1997 Q45 Repairs Plan

[airman]

Hi Folks,

I have 97 Q45t which I bought at about 85K miles few years ago with pretty good maintenance history (not stellar, but good). I've been maintaining it since then by this board standards (fluids changes, flushes, preventive maintenance etc., OEM parts replacement). It's been serving me good until recently where I guess age started to show up (it's coming at 200K now). Last year had to replace radiator completely due to leak in it, this year installed new steering rack, and now it started to misfire at idle. It was pronounced misfire, like one cylinder not firing consistently but no CEL light at all, plus burning sulfur smell from exhaust. I immediately brought to Infiniti center and here's what came out:

Injector #4 Weak: Recommend replacement $680
Ignition coils: Recommend replacement $1015
Spark plugs: One is bad, but all due time wise, so recommend replacement $350
EGI harness: Recommend replacement (age) $2200

Of course, these are dealer prices with their parts. I can save a bit by ordering somewhere else but still it's pretty hefty bill.

Tech replaced bad spark plug just for testing and car stopped misfiring. So apparently this was the weakest part in the chain. I will definitely replace all spark plugs and ignition coils but there is a question about injectors. As long as I've been reading this board I haven't seen many injector failures on this model. Most misfire cases end up being coils, censors or some other superficial reasons. So, I'm not sure how critical this item is, given that I'm not going to hold on to the car for more than 3 years I think. He recommends replacing all injectors because if one goes other will follow soon.

Regarding EGI harness, there is a concern about its age and the fact it was not installed properly during valve gasket replacement. This job was done by local mechanic, who is member of this board and well regarded here so I will not mention his name. Unfortunately he did not do good job putting things back together. He installed harness improperly, putting it through wrong places, close to hot engine elements, missing a lot of fasteners, over bending etc. So it was my mistake to trust him and after I never took q45 to anyone other than certified Infiniti tech. They guy who works on my car at dealership is fantastic - very meticulous, educated, always shows what he is about to do, explains why, and what options we have. So, I'm happy to take car to this service center in spite of high price I have confidence in the skills. I usually buy parts from Joe, so it comes out cheaper.

Anyways, the question is should I do minimum plan just to get it running or go full throttle and replace everything.
Minimum plan:
- Replace coils
- Spark plugs
- Injector #4 - even this is under question, based on experience here. May be just do the BG injection cleaning service.
Drive 2-3 years and get another car. This option is under 3K and I'm sure that transmission will last that long. So this sounds like a safe investment.

Maximum plan:
Replace everything and drive car for another 5 years:
- Coils, plugs, injectors (all) EGI harness
I would go for this, but I'm not sure when transmission will go. So it's like sinking 5-6K in uncertainty.

Alternative plan:
Replace plugs, injector flush and sell or trade-in for something more fun, like Toyota Yaris. Seriously, I don't need that much of a car. Wife has a minivan and I don't drive much, I mostly fly. I use car to get to the airport and back once a week.

Thanks in advance!

[vponcho]

That's a butload of money, man. I usually always do the minimum plan but sometimes it's detrimental as you may have to go back to where you just were and replace additional $$$ parts. So I'd sell your car... but not go for a Yaris. That thing is uninspiring box. Good luck.

[qship96]

Airman, what State do you live in? Depending on your location,we may have great independent Infiniti techs near you that could do your required repairs for much cheaper than your local dealer

[airman]

DFW, TX

Airman, what State do you live in? Depending on your location,we may have great independent Infiniti techs near you that could do your required repairs for much cheaper than your local dealer

[Rex]

Doing plugs while replacing ignition coils shouldn't add much labor, but I think that's something most can do them selves with "simple tools". The back ones are hard to get to on the G50, I'd bet the same applies here. Maybe you could do the forward 3 on each side and pay dealer labor rates for the back ones??

I'd do coils & plugs, observe, then determine if the injectors really need work.

