Hello all. So excited to be in a cube - even if I'm experiencing my first issue here. I'm hoping someone else has had the same problem or has helped someone who has - it's weird and all the Googling I can do isn't coming up with the same issue. Or it's just not being described the way I'm seeing it play out.

My cube is a 2009, pretty sure it's one step up from the base model. It's not a Krom. I was fitting new roof racks (ski season is coming) today and had the doors open quite a bit. When I was done I went to start the cube and it wouldn't. I thought maybe it was the battery so I put my charger on it and charged it up until the charger readout said 100%. Still no go. So I started trying to figure out what was happening so I could search for solutions.

Power is good, key FOB works fine, spare FOB as well. When I hop in the cube, press the brake pedal and hit the start button the steering lock retracts, the dash lights up and that's about it. After a second or two the radio comes on and the "press brake" light comes back on. It appears to have gone to ACC mode after "trying to start" but failing to activate the starter. If I release the brake and just hit the button it "turns off" and I hear the steering gear relock the steering (and confirmed the steering does indeed lock).

Is this the symptom of the ESCL? Does the car still light the dash etc and then go to ACC mode or will the button not even wake the system up and 'try' to start the cube?

Brake lights work fine, shouldn't be the brake switch. I hope it's a known ESCL issue here....I can drive my truck but LOVE my cube and want to drive it! Thanks in advance for any wisdom and thank you for welcoming me into the forum!

It sounds like everything is lighting up normally, so I doubt it's the steering lock causing the problem. When those fail you generally get a "key" icon in the cluster (yellow on Alties and Maxes, I'm not sure about the Cube) and no response at all from the Start Button. There are two separate relays inside the IPDM that both must activate for the starter to spin, the Starter Control Relay and Starter Relay. Both relay coils are powered through the transmission Range Switch, the SC is grounded internally by the IPDM while the S gets its ground from the BCM after the key ID checks out. You could listen for clicking in the IPDM when you try to start it, if you hear any then the car is trying to start but can't. If you don't hear anything then the problem is in the IPDM or upstream somewhere in BCM or security system.

Welcome to Nico!!!

I do believe I did hear clicking coming from up there but I'll try again and maybe use my phone camera to record whatever sound it makes as well as what the dash does for me when I hit the button. I'll post that and share it. Appreciate the help. Pretty gutted but I know all things can be repaired.

If it's a heavy click coming from the vicinity of the starter, then chances are your starter has worn-out brushes. Try giving it a few taps with a hand sledge while an assistant works the button. If it wakes up and spins, replace the starter.

Thanks! I'll be sure to listen for that as well. Feels good to have things to look for after spending the night in the dark not knowing where to begin. I have to admit I was a bit worried about the whole push button start thing but I guess in reality it's no different than turning a key really. The same things have to happen. This won't be the first starter I've ever had to rap on to diagnose ; )

Okay, I recorded both inside the cube and under the hood. The in-car views you'll hear me open and close the door to trigger the steering relock.

For the under the hood clip I've waited for cars to not be passing by and did the start attempt a couple of times so you can hear the clicks happening under the hood. Hopefully this fills in some of the issue here and we can get this thing back on the road.

Well, I guess it IS technically on the road....hahaha

In-cube

Under hood
[youtube]https://youtu.be/MDIN74C4wZE[/youtube]

Tapping the relays themselves can get ' action' just like dead-spotting starters . Just cause they click , relays , means little as far as the contacts ( pitted / oxidization) .
RAPP-A-TAPP TAPP W/ screwdriver handle those starter circuit relays ??????
Ya get some ' action ' , ?? then replace

That's clearly cycling instead of trying to start. If was trying, you'd get about 5 seconds of "hang" time where it was trying to crank but not spinning, and the cluster would never go dark. This behavior is like it has no brake signal. That leaves out the key and the steering lock, and frankly almost everything else. If the brake lights work, the only thing I can suggest is that almost all Nissan brake switches are 2-throw units (4 wires) with the ABS using the second throw. I'm not sure if that could cause the BCM to abort starting, but maybe, and if so the problem would be invisible. I'd try a new brake switch.

Definitely worth a try. Is it also worth jumpering the leads to confirm? I only ask because the switch will take a while to get here by the look of things.

PS - Come to think of it, the BCM gets its "Park" signal from the detente switch in the shifter and not from the Transmission Range like everything else in the car. So a stuck shifter button causing the detente to be constantly depressed might also inhibit starting. I think it would have to be a stuck mechanism, the detente switches carry almost no current and I've never seen one fail unless it was drowned or corroded.

macboy wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 09, 2021 3:40 pm

Definitely worth a try. Is it also worth jumpering the leads to confirm? I only ask because the switch will take a while to get here by the look of things.

Yes, but the switch throws can be two types. One is break-make where the throws work opposite one another, the other is both-make where they operate in tandem. There's no way to tell from the WD which way your Cube's switch operates. You'd have to pull it up from the ESM. Probably the best place is the ECM pin reference in the EC section, the ECM is the only controller that makes use of both throws. The signals will be called Brake Sw 1 and Brake Sw 2.

you in the "Rust Belt " ...... maybe ? Rain , driven through 3' water ,you, or PO ? ( hard to know I know)

As luck would have it one of the dealers here has them in stock (and oddly the dealer closer to me has SEVEN of them but they're all spoken for for customer work??!!).

