PCV Upgrades

Nissan 300ZX technical discussion forum: Maintenance, performance, installations, modifications, how-to's and troubleshooting.
User avatar
MrFeesLaw
Posts: 162
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2015 8:39 pm
Car: 1993 300zx 2+2

Post

I got started researching how to eliminate PCV horsepower loss on another post on NICOCLUB. Didn't want to jack the thread too far so I'm going to start my own.

PCV: The Basics

When the engine fires it creates what is known as "blow-by". This is when the gases from the combustion chamber "blow by" the sealing rings, and make their way into the oil pan. This is a problem, because the crankcase uses certain principals to effectively feed oil to the pump, and from there, the rest of the engine. With excess pressure, the oil does not flow correctly and the pressure can damage seals, and in extreme cases, the gas can build up to such a high pressure that the valve covers may be blown off, and other internal damage may occur.

80 years ago, this problem was solved by simply putting a hole in the crankcase or valve cover and feeding air in with a tube. The problem with this, was that gases from the combustion chamber were getting into the air without being burned, which was an emissions nightmare (If that sort of thing gives you nightmares).

The solution to this, was the PCV valve. A PCV valve is a one-way check valve that allows the crankcase gases to vent into the air intake when the pressure becomes high enough. Engine vacuum from the intake helps to pull these gases from the crankcase and into the engine to be burned. This causes several problems...

Image

The first problem caused by recirculating gases from the crankcase into the intake is that it changes the Air/Fuel Ratio being fed into the engine. Devices, such as the Mass Air Flow sensor, record the amount of matter (air) passing through them to calculate the fuel needs of the engine. These sensors, however, have no way of telling if there is fuel, or any other foreign particles in the air that is being pulled in. Therefore, and crankcase gases being pulled into this stream are not calculated by the computer, and cause the engine to run rich, causing loss of power and fuel economy.

The second problem that the PCV system introduces is pretty obvious. When you have pressure somewhere, and you release it into a non-pressurized area (or worse yet, somewhere with vacuum), whatever is in the pressurized area tends to move to the lower pressure area. This moves the crankcase gases out of the oil pan, but can also pull oil out with it! Now, loss of such a minor amount of oil would be no big deal, if it weren't being routed back into the intake. Unfortunately the oil that leaves the pan into the PCV eventually ends up in the intake, your air filter, and even the combustion chamber. This causes numerous problems, but most of all, is just a mess.

The final problem with the PCV valve is that it introduces airflow. The pressure from the crankcase comes into the intake and causes turbulence in the air traveling through your intake. Now, a certain amount of turbulence is necessary for the engine to run correctly, but this turbulence must be tuned so that the most air is sent to the engine in the most efficient way possible. The air flow from the PCV comes in at a perpendicular angle to the air flow of the intake, and slows the air travel, and changes the direction of the flow. This problem can also be seen in the reverse at idle, and during cold-starts. At these times, the crankcase may not have enough pressure to for the PCV to allow pressure to flow into the intake, and therefore the air from the intake actually can attempt to flow into the PCV. Obviously, being a one-way valve, the PCV will not allow air to flow into the crankcase, but the tube leading to the PCV allows a secondary pathway for the air to take, and disturbs turbulence and flow.



Now, if you are concerned about horsepower, and don't really care about emissions, you can simply remove the PCV. If you are looking for performance on an N/A engine that is not running high compression, this would be my recommendation:

-Remove the PCV
-Add a tube (to keep oil from splattering all over your engine)
-Add a Catch Can (optional, will collect expelled oil and particulate matter)
-Add a breather (air filter, mesh, anything that will keep particles from getting into the crankcase)

Pros:
-Does not feed into intake
-Clean look after install

Cons:
-Won't pass emissions
-Not effective in high-performance applications



Removing the PCV, with no further modifications, is not recommended for Boosted, or High-Compression applications. The higher compression involved in these applications causes more blow-by to get through into the crankcase, and the atmospheric pressure outside the engine may not create enough flow to pull these gases out fast enough, causing seal damage, or worse. For turbo/supercharged applications, or for high-compression applications, many would recommend that you buy a catch can. This will collect the oil expelled from the engine, so it does not get recirculated back into the intake. Install the catch can between the PCV and the intake system. The reason you do not remove the PCV, and do not allow the gases to vent into the air, is because the higher pressure in the crankcase of boosted (high-compressions) vehicles will likely need a vacuum to be put on them in order to remove the gases at a high enough rate as to not cause pressure build-up.