[qship96]

Doing plugs while replacing ignition coils shouldn't add much labor, but I think that's something most can do them selves with "simple tools". The back ones are hard to get to on the G50, I'd bet the same applies here. Maybe you could do the forward 3 on each side and pay dealer labor rates for the back ones??

I'd do coils & plugs, observe, then determine if the injectors really need work.

Totally agree with above approach,and if harness is not burned or shorted out, why not re-route it instead of replacing it?


Maybe Brian {MAXNIX} will chime in with a local tech recommendation.

[airman]

The tech is afraid it will break during re-routing. It may become brittle due to age and heat.

Totally agree with above approach,and if harness is not burned or shorted out, why not re-route it instead of replacing it?
Maybe Brian {MAXNIX} will chime in with a local tech recommendation.

[BadQ45t]

You don't drive it much and it is coming up on 200k? Well my thoughts are you are at a cross-road here, frankly I think if really the only thing you do is drive back and forth to the airport it might be time for a Yaris. If you keep it my suggestions:

You HAVE to get out of the dealership, the parts can be sourced out of Infiniti of Scottsdale at 1/4-1/3 off retail
You have to find a 3rd party mechanic that does work with pride and doesn't charge you for the overhead of the coffee, fancy waiting room etc.
You will have to really make sure you do everything at one shot when you have everything torn apart.

If you're not game to drop the 2-3k on the thing, dump it and buy yourself a Yaris and call it day.

[airman]

It used drive a lot when it was the only car in the family. Then I drove it around a country. My driving patterns changed drastically in the last couple of years.

You don't drive it much and it is coming up on 200k? Well my thoughts are you are at a cross-road here, frankly I think if really the only thing you do is drive back and forth to the airport it might be time for a Yaris.

Yes, I always buy parts from Scottsdale. Like I mentioned my experience with independent tech was not good. If someone has recommendations I may consider but I'm leery.

If you keep it my suggestions:

You HAVE to get out of the dealership, the parts can be sourced out of Infiniti of Scottsdale at 1/4-1/3 off retail
You have to find a 3rd party mechanic that does work with pride and doesn't charge you for the overhead of the coffee, fancy waiting room etc.
You will have to really make sure you do everything at one shot when you have everything torn apart.

If you're not game to drop the 2-3k on the thing, dump it and buy yourself a Yaris and call it day.

[BadQ45t]

i hear you, I was there myself in the past when I knew of nobody but the locals stealership and went there for safety sake. Maybe someone can chime in, but given your new driving pattern it might be time to take that car out and put her out of her misery.......past 200k it would be alot of $$$ to keep it in good shape, but one thing I can say, there ain't no comparo between driving a good Q and a Yaris...I'm reminded of that this week as i am driving a Nissan Altima as a rental Great figgin' car, rides great, awesome gas mileage, etc but not the ride and feel.

[airman]

Getting it running is still cheaper than buying new I guess. So, I'm going with compromise: coils, sparks and one injector, since tech insists it's bad. He will do cylinder compression test at the same time.

As far as driving other cars, I've driven a lot different models during business trips lately. I was really impressed by Volvo S60 T5. But since my mission is so minimilastic Yaris should do just fine, otherwise I heard good things about Ford Fiesta.

i hear you, I was there myself in the past when I knew of nobody but the locals stealership and went there for safety sake. Maybe someone can chime in, but given your new driving pattern it might be time to take that car out and put her out of her misery.......past 200k it would be alot of $$$ to keep it in good shape, but one thing I can say, there ain't no comparo between driving a good Q and a Yaris...I'm reminded of that this week as i am driving a Nissan Altima as a rental Great figgin' car, rides great, awesome gas mileage, etc but not the ride and feel.

[elwesso]

Based on G50 injector experience, which is far more comprehensive than Y33's (due to the Y33's injectors being significantly more reliable), they almost always fail because they are either electrically shorted out or open circuit (most commonly the latter). I'd ask for some proof on why they think its bad, IMO a power balance test is NOT good enough especially considering coil packs are significantly more common on those cars.

