2002 Pathfinder Runs smooth, stalls, hard start. pinging, runs smooth agian.

[darksurfr]

I am having a problem with a friend's 2002 Pathfinder I am fixing. I just changed the spark plugs and fixed some oil leaks. Spark plugs were completely warn away to the insulator. Car has about 150K on it. He didn't have any stalling issues prior but now there seems to be some odd things. I am a pretty well versed person in terms of automotive ability. I am stumped by this one but I figure those of you who are into these cars might have a better understanding of the vehicle and be able to help me out.


The car will start up and run beautifully. purrs. Out of the blue the car will stall. This will happen in gear, not in gear. while turning. while idling on level ground with no one near it. But it isn't consistent. I can drive it around and have no issues for 10 minutes and then have it stall 20 seconds apart. After it stalls, it is very difficult to get it to restart. Once it does restart i have to rev the engine up to get it to stay running and it sounds like lots of lifters collapsed. As soon as that lifter noise goes away the car runs beautifully again. like it never happened. The running rough seems like multiple cylinder missing but not really sure why it could go from running smoothly to stalling and running like garbage so instantly.

I put a video of it happening on youtube.
you can hear the "lifter" sound for a fraction of a second in the video. Sometimes this takes a couple of seconds to clear up.
I understand that reving it like that with that noise isn't a good thing to do but when it first died like this I walked away from it for a bit and came back and it seemed to rough start and not have the noise.

https://youtu.be/Y-7dsEOXkYM

any help would be greatly appreciated.

[04pathse]

You did replace the spark plugs with correct plugs, right?

[darksurfr]

As far as I know. I can't imagine that it would act like this if the spark plugs were incorrect. I would think there would be misfire codes continuous issues. Correct me if I am wrong though.

I used NGK LFR5AIX-11 Which are iridiums and while those aren't the original the laser platinums pLFR5A-11 are probably the originals and not much different.

I just don't see the spark plugs causing this but if it is worth getting a set of v-powers and throwing them in I will.

[04pathse]

The plugs you used are fine to use according to the NGK website. They should have been pre-gapped but did you check them just in case?

You said that you fixed some oil leaks, where were the leaks and what was done to fix them?

It is all just odd that the the vehicle wasn't experiencing any stalling prior to the work you had done to it.

You are not getting any trouble codes at all either, is that correct?

[MisterH]

It's useful that you posted a video. It sounds to me like the ignition timing is highly erratic.

[darksurfr]

trans oil pan leak, valve cover bank 1 (plugs 1 3 5) and oil cooler o rings. oil cooler was leaking. all leaks are fixed. plug gaps are around .038-.039 which is much better then the .1 that they were before i replaced them. not even sure how the car ran.

[1998Baja]

did you double check any connectors you may have disconnected are connected? I don't know about how difficult it is to change those spark plugs, but on mine the vg33e the number 6 plug is a pain to get to and some people take off the intake manifold to reach it. I would back track everything you did and see if you missed anything. It is weird that it was running fine and now it's not after replacing the plugs.

[1998Baja]

how long has it been since his fuel filter has been changed?

[darksurfr]

All plugs are on all sensors. Fuel filter is a who knows. but at the same time why would it have started now? filter hard to change? If not I might just do it real quick.

[Buzzman]

Are you getting any codes?
Sounds like it might be a failing IACV.

[darksurfr]

no codes.

[1998Baja]

maybe it doesn't like those plugs, or the ecu needs to reset to the new ones. Try disconnecting the battery for like 10 minutes. or stick the old plugs back in and see if it runs better. Just throwing idea out there.

[1998Baja]

all vacuum hoses connected, plug wires on the correct spark plugs?

[1998Baja]

i made the mistake of putting autolites in mine and it ran like crap. took them out and put iridiums in and didn't gap them. I thought i had to disconnect my battery to reset the ecu, but cant remember.

[darksurfr]

battery was disconnected for days prior. vacuum hoses were repaired while in there. everything is connected correctly. I dont think it would run nice and then not if it was the wrong connections.

[darksurfr]

maybe it doesn't like those plugs, or the ecu needs to reset to the new ones. Try disconnecting the battery for like 10 minutes. or stick the old plugs back in and see if it runs better. Just throwing idea out there.