Not cheap but if it solves the problem it solves the problem. Going to run and grab it now.

As for rust-belt etc. Not really. The only thing that I can think might have fouled the switch if that is the culprit is the rapid cooling it would have had while I had the doors open for the roof rack installation? It went from quite mild to quite cold that day. Long shot but plausible. Especially on an older car. I do know it lived in a DUSTY world before me. Gravel country roads. Lots of fine dust in out of the way places.

VStar650CL wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 09, 2021 3:34 pm

That's clearly cycling instead of trying to start. If was trying, you'd get about 5 seconds of "hang" time where it was trying to crank but not spinning, and the cluster would never go dark.

I've got the new switch and will slip it in in about an hour but while waiting for our takeout to be ready (lazy supper day) I was rereading this. My cluster never goes dark after a no start. It appears to go into accessory mode. The dash stays lit until I press the start button again to turn the cube off. Just in case that matters here.

It might. I-key cars with an Acc position go off-acc-ign and not off-ign-acc, so if the latter is what you're saying then it's weird. If it's the former then it's normal behavior when the brake isn't pressed.

It was/is two taps with the brake not depressed to get to acc mode in mine. That's why way back at the start I felt like it was in the "run" position after the no start.

macboy wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 09, 2021 5:33 pm

It was/is two taps with the brake not depressed to get to acc mode in mine. That's why way back at the start I felt like it was in the "run" position after the no start.

Well, Cubes always were red-headed stepchildren. Guess they're backwards and I never noticed.

hahaha....but so happy they made 'em!

So no dice. New brake switch, still no go. What should I dig into next?

Check that detente button on the shifter, and go over all the IPDM fuses with a test lamp, not visual inspection. Hate to say it, but if those aren't it, you're going to need to get it scanned with a tool that can read the BCM and IPDM, preferably with work support to look at the brake and shifter inputs in realtime. The BCM, ECM and TCM can all basically "veto" a start command to the IPDM, so it will come down to discovering which one is causing the veto and what signal is provoking it.

I appreciate the follow through here.

The shift button (I think that's what you mean by detente) seems from all appearances seems to be behaving as per norm. I monkeyed with it while pressing the start button and then switched to neutral as well and monkeyed with it. It "functions" as in, the shifter won't move past it's stops without being depressed properly.

What should I be looking for across the fuses? I assume using my voltmeter will work the same as a test lamp? I just don't want to poke the probes where the ought not be poked.

Would there be any value in doing the typical starter checks - looking for voltage being sent after pressing the button etc? I don't know if the solenoid wiring can be reached without starting to pop stuff off or not but at worst it's the airbox and coolant reservoir I believe.

Happy to try to do whatever diagnostics I can before calling the tow truck. And really appreciate all the help here. Long live the forum world!

macboy wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 09, 2021 6:58 pm

The shift button (I think that's what you mean by detente) seems from all appearances seems to be behaving as per norm. I monkeyed with it while pressing the start button and then switched to neutral as well and monkeyed with it. It "functions" as in, the shifter won't move past it's stops without being depressed properly.

That only tells you it works mechanically, not electrically. Most of the time they can be reached for a voltage or continuity test by popping the shifter knob and cover. Not sure on the Cube, but on most Nissan shifters there's a central shaft inside the shifter column that activates the detente switch. When we see issues with them, it's usually rust in the mechanism and not the switch itself.

macboy wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 09, 2021 6:58 pm

What should I be looking for across the fuses? I assume using my voltmeter will work the same as a test lamp? I just don't want to poke the probes where the ought not be poked.

The only right way to test any fuse is with a bulb-type test lamp. That's because any fused circuit needs to carry power, and a bulb consumes enough to tell you the circuit is healthy. High impedance tools like a VOM or LED test lamp tell you nothing in that regard. You could have megohms of resistance in the wiring, but unless current is flowing, a VOM will still read 12V. It's the wrong tool for the job. Checking both sides of the fuse with a lamp tells you everything you need to know, that power is present or absent, if present then whether the fuse is good or bad, and whether the wiring feeding the fuse is in good shape.

macboy wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 09, 2021 6:58 pm

Would there be any value in doing the typical starter checks - looking for voltage being sent after pressing the button etc?

No, since it clicks immediately to Acc, it's pretty clear that something is vetoing or preventing it from cranking. Like I said, there would be a noticeable pause while the BCM tried to start it, and it would remain in the Ign state afterward, not change to Acc. You can check if you want to, but I'll be terribly surprised if you don't find the whole solenoid circuit doornail dead.

Again, appreciate the education, thanks. I'll get myself a test light to add to the tool box tomorrow for sure. I've never used one before but I'm guessing you clip the alligator to ground? Chassis or battery or does it matter? Are there any "do NOT do's" with a test light?

Wouldn't that be nice if it were just a fuse......

Yep, usually the gator goes on any good ground. Block, chassis, battery, doesn't matter unless you're checking across a specific set of wires. For example, if you were checking a window motor or door lock actuator, you'd first check across the two wires to make sure the motor was getting both power and ground. If it wasn't lighting up in one or both directions, then you'd put the gator on chassis ground to see whether the problem was no-power or no-ground. In certain situations you'll put the gator on 12V also, to see if a circuit has ground integrity. The beauty of a bulb is that it's bi-directional, but that means the only thing it can't tell you is direction of current flow.