...if it is tuned before the bose amp. I would tend to assume that its not tuned before the bose.

I see you plan on doing two amp set up and I'm just curious of why. 500rms is not much and a good 5ch amp can handle that and save space which i know is a concern of yours. I don't know whats out there now, but when i was building there were at least 5 5ch amps doing at least 500rms on the sub. If you are set on doing the two amp thing, i strongly suggest you upgrade the sub amp to match the sub.

I don't know if your speakers will fit. Find out the depth of mine and compare them with yours. I had about 1" extra.

Anyway, good luck whichever way you go.

[adrdsouza]

From the other thread i understood that the Bose has a bus that does the processing (front/ rear, volume control) and that picking the signal before it would give me a unprocessed (clean signal) but would leave me without volume control and i would need something like the audiocontrol LC7 or 8 to split the front and rear etc.
OEM amps process audio to protect cheap factory speakers from extra bass etc. The cleansweep cleans the signal and makes it flat. Putting it after the Bose amp would let me keep factory controls and feed a clean signal to the amps.
Found a new JL cleansweep on ebay for $210 shipped (to a friend who was in Ohio on business) and received it (in Kuwait) this morning.

The IDQ12 i ordered needs about 700 Watts RMS and the IDQ65 components i ordered need about 125 Watts RMS per channel. I was having trouble finding a 5 channel amp that output at least 100 watts RMS x 4 @ 4 ohms for the fronts and rears and 750 watts @ 1 or 2 ohms for the subs.

I got the Dual 2 ohm sub (IDQ12D2 V4) that i will wire down to 1 ohm and run them off the Pioneer GM D8601 which does 800 watts @ 1 ohm.
The IDQ65CS comps and coaxials (maybe alpine r type rated at 100 watts RMS per channel) in the rears will run off the pioneer GM D8604 which does 100 watts RMS per channel @ 4 Ohms.
Amps will run off Knu Konceptz' 4 gauge wiring.

Will plug everything in in a couple of weeks once everything gets here. Will post pics and an update after.

[adrdsouza]

Install is almost complete. Jl cleansweep, amps, idq components in the front, kenwood coaxs in the rear doors have been installed. Sub box will be ready this evening and i will post pics after the sub is in,

[vaughnop]

How did it turn out?