I agree with Jeff though. IF you're gonna keep this car, and you don't do any work yourself you HAVE to get away from the dealers. I've seen many instances where they charge OVER MSRP for parts, and labor rates are significantly higher than independent shops.

I understand your concerns with independent mechanics but the same can be said for dealers. Many have had very bad experiences with dealers too.. I am very skeptical about what you're saying blaming the independent mechanic. Fact of the matter is most any electrical harness from a 1997 Q45 under the hood is going to be very brittle. The harnesses are such a length that they really CANT go in the wrong place. I could understand maybe bending it too far to crack it in places but sometimes you have no choice when doing these sorts of repairs.

I think the dealer is full of hot air on the injector and the EGI harness. The harness is a way for them to cover their a$$ in case they break something, and make a pretty penny on a repair.

If you insist on the dealer, I'd suggest trying to haggle them on the parts. Joe charges I believe 20% below MSRP (which still is a nice net profit over dealer cost for said parts), so if they matched that you'd be saving yourself the same money.

[airman]

Thanks, for chiming in, Wes.

Based on G50 injector experience, which is far more comprehensive than Y33's (due to the Y33's injectors being significantly more reliable), they almost always fail because they are either electrically shorted out or open circuit (most commonly the latter). I'd ask for some proof on why they think its bad, IMO a power balance test is NOT good enough especially considering coil packs are significantly more common on those cars.

Understood. What is the good test for the injector? Tomorrow they coming back with estimates and I'm going to discuss with them repairs plan. Cust rep mentioned something about compression test, I have no idea why?

I agree with Jeff though. IF you're gonna keep this car, and you don't do any work yourself you HAVE to get away from the dealers. I've seen many instances where they charge OVER MSRP for parts, and labor rates are significantly higher than independent shops.

In this case I have more luck with _this_ dealer so far.

I understand your concerns with independent mechanics but the same can be said for dealers. Many have had very bad experiences with dealers too..

Agree.

I am very skeptical about what you're saying blaming the independent mechanic. Fact of the matter is most any electrical harness from a 1997 Q45 under the hood is going to be very brittle. The harnesses are such a length that they really CANT go in the wrong place. I could understand maybe bending it too far to crack it in places but sometimes you have no choice when doing these sorts of repairs.

Unfortunately, it's a fact. Infiniti tech showed me the mess left from other guy: I saw missing fasteners, bent over harness, and he even cut some part because it was on the way and he did not know what to do with it.

I think the dealer is full of hot air on the injector and the EGI harness. The harness is a way for them to cover their a$$ in case they break something, and make a pretty penny on a repair.

Full or not, he just would not guarantee trouble free operation after re-routing older harness. If we do that, the recommendation is to get a new one, but he does not insist. Sounds to me like it's better not to touch it. I'm still debating this. Advice?

If you insist on the dealer, I'd suggest trying to haggle them on the parts. Joe charges I believe 20% below MSRP (which still is a nice net profit over dealer cost for said parts), so if they matched that you'd be saving yourself the same money.

They matched Joe's parts and will provide reasonable labor estimate taking into consideration compound effect of coil packs and spark plugs replacement at the same time.

[airman]

Dumping the car right now kind of sucks. I installed new radiator last summer. Recently, new PS pump and completely rebuilt PS rack. So technically, it probably makes sense to keep it for a couple of years. If I can do on that a 2K per year, still cheaper than any compact.

i hear you, I was there myself in the past when I knew of nobody but the locals stealership and went there for safety sake. Maybe someone can chime in, but given your new driving pattern it might be time to take that car out and put her out of her misery.......past 200k it would be alot of $$$ to keep it in good shape, but one thing I can say, there ain't no comparo between driving a good Q and a Yaris...I'm reminded of that this week as i am driving a Nissan Altima as a rental Great figgin' car, rides great, awesome gas mileage, etc but not the ride and feel.

[airman]

Replaced spark plugs, coils, one injector and it's been running for an year as new. The dealer matched parts prices did an excellent job installing them.

[maxnix]

Great to hear.