The old plugs i could fit the ignition key in between the electrode and the tower. They are not going back in.

[chukel]

I am having a problem with a friend's 2002 Pathfinder I am fixing. I just changed the spark plugs and fixed some oil leaks. Spark plugs were completely warn away to the insulator. Car has about 150K on it. He didn't have any stalling issues prior but now there seems to be some odd things. I am a pretty well versed person in terms of automotive ability. I am stumped by this one but I figure those of you who are into these cars might have a better understanding of the vehicle and be able to help me out.


The car will start up and run beautifully. purrs. Out of the blue the car will stall. This will happen in gear, not in gear. while turning. while idling on level ground with no one near it. But it isn't consistent. I can drive it around and have no issues for 10 minutes and then have it stall 20 seconds apart. After it stalls, it is very difficult to get it to restart. Once it does restart i have to rev the engine up to get it to stay running and it sounds like lots of lifters collapsed. As soon as that lifter noise goes away the car runs beautifully again. like it never happened. The running rough seems like multiple cylinder missing but not really sure why it could go from running smoothly to stalling and running like garbage so instantly.

I put a video of it happening on youtube.
you can hear the "lifter" sound for a fraction of a second in the video. Sometimes this takes a couple of seconds to clear up.
I understand that reving it like that with that noise isn't a good thing to do but when it first died like this I walked away from it for a bit and came back and it seemed to rough start and not have the noise.

https://youtu.be/Y-7dsEOXkYM

any help would be greatly appreciated.

you have a fuel delivery issue. Your fuel pump is about kicking the bucket. If you have a scanner, check the fuel trims. Check fuel pressure. Check your fuel filter too. Check the fuel lines to make sure there is no kink along it.

[darksurfr]

I am having a problem with a friend's 2002 Pathfinder I am fixing. I just changed the spark plugs and fixed some oil leaks. Spark plugs were completely warn away to the insulator. Car has about 150K on it. He didn't have any stalling issues prior but now there seems to be some odd things. I am a pretty well versed person in terms of automotive ability. I am stumped by this one but I figure those of you who are into these cars might have a better understanding of the vehicle and be able to help me out.


The car will start up and run beautifully. purrs. Out of the blue the car will stall. This will happen in gear, not in gear. while turning. while idling on level ground with no one near it. But it isn't consistent. I can drive it around and have no issues for 10 minutes and then have it stall 20 seconds apart. After it stalls, it is very difficult to get it to restart. Once it does restart i have to rev the engine up to get it to stay running and it sounds like lots of lifters collapsed. As soon as that lifter noise goes away the car runs beautifully again. like it never happened. The running rough seems like multiple cylinder missing but not really sure why it could go from running smoothly to stalling and running like garbage so instantly.

I put a video of it happening on youtube.
you can hear the "lifter" sound for a fraction of a second in the video. Sometimes this takes a couple of seconds to clear up.
I understand that reving it like that with that noise isn't a good thing to do but when it first died like this I walked away from it for a bit and came back and it seemed to rough start and not have the noise.

https://youtu.be/Y-7dsEOXkYM

any help would be greatly appreciated.

you have a fuel delivery issue. Your fuel pump is about kicking the bucket. If you have a scanner, check the fuel trims. Check fuel pressure. Check your fuel filter too. Check the fuel lines to make sure there is no kink along it.

You seem pretty positive on this. Has anyone seen a fuel pump go bad on this vehicle? 150K? Going to change the fuel filter today.

[chukel]

you have a fuel delivery issue. Your fuel pump is about kicking the bucket. If you have a scanner, check the fuel trims. Check fuel pressure. Check your fuel filter too. Check the fuel lines to make sure there is no kink along it.

You seem pretty positive on this. Has anyone seen a fuel pump go bad on this vehicle? 150K? Going to change the fuel filter today.

yes. Fuel pump issues usually don't throw codes. U diagnose it using fuel pressure gauge and comparing with normal value and/or fuel trims as seen on scanner. Moreover those symptoms are those of fuel delivery problems. I bet your fuel pressure is below normal.

