Could somone please assist me with identifying the difference between the RE4R03A (model number 51X79) in my 1994 Infiniti Q45 in my car and the RE4R03A (model number 51X65) spare transmission I have.
I was looking to rebuild the spare transmission and then simply do a swap until I have just noticed the difference in the model numbers.
I really need NICO members help here, so that I don't spend money rebuilding a transmission that won't be compatible with my car.
Would really appreciate some help here!
Regards
AGM
RE4R03A Transmission
Q45tech,
Thanks heaps for the reply!
Just so I am 100% clear. Can I can put the 51X65 in my 1994 Q45with no 'glitches' with the 1994 ECU?
Sorry to press the point, but do you see any problems at all in replacing my 51X79 with a 51X65?
I presume that the second gear start is a function of the ECU and not the transmission.
As you know, the gears in the 51X79 are 2.569, 1.479, 1.000 and 0.694.
Could you please advise me on what the first and second gears on the 51X65 are.
Would it be a correct assumption of me to assume that the lower first and second gears in the 51X65 would assist in quicker acceleration due to the lower ratio to the first two gears.
Finally, are the 51X65 and 51X79 the only RE4R03A transmissions used in the first and second generation Q's?
Regards
AGM
Thanks heaps for the reply!
Just so I am 100% clear. Can I can put the 51X65 in my 1994 Q45with no 'glitches' with the 1994 ECU?
Sorry to press the point, but do you see any problems at all in replacing my 51X79 with a 51X65?
I presume that the second gear start is a function of the ECU and not the transmission.
As you know, the gears in the 51X79 are 2.569, 1.479, 1.000 and 0.694.
Could you please advise me on what the first and second gears on the 51X65 are.
Would it be a correct assumption of me to assume that the lower first and second gears in the 51X65 would assist in quicker acceleration due to the lower ratio to the first two gears.
Finally, are the 51X65 and 51X79 the only RE4R03A transmissions used in the first and second generation Q's?
Regards
AGM
-
Q45tech
- Moderator
- Posts: 14296
- Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2002 3:19 am
- Car: 1990 Q45 342,400 miles 22 years ownership with original engine
1995 G20t 5 speed 334,000 miles 16" 2002 wheels - 205/50/16 Sr20ve vvl
2.784 1st and 1.544 2nd in 90-93 unit.
Don't known how the earlier AT would react to the 94 transmission ecu.
The problem is the transmission ecu uses the speed sensor to deal with shifts vs load.......the 8 and 5% lower respectively might present some weird WOT shifts.........the transmission might not shift before hitting the rev limiter in 1st and 2nd.
We always put the correct transmission in the correct year car and haven't made a mistake to know what happens.
Try it and find out you can always find a 93 TCU to exchange if necessary.The 97 is quite different as the starter is on the driverside vs pass on 90-96.
Don't known how the earlier AT would react to the 94 transmission ecu.
The problem is the transmission ecu uses the speed sensor to deal with shifts vs load.......the 8 and 5% lower respectively might present some weird WOT shifts.........the transmission might not shift before hitting the rev limiter in 1st and 2nd.
We always put the correct transmission in the correct year car and haven't made a mistake to know what happens.
Try it and find out you can always find a 93 TCU to exchange if necessary.The 97 is quite different as the starter is on the driverside vs pass on 90-96.
Q45tech,
As I don't have the transmission ECU for the 51X65, I won't take the chance. Thanks for saving a possible disaster.
To the best of my knowledge, there are no 90-93 Q's in Australia so the 51X65 may be useless here.
Before I bin it, was the the 51X65 used in any other vehicle than an infiniti. ie can I sell it to somone with another vehicle that uses this transmission?
Regards
AGM
As I don't have the transmission ECU for the 51X65, I won't take the chance. Thanks for saving a possible disaster.
To the best of my knowledge, there are no 90-93 Q's in Australia so the 51X65 may be useless here.