Image

Pros:
-Easy install (2 hose clamps)
-Keeps engine vacuum without complicated systems

Cons:
-Bulky looking (takes up a lot of space in the engine bay)
-Still feeds into the intake causing turbulence and adding gases to the airstream
-Does not offer much for performance benefits



More complex methods of crankcase evacuation would be vacuum pumps and exhaust evacs.



Vacuum Pumps can be either a mechanical, belt-driven pump, similar to a water pump, or power steering pump. The main purpose of these would be to create a vacuum on the crankcase, and pull the gases into the atmosphere. These pumps usually include a metering valve, which you will want to set between 12-15psi to create optimal vacuum to pull the gases from the crankcase, without causing so much vacuum as to hinder functionality of basic engine parts (such as the oil pump or crank bearings).

Image

Usually the setup would go in this order: Crankcase, to Catch Can, to Metering Valve (If not internal to the pump), to Pump, and then to Atmosphere.

Pros:
-Does not feed back into intake
-Applies set vacuum to allow for perfect flow

Cons:
-Slight parasitic draw due to power needed to run pump
-May be bulky and have unappealing appearance
-Expensive!
-Likely won't pass emissions testing



The final system of crankcase evac is the exhaust evac. This is a style of crankcase venting that uses the venturi effect (also used in carburetors) to pull the gases out of the crankcase, and into the exhaust stream. A catch can may be placed between the crankcase and the exhaust, but is usually not used, as the oil will just burn up in the exhaust. This system is widely used on Top Fuel dragsters, who have massive, open headers, which do not use the principals of back-pressure. This largely varies from our street-car exhaust, which needs back-pressure to create low-pressure areas in the headers to pull exhaust gases from the engine during valve overlap. The reason the top fuel style does not work on street-cars, is that it is just a tube. No metering, no dampening, whatever vacuum is applied to the exhaust is applied to the crankcase. When you make 8000 horsepower that is all fine and dandy, but not so much on your daily driver... Such a device on a standard exhaust would cause exhaust back-pressure to flow up the tube, and into the crankcase, causing even more pressure!

The way this is corrected is by using a one-way check valve. During the cycle between pulses of the engine, the valve remains mostly closed, allowing only slight amount of air to be drawn one way or another. But, when the exhaust is creating a vacuum, it pull the valve open and allows the crankcase to vent into the exhaust.

Image

Pros:
-Does not feed into intake
-Does not require catch can
-If your exhaust has working Catalytic converters, they will burn the crankcase gases and reduce emissions.
-Creates vacuum without causing parasitic draw
-Cheap to buy and replace
-Clean look after installed

Cons:
-Install. The install is somewhat complex, and you must know EXACTLY where to place the valve in the exhaust, or it will not work.
-Likely won't pass emissions testing



I will shortly be buying the Exhaust Evacuation setup for myself. They generally range from about $40-$60. I will do a write-up on the install, or update this thread when I get some pictures.


User avatar
evildky
Posts: 14225
Joined: Sat Jan 31, 2004 9:23 pm
Car: 71 Datsun 240ZT
87 Nissan 300ZX N/A-T
06 Nissan 350Z GT
Toyota Tundra TRD RW
Location: Louisville, KY
Contact:

Post

You are way overthinking a problem that isn't a problem. For some reason catch cans are trendy and people think they save power. PCV allows metered air as it expands to be recirculated into your intake tract, way past the air filter, between the mas and TB. If you have a measurable amount of oil coming out of your crankcase you have bad rings and need an engine rebuild. If you want to run a catch can, have at, it's a way to spend money and time and change nothing about how your car runs or how much power it makes, have at. Be sure to rotate the air in your tires and change your blinker fluid while you're at it.

User avatar
MrFeesLaw
Posts: 162
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2015 8:39 pm
Car: 1993 300zx 2+2

Post

evildky wrote:You are way overthinking a problem that isn't a problem. For some reason catch cans are trendy and people think they save power. PCV allows metered air as it expands to be recirculated into your intake tract, way past the air filter, between the mas and TB. If you have a measurable amount of oil coming out of your crankcase you have bad rings and need an engine rebuild. If you want to run a catch can, have at, it's a way to spend money and time and change nothing about how your car runs or how much power it makes, have at. Be sure to rotate the air in your tires and change your blinker fluid while you're at it.
There have actually been several studies done by high performance shops that show slight amounts of horsepower to be gained by removing the stock setup. On top of that, I never claimed it would be some magic horsepower gain. It won't be. The main reason for the delete would be to make the engine run a little smoother, keep your engine cleaner, keep turbulence flow smooth in the intake, and in high-power applications, keep from blowing your heads off.