[darksurfr]

You seem pretty positive on this. Has anyone seen a fuel pump go bad on this vehicle? 150K? Going to change the fuel filter today.

yes. Fuel pump issues usually don't throw codes. U diagnose it using fuel pressure gauge and comparing with normal value and/or fuel trims as seen on scanner. Moreover those symptoms are those of fuel delivery problems. I bet your fuel pressure is below normal.

Yea that was one of the ideas that I was having but I don't have a great way on this car to test fuel pressure. No Schroeder valve to test on and I am not sure I want to mess with old hoses in the engine bay IF I don't have to. I will keep everyone informed of the issue. If I solve it I will make the video public on youtube with a different title to help others that may come across this issue.

Thanks for the quick replies ladies/gents. I appreciate the quick responses to help me take care of this and get this car back to its owner ASAP.

[chukel]

Lemme derail a bit. How possible is it to get cheap 02 Qx4 fog lights and left side headlamp from junk yard

[darksurfr]

So changed the fuel filter. Not too much better but maybe a bit. Still the original at 168K. lots of crap in it.
LTFT on bank 1 is -0.8 on bank 2 -1.6 at 2K rpm. Ran it like that for a bit and it started to die and get the loud lifter tick ( and every once in a while while running smooth i can hear some lean pinging) and when it started to die the LTFT on bank 2 went to 3%+ Bank 1 went to 0.

So still leaning towards fuel pump but the fuel pump does keep running even when it dies. Had a stethoscope on the top of the feed line on the fuel pump hat. Seem to hum away as though it was good. Not really sure if I want to throw $100 at this thing with no results. Is there any good way to read fuel pressure? Do I do it at the tank with some inline fitting?

[darksurfr]

wasn't the fuel pump. Got a new one. Installed it with ease. maybe 40 minutes (and only because I had to struggle with that clip on the bottom of the tank.) started it up. seemed to run nice. fuel trims (long term) were at 0. stalled. I am really bothered by this whole thing.

[MisterH]

Re-reading the list of fixes you've done and fuel trim test readings it seems pretty clear that the poor running condition is intermittent and unpredictable. Whenever a modern vehicle behaves that way it almost always means electrical; as in faulty sensors or unstable running voltages that make sensors behave oddly. You don't have a mechanical component failure. For example, if you had an intake leak somewhere it would be constant.

I would test the MAF sensor next.

[darksurfr]

Re-reading the list of fixes you've done and fuel trim test readings it seems pretty clear that the poor running condition is intermittent and unpredictable. Whenever a modern vehicle behaves that way it almost always means electrical; as in faulty sensors or unstable running voltages that make sensors behave oddly. You don't have a mechanical component failure. For example, if you had an intake leak somewhere it would be constant.

I would test the MAF sensor next.

Test or clean? I appreciate the direction.

[1998Baja]

i believe if you start the vehicle and unplug the maf sensor and it dies right away your sensor is good, but if it keeps running it is bad. they do sell a cleaner in spray form at auto parts stores.

[darksurfr]

i believe if you start the vehicle and unplug the maf sensor and it dies right away your sensor is good, but if it keeps running it is bad. they do sell a cleaner in spray form at auto parts stores.

That isn't entirely true. All cars go into a limp mode and go to an open loop table based on engine rpm and throttle position. the car might die but just from the suddenness of unplugging it while running. you car will still run and drive without a maf but blow through fuel.

[darksurfr]

My biggest question is the noise being created after a restart when it dies, is that from multiple cylinders not getting fuel or is it from something else?

[MisterH]

Re-reading the list of fixes you've done and fuel trim test readings it seems pretty clear that the poor running condition is intermittent and unpredictable. Whenever a modern vehicle behaves that way it almost always means electrical; as in faulty sensors or unstable running voltages that make sensors behave oddly. You don't have a mechanical component failure. For example, if you had an intake leak somewhere it would be constant.

I would test the MAF sensor next.

Test or clean? I appreciate the direction.

I would test first with multimeter. You downloaded the FSM for it? It shows the diagnostic procedure in the EC section. For extra visual context there are quite a few youtube videos that run through it for various years and models of Nissan vehicles.

[darksurfr]

I believe it is a lifter for one of the cylinders that is collapsed and then not and causing the engine to be running poorly on 5 cylinders.