Before I bin it, was the the 51X65 used in any other vehicle than an infiniti. ie can I sell it to somone with another vehicle that uses this transmission?
Regards
AGM
Q45tech,
When I put in the 4:11 gears in the diff, the 51X79 transmission did not like it. I ended up taking the speed pinion out temporarily and it was much better. It through up a fault code for about two minutes everytime I started the car up.
I got a custom plastic speed pinion made up with an additional two teeth from memory.
If the 51X65 has lower gears, in first and second. Do you think that playing around with the number of teeth on the pinion will avoid the hassle of changing the ECU.
Regards
AGM
When I put in the 4:11 gears in the diff, the 51X79 transmission did not like it. I ended up taking the speed pinion out temporarily and it was much better. It through up a fault code for about two minutes everytime I started the car up.
I got a custom plastic speed pinion made up with an additional two teeth from memory.
If the 51X65 has lower gears, in first and second. Do you think that playing around with the number of teeth on the pinion will avoid the hassle of changing the ECU.
Regards
AGM
Q45tech,
Thanks for confirming my thoughts about the third and fourth gears.
When I tried to order differing pinion teeth numbers, I had a bit of trouble. I assumed that the part number would be the same except for the last two digits, which appear to represent the number of teeth.
When assuming this, the pinions I got back did have the teeth number that matched the part number, but were different in width. This is why I had to make my own.
As Chally can probably vouch for, parts are very expensive for the Q45 here in Australia. The cost of making a pinion gear in the end was actually cheaper than buying a Nissan part, as absolutley everything has to be imported from Japan.
To my knowledge there are less than one hundred Q's in the whole country, so Nissan Australia does not stock ANYTHING.
Chally, correct me if I am wrong on the the number of Q's you reckon there are in OZ.
Anyway, I think the perfect solution may be a level 10 Computer Performance Upgrade
http://www.levelten.com/products_2.htm
http://www.levelten.com/computer_pts.htm
Q45tech, thanks for all your help here. It has helped me reach the decision to sell the 51X65 and buy a 51X79.
Cheers
AGM
Thanks for confirming my thoughts about the third and fourth gears.
When I tried to order differing pinion teeth numbers, I had a bit of trouble. I assumed that the part number would be the same except for the last two digits, which appear to represent the number of teeth.
When assuming this, the pinions I got back did have the teeth number that matched the part number, but were different in width. This is why I had to make my own.
As Chally can probably vouch for, parts are very expensive for the Q45 here in Australia. The cost of making a pinion gear in the end was actually cheaper than buying a Nissan part, as absolutley everything has to be imported from Japan.
To my knowledge there are less than one hundred Q's in the whole country, so Nissan Australia does not stock ANYTHING.
Chally, correct me if I am wrong on the the number of Q's you reckon there are in OZ.
Anyway, I think the perfect solution may be a level 10 Computer Performance Upgrade
http://www.levelten.com/products_2.htm
http://www.levelten.com/computer_pts.htm
Q45tech, thanks for all your help here. It has helped me reach the decision to sell the 51X65 and buy a 51X79.
Cheers
AGM
I know have have gone around in a complete circle, but I wish to check with other members if the following.
As advised by JWT, the JWT Trimode TCU is identical for 1989 - 1996.
I therefore assume that all models of RE4R03Aare operated by it.
I also assume all models of the RE4R03A have the same casing.
The only reason a 51X65 may not work in a 1994 Q45 would be due to the ECU rev limiter.
As my ECU upgrade allows me to set the rev limit, there should be NO reason why I can't replace my 51X79 with a 51X65.
Level 10 also advise that the 1989/90 RE4R03A (3102M)has a better valve body design than later transmissions.
Before I ship my 1989 Transmission to Level 10, I would be pleased if members can advise if there is something I have overlooked.
Regards
AGM
As advised by JWT, the JWT Trimode TCU is identical for 1989 - 1996.
