My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Hijacker » Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:17 am

Looking good all together! Can't wait to see it finished and painted now.

Why swap the skyline subframe though? You're not gaining anything geometrically, and if it's a direct bolt in, I don't think you'll see much track width gain as Nissan probably played with wheel offsets to get a wider track on the GT-R. Tucking the subframe up that high, you will find that it gives a bit of roll center correction, but you'll have to deal with the anti-squat kicking back a bit more.


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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Tofubadguy » Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:20 am

Hijacker wrote:Looking good all together! Can't wait to see it finished and painted now.

Why swap the skyline subframe though? You're not gaining anything geometrically, and if it's a direct bolt in, I don't think you'll see much track width gain as Nissan probably played with wheel offsets to get a wider track on the GT-R. Tucking the subframe up that high, you will find that it gives a bit of roll center correction, but you'll have to deal with the anti-squat kicking back a bit more.
The main reason for swaping the rear subframe was because it was already all together. I origanally set out to get a set of 4.11 gears for the 240's housing so it'd match the front diff, but after finding little supply and/or price range reasonable, I broadened my search. I figured the front diff would stay the same and stock, so I'd keep working at trying to match it with the rear. Prices ranging from $300 for some used gears or an ugly R200 laying in a pile of junk, to new gears from X brand for up to $800. This whole build is on "the cheap" so considering anything too expensive or too much of a gamble was not an option.

Eventually though I ran accross an ebay auction for an entire R32 GTR rear subframe. They started the bidding at $300 no reserve, it's time was almost out and no one had bid yet. I did some copy pasting from the auction description into the google machine and found that it was being sold from a place in Texas called J-Hot. I called them up and asked a bunch of questions. I felt that it was all legit so at the last second I placed the bid and won. Had it shipped to me on a pallet and I was really happy with what showed up a week later. :) It had every little bit still on it with only the brake lines cut.

True, I could've tried to swap the diffs and then have to deal with output shaft to axle pattern swapping and all that... but why bother? It was all there and after measuring, would just "bolt right in"! I'm fairly sure that a change of a 1/2" rise in location for the subframe in the car will be the last thing that will give me any issues. Besides, the entire unit went up a 1/2" all together, so everything attached to the subframe is still the same to eachother. There is no geometry change... just an effective 1/2" body lowering mod. lol

Like I said though, it'll all have aftermarket adjustable links and goodies when I'm "done". So at this point if it's in the ballpark, it's better than it needs to be for me! ;)

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Hijacker » Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:38 pm

You are changing the geometry though. The ride height doesn't change since that's set by the coilovers. The subframe moves in relation to to body, but the body hasn't moved. Kuah at SPL has a great MS paint explanation you should read.

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Tofubadguy » Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:13 pm

Hijacker wrote:You are changing the geometry though. The ride height doesn't change since that's set by the coilovers. The subframe moves in relation to to body, but the body hasn't moved. Kuah at SPL has a great MS paint explanation you should read.
The ride hieght will change since the coilover is adjustable and I can put it anywhere I'd like to, especially a drop of 1/2". It's a moot point.

The only thing that changes is the overall center of gravity, which will go down Much more by the time I'm done. There are no hidden or secret magic tricks in a build like this. One just has to do and make it all work. Ya know, simple stuff. Those that can manage to make it into magic usually try their hand at running a buisness catering to those they have scared from attempting things themselves.

I do appreciate the attempt at a heads up on the subject though! It does to some extent frustrate me when the 'wizards' insist that 5 grade geometry is beyond most people's capability. I imagine you are referncing this page; http://cdn.splparts.com/tech/SPLSSBS13C.pdf For those interested, go read through it as it is a good explaination. It also explains clearly that if the coilover is adjusted along with the subframe, there isn't any change to anything, which is also intuitively obvious.

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Tofubadguy » Tue Feb 05, 2013 3:46 pm

Minor update.

Have my exhaust roughed in now as of yesterday. Came out great too. The forward pipe run landing 1/2" from the the streering u-joint and 3/4" from the turbo drain back line into the block, and 5/8" above the rack. Installs fairly easily with a slight rotation as I lift it into place.

We started with my solid (without expansion joint) Y pipe and ensured it fit up to the turbo flanges without any issue. We then used that Y pipe to make a quicky jig in order to work out of the car and up on the steel fab table. We clamped the y pipe to the table and proceeded to attach the temp jig to the table with tacks, attaching two small steel plates to replace the turbo flange locations with correctly located bolting holes. Switched over to the Y pipe with the expansion that I want to ultimately run and started marking and cutting.

