1994 q45 seat belt tensioners

[sancem]

Last Friday while pulling out of a parking lot after being parked for a while my q45's air bag and seat belt dash lights stayed on after start up. A few seconds later the seat belt tensioners went off. The airbags did not go off but the dash lights for both seat belts and air bags remain on. What could have caused this? Is this common? Any advice before I visit the dealer?

[elwesso]

Ive heard of this before..... It happened to a contact of mine, on his 94 Q... I think he said they spilled something on the center console, and it caused that... The airbag control unit is right down there...

If you didnt get in a wreck the dealer should replace since its a restraint system...

[Q45tech]

$1000-$2,000 minimum education on the EVILS of cup holders and drinking and driving.

About 50/50 as to whether an owner drilled into console or spilled something. We usually see a few per year now pretty much equally divided.

[sancem]

Why so expensive? What's involved workwise? parts wise?

[Q45tech]

Seat belt Tensioners are single use gas explosive charged and must be replaced and usually the air bag computer.

[sancem]

Dennis, what sort of labor is required? How many hours?

[Q45tech]

3-4 hours unless diagnostics required. Replacing the under console computer is the expensive part if required.

[sancem]

I have inquired and the parts are a fortune so your initial estimate is not far off the mark.

Here is my new question: If you were me would you bother to fix them?

I am not planning to sell the car. Do I have to repair from a safety point of view? Why can't we just drive the car with pre-tensioned seat bealts in the front? It's a bit tight to put them on but after that they are fine. The car has 160,000 kms (100,000 miles)

What's the right cost effective answer to my situation?

[elwesso]

You can buy my old ones, i have all the stuff available, and the car has never been in a wreck!

[sancem]

Thanks Wes. My mechanic is not too hapy about used parts and mentioned liability if they ended not working in an accident.

My question to you Denis remains.

If you were me would you bother to fix them?

I am not planning to sell the car. Do I have to repair from a safety point of view? Why can't we just drive the car with pre-tensioned seat bealts in the front? It's a bit tight to put them on but after that they are fine. The car has 160,000 kms (100,000 miles)

What's the right cost effective answer to my situation?

[Q45tech]

The question is do the air bags work after a misfired tensioner? Don't have a clue.You never told us what liquid or drill bit caused them to fire.

[sancem]

In your initial response you wrote "education on the EVILS of cup holders and drinking and driving"....

For the record, there was no drilling. There was, however, spilled liquid .

I am by no means a mechanic but why would the airbags no longer work just because the tensioners went off? There was no collision; they simply went off (presumably because a seat belt sensor between the seats got wet - a place where - i believe - no airbag sensor is situated).

Thanks.

[Q45tech]

The combo air bag/tensioner computer is there and obviously the liquid shorted out something on the EXPENSIVE multilayer circuit boards..........this unit will have to be replaced. I assume the whole computer is toast. Have seen them were the tensioners and both air bags go off [very rare], you were just lucky.

[sancem]

Alright so here is what I'd like your input on: If you were me would you bother to fix them?

I am not planning to sell the car. Do I have to repair from a safety point of view? Why can't I just drive the car with pre-tensioned seat bealts in the front? It's a bit tight to put them on but after that they are fine. The car has 160,000 kms (100,000 miles)

What's the right cost effective solution to my situation?

[Q45tech]

The question is insurance fraud, as your insurance discount is based on 2 working air bags and seat belt tensioners. Passenger liability, if they see the air bag, they assume it works. But then again I drive a 90 without a passenger air bag and no explosive pre tensioner belts with a 15 year old drivers bag that may explode into confetti due to age if it works at all.

For the price of the repair you could probably install a roll bar type attachment and 4 point harness passenger racing harness.

[sancem]

I don't know what your actually recommending in your last post but I have an appointment to get an estimate of the repairs required.

Someone has mentioned that seat belts are guaranteed for the life of the vehicle.

Is that true?

Is that just the actual seat belts or could it include the pre-tensioner system?

Thanks.

[Q45tech]

But not from intentional abuse by spilling something or drilling. The manual seat belt belt portion only..........warranty mostly applies to 90-93 where the latch had an age problem and the spring was slow to retract.

[sancem]

The dealer has replaced both seat belts free of charge (apparently the dealer was paid by Infiniti). However the airbag light and the seat belt light on the dashboard were not shut off.

I have called to ask about this and the dealer indicated the tech had not been able to shut them off when the belts were replaced and that this would require diagnostic work to be performed and they had to check with Infiniti to see if that work is considered part of the seatbelt replacement and therefore covered by Infinti or whether I have to pay for that myself.

Does this make sense to you?

[sancem]

I heard back from the dealer who replaced both seat belts free of charge (apparently the dealer was paid by Infiniti).

You will recall that the airbag light and the seat belt light on the dashboard were not shut off when the belts were replaced.

The dealer has indicated that this requires diagnostic work to be performed and Infiniti does not consider the work to part of the seatbelt replacement.

Your advice? Thanks

[sancem]

I heard back from the dealer who replaced both seat belts free of charge (apparently the dealer was paid by Infiniti). You will recall that the airbag light and the seat belt light on the dashboard were not shut off when the belts were replaced.

The dealer has indicated that this requires diagnostic work to be performed and Infiniti does not consider the work to part of the seatbelt replacement.

Your advice? Thanks

[sancem]

Dennis I've been waiting patiently for a reply for tow freaking years. Any chance I'll hear from you???

[Q45tech]

As I said earlier, I would NOT cover the system at all when there was evidence of owner caused destruction.............when you open the air/bag seat belt ecu you can easily see if liquid were involved.

I am amazed that they persuaded Nissan to cover the belts.........they [dealer] manipulated the wording and spirit/purpose of the orginal seat belt recall warranty to try to help you but then they realized who caused the damage.

Just like planes bring no beverages aboard or suffer the consequences.

[maxnix]

Not a very difficult concept here.

Owner/operator spills beverage. Unit fails. Operation of unit is compromised.

Who is liable? Owner/Operator.

Only question remaining, does Owner/Operator accept liability for his actions? Technician and dealer wisely won't.
Modified by maxnix at 11:59 AM 9/1/2006

[Q45tech]

The other legal situation is that the legal life of a vehicle or any of its components [or the design liability] is 100,000 miles or 10 years period -----------------no if ands or buts.

If the car doesn't intentionally kill you before 100k they are off the hook. The courts will not accept lawsuits after those dates/mileages.

[sancem]

Q45 Tech,

Thanks for getting back to me but the problem with the dealer doing the work to determine if liquid was involved is that diagnosis still has to be paid for. I frankly don't think it was liquid by the way but I can't say for sure as I have spilled coffee on occassion in the car... Liquid was the lesser of two options I was offered - liquid or drilling. No liquid was spilled within a week of this happening but liquid had and has been spilt in that area since it is near the cupholders.

In terms of the ten years, the seatbelts are "lifetime" in Canada and I don't know if anyone was misled or anything. They were not retracting after the explosive charge deployed and they have to retract freely. Infiniti honoured the lifetime warranty. The problem is really academic since two years have passed and at this point I don't care overly.

By the way, I wasn't planning on suing anybody although I happen to be a lawyer and judging from your comments you and maxnix clearly are not...