I therefore assume that all models of RE4R03Aare operated by it.
I also assume all models of the RE4R03A have the same casing.
The only reason a 51X65 may not work in a 1994 Q45 would be due to the ECU rev limiter.
As my ECU upgrade allows me to set the rev limit, there should be NO reason why I can't replace my 51X79 with a 51X65.
Level 10 also advise that the 1989/90 RE4R03A (3102M)has a better valve body design than later transmissions.
Before I ship my 1989 Transmission to Level 10, I would be pleased if members can advise if there is something I have overlooked.
Regards
AGM
Q45tech,
I am about to ship my 1990 transmission to Level 10.My main concern is that when I get it back, it won't 'bolt up' into my 1994, when I take the 1994 Transmission out.
I know you have already stated that they have the same casing, but to be 100% sure, could you please advise if they 'bolt up' exactly the same.
Regards
AGM
I am about to ship my 1990 transmission to Level 10.My main concern is that when I get it back, it won't 'bolt up' into my 1994, when I take the 1994 Transmission out.
I know you have already stated that they have the same casing, but to be 100% sure, could you please advise if they 'bolt up' exactly the same.
Regards
AGM
-
Q45tech
- Moderator
- Posts: 14296
- Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2002 3:19 am
- Car: 1990 Q45 342,400 miles 22 years ownership with original engine
1995 G20t 5 speed 334,000 miles 16" 2002 wheels - 205/50/16 Sr20ve vvl
If you study the graphs in the FSM 90 VS. 94 you will see differences in the 1st-2nd gear shifts/rpm/speed.
As to JWT trimode you have to understand that the tcu has all these functions built in [jumpers on circuit board] and JWT is just running wires out to a 3 position switch.
What ever the software is on your tcu [sent for mods] or a substitute [tcu] is what you get........When I bought mine, out right, they asked what year and infered that there were two groups [90-93] and [94-96]...............the minor software differences inside the groups were in 4th gear lock up/release...........obviously the 91 year tcu is the worst as this year model had all the problems and early failures.
Whether it was tcu or valve body or a combo is unknown but both were changed out when a failure occurred under warranty.
Since the 90-96 engine blocks are identical both versions will bolt up.
There are no differences in the pin outs on 90-96 TCU.
As to JWT trimode you have to understand that the tcu has all these functions built in [jumpers on circuit board] and JWT is just running wires out to a 3 position switch.
What ever the software is on your tcu [sent for mods] or a substitute [tcu] is what you get........When I bought mine, out right, they asked what year and infered that there were two groups [90-93] and [94-96]...............the minor software differences inside the groups were in 4th gear lock up/release...........obviously the 91 year tcu is the worst as this year model had all the problems and early failures.
Whether it was tcu or valve body or a combo is unknown but both were changed out when a failure occurred under warranty.
Since the 90-96 engine blocks are identical both versions will bolt up.
There are no differences in the pin outs on 90-96 TCU.
Q45tech,
I am fitting the Level 10 Transmission at the moment. Is the 1990 Torque converter the same size, dimensions ect as the 1994 one?
I may have run into some problems with the billet Torque converter being to small and having a different deck height to the OEM Torque Converter, but before I get upset and start jumping up and down, I simply enquire about the differences (if any) in the 1990 versus a 1994 Torque Converter at this stage.
Regards
AGM
I am fitting the Level 10 Transmission at the moment. Is the 1990 Torque converter the same size, dimensions ect as the 1994 one?
I may have run into some problems with the billet Torque converter being to small and having a different deck height to the OEM Torque Converter, but before I get upset and start jumping up and down, I simply enquire about the differences (if any) in the 1990 versus a 1994 Torque Converter at this stage.
Regards
AGM
-
Chally
- Posts: 445
- Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2002 12:17 am
- Car: '94 Infiniti Q45
2002 Nissan Patrol 4.8L
2013 Citroen C4 (economy)
AGM, I don't know, but it is rare that Nissan changes things like that unless they have problems with the original.
