2003 Sales Numbers

[Jesda]

I'm sure youve seen these (from PRNewsWire.com) but I found it interesting:

Industry Sales - CY 2003

Entry Level Luxury Cars1) BMW 3 Series - 111,9442) Mercedes-Benz C Class - 65,982 +3.1%3) Lexus ES330 - 65,762 -8.0%4) Acura TL - 56,770 - 26.4%5) Cadillac CTS - 49,395 +30.1%6) G35 Sport Sedan - 35,765 +21.0%7) Volvo S60 - 35,346 -8.3%8) Saab 9-3 - 34,075 +66.2%9) Lincoln LS - 33,581 -15.6%10) G35 Sport Coupe - 28,965 +454.9%11) Jaguar X-Type - 27,212 -20.5%12) Chrysler 300M - 24,910 -23%13) Acura TSX - 18,93214) Lexus IS300 - 13,559 -33.2%

G35 Total: 64,730

Mid-Luxury Cars1) Mercedes-Benz E-Class - 55,683 +30.7%2) BMW 5-Series - 46,9643) Mercedes-Benz CLK-Class - 19,230 +11.5%4) Volvo S80 - 14,650 -4.6%5) Jaguar S-Type - 11,549 -2.1%6) Lexus GS300 - 11,228 -24.1%7) Acura RL - 6,829 -27.3%8) Infiniti M45 - 4,7559) Lexus GS430 - 2,078 -15.5%

^^Where's the I35? M45 beats Lexus. Neato, I guess.

Luxury Cars1) Mercedes-Benz S-Class - 22,940 +8.6%2) BMW 7-Series - 20,4733) Lexus LS430 - 23,895 -9.0%4) Lexus SC430 - 10,298 -28.8%5) Jaguar XJ - 7,160 +9.8%6) Mercedes-Benz CL-Class - 3,377 -14.2%7) Jaguar XK - 2,171 -27.4%8) Infiniti Q45 - 2,440 -34.4%

Ouch for the Q.

-Jesda

[90Q45blue]

Those number aren't suprising. I'd like to see number on the FX!

Nick

[1992Q45A]

Wow. So LS outsells S class and 7 series?

[PalmerWMD]

But at least M45 and Q45 together are more solid numbers of over 8000, which is more than Jag XJ.

And the powertrains are the same, so it helps them recoup some of the Vk45de investment.

Fred..

[1992Q45A]

What a great invesment it is. Everyone is, is still catching up in terms of power and tech

Unfortunately we're behind the curve in terms of transmission/gearing

[1992Q45A]

Hopefully the new M will make waves, like the G did.

Since it's built on the same platform, but significiantly stiffened/enhanced, I can only see the car not winning the comparisons as a COMPLETE failure for infiniti

If the M fails, it's 10 steps back. This is really the car Infiniti has needed to build

[Jesda]

From a business perspective, I find it interesting to watch Cadillac and Infiniti sort of recover from a luxury slump.

Well, for Cadillac it was a 15-20 year nosedive.

They both reannounced their presence with stunning designs (G35, Escalade, CTS) and both are betting the farm on their mid-lux offering to keep the money train rolling.

For Cadillac (STS) and Infiniti (M45) its now or never.

-Jesda

[louiegz]

Hopefully the new M will make waves, like the G did.

Since it's built on the same platform, but significiantly stiffened/enhanced, I can only see the car not winning the comparisons as a COMPLETE failure for infiniti

If the M fails, it's 10 steps back. This is really the car Infiniti has needed to build

It will depend on the price. I've gone to the M concept website, building my dream car, with the options I want, it's about $54,000. They must realize this because a month ago, I built the same car, and it was over $57,000. You probably can pick up an E-class for about $60,000 and stupid people go for the name. I tell you, this new M or the new Acura RL are the two cars that will be on the top of my wish list to buy when it's time to retire my Q.

[SFBayQ45]

I tell you, this new M or the new Acura RL are the two cars that will be on the top of my wish list to buy when it's time to retire my Q.

I agree with you on the M, but where did a FWD enter the equation. Going from a RWD beast to uncontrollable FWD torque steer (albiet powerful) is a drastic difference.

[PalmerWMD]

SF Bay:The new RL is AWD (albeit with front bias and transverse engine mounting).This was easier for Acura to do than a redesign to RWD

Fred..

[louiegz]

I agree with you on the M, but where did a FWD enter the equation. Going from a RWD beast to uncontrollable FWD torque steer (albiet powerful) is a drastic difference.