You honestly think that having gases in the crankcase means you have bad rings? There is no such thing as a "perfect" seal. You will always have some leakage, and if you are running high compression, 10k rpms with 30psi of boost, you are definitely going to build up a ton of crankcase pressure, and you need to make sure you have a way to relieve it.

Never once said you would noticeably gain any horsepower. The reason for this mod is a cleaner and smoother running engine, and in high-power applications keep crankcase pressure down. That's all. Nothing more.

User avatar
MrFeesLaw
Posts: 162
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2015 8:39 pm
Car: 1993 300zx 2+2

Post

I've had a few people ask me about why I would remove my PCV and what gains there would be by doing so. That is the reason for this write-up. I wanted to show the pros and cons of different styles of crankcase venting. I listed a lot of cons for these that would make most people realize that half the mods listed in this thread are not going to change anything. If someone read the article and realized they changed something in their PCV system that they shouldn't have, they will hopefully be able to fix it before they make a mess. This post was not meant in any way to say that any horsepower gains of any kind would be had.

The reason I'm revamping my PCV system is so that I won't have to worry about crankcase pressure, or oil in my intake when I start running higher boost. Has nothing to do with power, or thinking it's some magic fix-all solution. It is just my personal preference to simplify the system so that I do not have to worry about pressure or an oily mess when I start making more power.

budget300zx
Posts: 199
Joined: Thu May 29, 2014 9:11 pm
Car: 90 300zx NA

Post

After I deleted mine, I ending up putting them back in, but put them inline with the front valve cover hoses that go to the intake piping (i believe only on the N/A models). you could easily just route them to a dual feed catch can or 2 separate cans with this method. as long as you run them back to the intake piping you wont have un-metered air escaping.

User avatar
MrFeesLaw
Posts: 162
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2015 8:39 pm
Car: 1993 300zx 2+2

Post

I'm not really understanding this unmetered air escaping? Are people unplugging the vacuum line and leaving an open hole in their intake piping? They have plugs for that.

budget300zx
Posts: 199
Joined: Thu May 29, 2014 9:11 pm
Car: 90 300zx NA

Post

that or using a breather without also removing the front valve cover lines and capping them off as well. most write ups are for twin turbos. not deleting the whole system causes unmetered air. some also argue blow by is considered unmetered but even so that would be minute.

In my case the engine ran and accelerated better with pcv valves. the amount of "blow by oil" was also reduced with pcv valves in place.

User avatar
MrFeesLaw
Posts: 162
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2015 8:39 pm
Car: 1993 300zx 2+2

Post

budget300zx wrote:that or using a breather without also removing the front valve cover lines and capping them off as well. most write ups are for twin turbos. not deleting the whole system causes unmetered air. some also argue blow by is considered unmetered but even so that would be minute.

In my case the engine ran and accelerated better with pcv valves. the amount of "blow by oil" was also reduced with pcv valves in place.
If you completely remove the PCV you will see the most change, but it isn't always good. That's the reason for my write-up. A lot of people think they can just rip it off and it is some magic horsepower fix. It really isn't. You may get a smoother idle depending on what you did to remove or replace the PCV, and many of the fixes will keep oil out of the intake, but some of them may require a tuning, or vacuum lines to be replaced or hoses plugged in order for the vehicle to function at all. Again, this mod is mainly meant for people planning HIGH horsepower applications. Like 500+ hp trying to keep their crankcase from building pressure and dumping oil into the intake.

Deleting the PCV won't do much (if anything) for a stock N/A, and may actually Hurt performance on a stock TT. The point of this post was just to inform people about the different types of PCV replacements and modifications so that they could make an informed decision based on their car's needs. It was in no way intended to say that everyone should remove their PCV.

Hopefully if anyone is having trouble after modifying their PCV system, they can look at this thread and figure out what they did wrong.


Return to “300ZX (Z32) Technical”