So I put a junkyard motor in a year or so ago. Now I'm hearing very noisy top end, clack clack clack...varies with RPM, worryine me. Anyone have any suggestions? Just got an oil change no difference.

Sounds like lifters or HLA noise to me. Might be worth trying some cleaners or Marvel Mystery Oil... just go slow with it. If you have sludge you don't want to loosen a bunch up at one time and cause a major blockage.

Heath

I'll grab some Marvel's today. Can you clarifygo easy?". Are you saying low rpm's, less Marvel, less time in engine...?

Grabbed some STP additive and Marvel replacment. Just got an oil change a few days ago, so figured I'd start with the additive. I am amazed - in 15 miles it went from sounding HORRIBLE to virtually nonexistent. I'm going to run this for a day or two, drain a quart of oil, add the marvel, and another change a week later.

Can't believe how fast it "fixed" it. Just hope it's not masking a larger issue.

Few days later -

Cold start - OK. After running a while, just as clackety and loud as before.

Going to sub in a quart of Marvel's and see how that does for a week.

Hope I haven't sustained valve damage.

Jack - Did the STP (as I remember it from the 60s and Andy Granatelli days) thicken the oil? What type of oil is mixed with the STP?

Is the noise mostly at idle or appears come and go as engine RPMs decrease?

Is there is a timing chain guide that bolts to the head between the intake and exhaust cam?

Remember when I had a noise that sounded like a lifter that was caused by timing chain (slack) when as chain would slap the back of the head mounted guide at idle on the VH45DE. Remember the "got ticks" thread?

It turned out to be a partially clogged upper tensioner oil port. A piece of misapplied RTV that was blocking the tensioner's oil port flow. Also, I had a similar ticking noise surface on the VQ30DE from a worn tensioner that would not hold pressure to remove chain slack when the engine was cold or in certain rev up situations. Fortunately the VQ30DE tensioner was accessible for replacement through a small access door for replaced without pulling the timing chain cover. Actually a TSB was issued some years back about the VQ30DE tensioner allowing chain slack/slap to make a tapping/ticking noise.

If thickening the oil seems to remedy the noise, the thicker oil might be helping a worn tensioner seal build sufficient pressure to remove timing chain slack that would otherwise allow the chain to slap one of the outer guides.

Looking back I think it was good those head mounted guides were there to make noise from a chain slap in the event the chain develops a lot of slack (due to a failing tensioner) to warn an owner or a mechanic of an loose chain issue before it jumps gears.

Thanks for the great post OwnerCS.

Yes - it did thicken the oil. It was some thick stuff.

Seems to happen worse at idle, but could be my ears.

Really not sure on the timing chain guide - I've replaced the engine, but never cracked into it.

I'm thinking if it was the chain, I would hear it fewer times per engine cycle. Seems to me that I can hear it on all cylinders. Did you hear it with every piston cycle or less, what kind of frequency did you experience?

Jack -

The noise was at mostly idle on the Q and at idle and during rev up on the VQ30DE. It was a sharp tapping noise that sounds like it was the HLA on driver side cylinders near the front. The noise sounded so much like a HLA on the VH45DE that went through several rounds of Exotic engine HLA cleaner, Marvel mystery oil, snake oil, you name it.

I've seen sticky/noisy lifters need thinner oil or a high detergent thinner additive like Rislone to enter clogged passage areas. Which side does the noise seem to be located?

Damn...that does sound similar. What would be involved in my replacing this guide?

It is the tensioner.. If on the drivers side -- there may be a top access. Ill post a pic of the location the the VH45.

The upper driver side tensioner is the part in the middle between the two timing chain upper covers below.

There is an o-ring on the tensioner about mid-way up that is used to hold oil pressure.



The hole in the right cover with the two stud bolts is where the tensioner drops in from the top.

Always use a NEW gasket after removing the tensioner.

I see. Can I replace this part without removing the chain? *fingers crossed*

Update - I seem to have resolved the issue.

1) I ran some STP additive (thick as sludge) for a bit, changed oil. Subsided for a short while.
2) I ran some marvels, same result.
3) Today I ran some Napa motor flush, very thin stuff, and refilled with mobil 0w30, so far so good.

EDIT: I also tried a heavier oil as some had suggested, though I didn't think it would help. It helped for a very short while and then nothing.

I was at the junkyard recently and saw a 1994 Q45. I took whatever I could find off it. I also got a chance to see what the left? (Drivers side) timing tensioner looks like. I took it off and saw in more detail what Craig is talking about. The only think I am not sure about is when you remove it does the timing chain move? In other words can anyone take the tensioner off, look inside the covers then put the tensioner back in (with new seals of course)?

What is that NAPA flush, Jack?

Hmmm...I already tossed the container but next time I'm in I'll take a look. $7.99

Infinitiguy19 wrote:In other words can anyone take the tensioner off, look inside the covers then put the tensioner back in (with new seals of course)

Yep.. I've had the tensioners out of both the VH45DE and VQ30DE and back without the chain jumping. I think the guide keeps the chain in place while the tensioner is being replaced.

OK, I'm very bumed out. 300 mi of driving silent engine no taps. Started car this afternoon and heard it lightly for a second. Went away in a few seconds. Started car again two hours later, heard it lightly. Stayed quiet but audible for five mins. Now I'm at op temp and it's gone, but why after 200-300 miles each time I've changed oil does it come back????