If you have your old convertor, lay them side by side & check every height & dimensions.
It is the transmission & computer that turns the convertor to Lockup etc. so really they are just a passive item, so they won't work differently.
The only difference internal, maybe, is the size of the Lock up material.
Hopefull someone else knows more.
BTW, have you considered videoing the Q on the dyno for us? It'd be great to see it break traction & the output figures.
If you have your old convertor, lay them side by side & check every height & dimensions.
It is the transmission & computer that turns the convertor to Lockup etc. so really they are just a passive item, so they won't work differently.
The only difference internal, maybe, is the size of the Lock up material.
Hopefull someone else knows more.
BTW, have you considered videoing the Q on the dyno for us? It'd be great to see it break traction & the output figures.
Chally,
Thanks for the advice. The Level 10 supplied Billet Torque Converter is smaller than the OEM. I am in the process of sorting out this error with Level 10 and will advise of the outcome.
The Transmission and the idle on deceleration, are the only two things left to sort out on the car.
As soon as the car is fininshed 100% and I am happy with it, it will go in Zoom magazine and I will post pics on the site. I have not used a digital video before, so this is something I will need to organise.
Regards
AGM
Thanks for the advice. The Level 10 supplied Billet Torque Converter is smaller than the OEM. I am in the process of sorting out this error with Level 10 and will advise of the outcome.
The Transmission and the idle on deceleration, are the only two things left to sort out on the car.
As soon as the car is fininshed 100% and I am happy with it, it will go in Zoom magazine and I will post pics on the site. I have not used a digital video before, so this is something I will need to organise.
Regards
AGM
The Level 10 supplied Billet Torque Converter has a lower deck height. When you lay the Torque converter on its back it is lower than the OEM Torque Converter. ie the Level 10 Torque Converter does not reach between the input and output shafts.
I will see if I can attach a pic to explain better the above.
Regards
AGM
I will see if I can attach a pic to explain better the above.
Regards
AGM
-
Chally
- Posts: 445
- Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2002 12:17 am
- Car: '94 Infiniti Q45
2002 Nissan Patrol 4.8L
2013 Citroen C4 (economy)
Don't blame you. Send them the pics etc & have them send you the correct one with freight on them, & send the old one with them to pay freight. I'm sure they'll agree to this as it seems to be their problem.
BTW, I've been given a Mines computer & it makes the old beast a lot more driveable & moves the redline to 7,300 -7,500. (the needle is probably a bit ambitious)Seems to have more power all the way to the redline as well.
Keep us posted.Chally
BTW, I've been given a Mines computer & it makes the old beast a lot more driveable & moves the redline to 7,300 -7,500. (the needle is probably a bit ambitious)Seems to have more power all the way to the redline as well.
Keep us posted.Chally
-
sijoko
- Posts: 961
- Joined: Fri Jul 26, 2002 6:54 am
- Car: Black 1994 Infiniti Q45 Turbo, Pearl White 2014 Maxima Sport
- Contact:
AGM,
Does the converter have any part numbers or any other identification on it ? I suspect that LevelTen doesn't make their own converter, but rather it is made for them by someone else.
The only company that I know of that makes a converter for the RE4R03A is Precision Industries in Tennessee. They make a 9" model called the Dragon series that fits the Q45 90-95 models.
http://www.converter.com/dragon.htm
Hope this info is of use to you.
Regards,
sijoko
Does the converter have any part numbers or any other identification on it ? I suspect that LevelTen doesn't make their own converter, but rather it is made for them by someone else.
The only company that I know of that makes a converter for the RE4R03A is Precision Industries in Tennessee. They make a 9" model called the Dragon series that fits the Q45 90-95 models.
http://www.converter.com/dragon.htm
Hope this info is of use to you.
Regards,
sijoko