Yea, Fred is right. It's an advanced Supper AWD system and yes it will probably front biased. Don't worry Frisco, the M is on the top of the list. The RL screws up by going with a V6. One cool thing the RL will have over the M is that the RL will have F1 style shift paddles. I wish that Infiniti will reconsider this to make the auto stick worth using. Just considering it because of Honda reliability. I had a 94 Accord and it was bullet proof.

[1992Q45A]

I wish Infiniti would run with the V8 and AWD and also a 6 speed.

BMW has built brand loyalty over the years as being one of the only companies to give you a real manual option on a sedan.

Also Infinitis AWD system is simply one of the best out there. Basically RWD until the fun begins. Perfect, and you won't get ugly understeer like the honduh will give you.

The infiniti may be expensive, but it will be worth the money. The cost cutting is over. This is the car Infiniti has been wanting to build since the original Q.

[PalmerWMD]

I dont like the extra weight associated with AWD.My choice would be V8, RWD and a real manual.

Fred..

[rydwhite]

I wish Infiniti would run with the V8 and AWD and also a 6 speed.

BMW has built brand loyalty over the years as being one of the only companies to give you a real manual option on a sedan.

Also Infinitis AWD system is simply one of the best out there. Basically RWD until the fun begins. Perfect, and you won't get ugly understeer like the honduh will give you.

The infiniti may be expensive, but it will be worth the money. The cost cutting is over. This is the car Infiniti has been wanting to build since the original Q.

Yeah, I agree. Tossing the V8 with AWD and a 6 speed would make the car perhaps the perfect vehicle. Maybe the following year will bring that as an option.

[maxnix]

Don't think there will ever be AWD with MT6 for either the G or the M. Too small a market and too large a possibility of driveline abuse by owners.

GTR with 6MT might happen.

[1992Q45A]

Don't think there will ever be AWD with MT6 for either the G or the M. Too small a market and too large a possibility of driveline abuse by owners.

GTR with 6MT might happen.

Count on it. Carlos has stated over and over the GTR is coming to America.

This is our greatest hope for the Infiniti performance. Although he hasn't confimred it will be sold as an Infiniti, it will be here in some config in 2007 or 2008.

[louiegz]

At the very least, they should offer an auto M V8 sport with AWD. It’d be nice with the snow you can get in NJ in the winter. I'm not looking forward to the possibility of having to pay for 19" snow tires when the winter rolls along. I guess Infiniti doesn't have a AWD system that can handle the torque of the 4.5L V8. I hope one day Infiniti decides to develop a SMG (Sequential Manual Gearbox) like the folks at BMW have. It's as close as you can get to a manual in an auto transmission. Not only that, the F1 paddles on the steering wheel would be sweet.

[maxnix]

AWD exists in JDM Cima, but the VK45DE is somewhat detuned. Don't know if htere is sufficient room in the new platform, but no AWD V8 is planned at this time. Probably will be in JDM first, so keep an eye cast over there.

[1992Q45A]

They DO have an AWD sys that can handle the v8...

FX45

As for the SMG, this is far far beyond a clutch type automatic gearbox.

It is the fastest shifting transmission manual/auto/anything in a production vehicle, period

It has been rumored the GTR will be offered with the traditional 6 speed manual and the CVT transmission.. We'll see

[90Q45blue]

I guarantee you that the GTR will be badged a Nissan.

Nick

[maxnix]

I guarantee you that the GTR will be badged a Nissan.

Nick

I bet you it will be an Infiniti offering exclusively in this country.

[1992Q45A]

Yep. Carlos has hinted to it, already.

70k+ nissan. I don't think so

Think about it

The GTR is not what the old gtr was. This is going for the 911 luxury extreme performance gt vehicle.

It will be Infinitis flagship, and complete their new reimaged lineup.

[Jason B]

Audi A8 didn't even make the list. Great car, but VERY FEW sold.

[louiegz]

Audi A8 didn't even make the list. Great car, but VERY FEW sold.

Yea, how bout the VW Phaeton. I bet only 2 wer sold. $65,000 for a VW. $95,000 for a V12. Keep smokin that crack.

[90Q45blue]

I bet you it will be an Infiniti offering exclusively in this country.

I'll take that bet my friend. BTW, I have confirmed this with an "insider"

Nick

[1992Q45A]

and I've confirmed it with Carlos, LOL

[PalmerWMD]

The bet is on in front of witnesses.How mucyh are u guys gonna put down?

Fred..

[Jesda]

I'd like to get in on the betting! My wager is one toothbrush, mildly used.

[maxnix]

Well, the steak dinner I won from Nick and Greg on the Fuga being the next M45? Oh wait, that would be two dinners, right?

The GTR will be the Infiniti flagship, in the USA.

[1992Q45A]

Max and I are in agreement again.