I used one of those engine flush additives from autozone, and I had really good luck.

http://www.autozone.com/autozone/access ... 523555_0_0_

I did this during an oil change. I drained my old oil out (did not replace the filter), refilled with some cheap oil, ran the car a little bit to get the oil to operating temperature, then added the stuff per the instructions (idle for 10 mins or so). It was really thin, kinda like paint thinner.

Anyway, after running with brand new clean oil, the old oil came out looking really dirty again. I would say it worked well because just recently I changed my oil again after about 7k miles (on synthetic) and the oil still had some amber color to it, where before it was much darker. I was pretty pleased with the results.

Note that since I've owned the car I've always run good oil and changed it regularly, however I did many years of short trip city driving and I think that's what really made the engine dirty.

I think you could really clean your engine up if you did an oil change like this every week for a month.

Thanks for the input. That's been my plan, and I've been running additives between oil changes for the last month (3 oil changes). Each time it went away briefly.

The last time instead of an additive I ran a flush as you suggested, it was also very thin. I felt best about this solution. Ran that, drained it, and put the Mobil syn in.

I plan on doing as you suggested above and will keep everybody posted; hopefully I can get this thing cleaned up.

paranoidjack wrote:Thanks for the input. That's been my plan, and I've been running additives between oil changes for the last month (3 oil changes). Each time it went away briefly.

The last time instead of an additive I ran a flush as you suggested, it was also very thin. I felt best about this solution. Ran that, drained it, and put the Mobil syn in.

I plan on doing as you suggested above and will keep everybody posted; hopefully I can get this thing cleaned up.

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Good luck with your quest. I had the same issue and chased that noise for almost 2 years with no long term success. In my experience, once that internal varnish or sludge breaks free and clogs up the oil passages reducing oil flow to the affected HLA, it is a done deal. you can read all my threads and posts on this topic. I literally tried everything and finally ended up changing engines to kill two bird with one stone (lifter noise and failed coilpacks). After all that, it never leaked a drop of oil or had any blow by, just sounded like a POS.

If you have any questions, shoot me a message and I will assist in whatever way I can. I know these engines are well built with extremely tight tolerances, but they must be properly maintained or this annoying problem is the end result.

Thanks man. fingers crossed.

After 20 min trips, the noise subsides totally. I think I may be winning this one.

Also a regimen of high detergent oil certified for use in diesels, BG Quick Clean (for crankcases) immediately before changing the filter may help.

Don't know if envirolution is still around.

I am not too sure I would trust a Envirolution engine flush. Seems sort of scary to run a engine like they do with that machine. Have you had one done that made any difference Brian?

UPDATE:

I think I'm beating this tick. Since my last change and flush it has subsided drastically.

On what I THOUGHT was an unrelated issue, sometimes my car runs real rough. Intermittent - hot, cold. Sometimes idling fine and then I can feel it "switch" to rough running. I figured it was coil packs.

So the other day, I swapped out one side of packs with some from my old motor. Mind you they are old as hell also. Car ran much, much worse. Swapped my coils back to this motor, and oddly enough, though my car runs instead of 80% of the time fine and 20% of the time like crap, now it runs 99% fine, only felt that same rough running briefly once. However, now I'm also throwing a p1320 code.

I can't help but wonder how removing the coils and reinstalling them has created this code, or moreso, how it's now running better than ever AND tripping the code? Very odd indeed.

Anyway, due to the ticking I was experiencing and as suggested by code p1320, I am going to do an oil pressure check. I know this involves removing the sender switch and installing the gauge.

I seem to remember reading a special tool was required to remove the switch, though the FSM doesn't indicate that a special tool is required. Perhaps it was on the G50 I read. Anyway, does anyone know a) if a tool is required, and b) what the hell is going on, and how removing and reinstalling the same coils could make the car run better, AND trip the code?

Some bizarre events here indeed!

Pictures of the tool and how I removed mine in the following thread.

oil-pressure-test-tips-for-success-request-t524522.html

Thanks! I appreciate the link and info.

Infinitiguy19 wrote:I am not too sure I would trust a Envirolution engine flush. Seems sort of scary to run a engine like they do with that machine. Have you had one done that made any difference Brian?

Yep. all of mine. Work\s good but serious sludge will require multiple flushes.

I'm driving around today, no problems at all... Downshift coming up to a light and notice some stumble and stuck my head towards the window to hear what sounded like horses clickety clanking down the street. Dammit, it's my car! Number 1 or 3 cylinder, or both. I was suppose to tune on the 28th. This pisses me off. It's loud. Ive tried the Gunk-Valve cleaner s***, followed the directions, but nothing. This SUCKS! Cars sitting, guess I'll yank the cover. I don't feel comfortable driving it, more less tuning it. About 2000 miles on this engine so far.

Q-zilla, could it be gummed up lifters? If so it would take several oil changes with several valve cleaner apps to do the trick.... here's an old Q45tech post (scroll down, all in quotes in gray)... he likes BG products:
1993-infinity-q45-engine-noise-from-the ... 59605.html

and pardon my ignorance, just throwing this out there.

Replaced 4 HLA's on cyl #1 last night, started it this am, still ticking! I'm starting to wonder if it's in the timing gear.