We were back and forth, in and out of the jig. Measuring under the car and matching reference points on the table and jig. It all went pretty quick once we got underway. Here are a few pictures that sort of capture the process the best I was able to snap a shot on occassion with my phone.

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Tofubadguy » Tue Feb 05, 2013 4:01 pm

Still need to finish welding it out and clean it up. It fits like it should and really wasn't hard to do. I'd encourage anyone willing to try to do so. :)

Hopefully next week we'll get to the driveshaft and then on to my buddy's shop for wiring and fidly bits.

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby 2_Liter_Turbo » Tue Feb 05, 2013 8:47 pm

Looks good!

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby JGT Customs » Wed Feb 06, 2013 7:18 am

Excellent fab work and skills! I'm excited to see how this goes with you being so close to it running.

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Tofubadguy » Thu Feb 07, 2013 4:04 pm

Thanks guys. It is coming together little by little. I'm really happy it's getting near a functional completion. :)

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Tofubadguy » Wed May 29, 2013 2:18 am

Well my normal work schedule has been really not so normal lately and I've been neglecting the project for the last few months. The good news though is the last couple weeks I've been back on it as time has allowed.

This Thurs or Friday I'm going to pick up my driveshaft from the shop I had shorten it and pick up my exhaust Y pipe from the powder coating place I had coat it in the Jet Hot stuff.

All I'll need to do then make the carrier bearing mount and bolt it in, and bolt the exhaust in. Then get it on my trailer and over to my buddy's shop MAK Auto in Mesa, AZ for wiring! Yea! :)

Should be done and running in a few months. Hopefully then I'll have enough time to do a little clean up work on it and make it pretty again. It's going to be my entry for the Modified Magazine Street Car Shootout for 2014.

I ran my GTR in 2012, and my RB25 Silvia this year with them, so hopefully they'll consider this project worthy and allow me to join them one more year!

I'll update the build post once I get my driveshaft and exhaust back. :)

Russell

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Tofubadguy » Tue Jun 04, 2013 11:01 am

Ok, well here's some drive shaft mod pics.

Made a template
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Matched it with a fabbed bit to weld into the car at the right spot to bolt the factory carrier bracket to.
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Took a little out of each driveshaft half in order to put the carrier bearing in the car where I wanted it to land.
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Bits!
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The mid way point for the driveshaft span was right behind the seatbelt bolting locations, right at the end of the 'tunnel'.
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With the tunnel silhouette matched, just had to drill the bottom of it's 'feet' to locate the carrier bearing in the proper center line.
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Getting a look at where it's going before it's assembled and tacked in.
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Held snug with a floor jack to ensure proper final fittment.
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Looking at it from the rear. A nice window between the carrier braket frame and the new weld in tunnel bracket support, for the E-brake cables and whatever else seems like a good idea to stick through there.
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It's welded out, but my phone quit taking pics and crashed twice trying(old Droid X). I also got a call from the powder coat/jet hot place and the turbo down Y-pipe is done and ready for pick up. Besides bolting it in and loading it up on my trailer this next weekend, it'll be at MAK Auto getting wiring sorted out! Yea! :)

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby vas13hatch » Tue Jun 04, 2013 4:28 pm

This is such a frickin awesome project! Lots of skill going into this one. Just curious, how much do you think it'll weigh when it's all done?

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby DA 240 » Tue Jun 04, 2013 6:05 pm

looks good. I can't wait to see it when its finished

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Tofubadguy » Wed Jun 05, 2013 11:55 am

Thanks for the compliments again guys! What it will weigh? Not sure but I'll certainly get it on the Longacre scales for corner balancing when I'm done.

A while back Car and Driver had a little article of the Full Race R14. They mentioned that it only weighs in at 2700. http://www.caranddriver.com/news/full-r ... auto-shows Knowing that car and having competed against it twice now, for a 'street car' it was absent most of the interior and typical creature comforts of a street car. So adding a couple hundred more for extra bits would wind up in the range of 3000# for the R13 I'd guesstimate.

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby 10psitx » Thu Jun 06, 2013 8:57 am

I'll admit...one of the reasons i keep checking in with NICO is to see the progress on this build. it's impressive to say the least, ingenuity, fab skills, determination. I also like your polite dismissal/explanation of the suspension geometry discussion, i share your point of view on building cars....dont over complicate things....logic is key..it's also a rare.

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby AZhitman » Sat Jun 08, 2013 8:58 pm

Incredible stuff here from Russ... Dude really is a walking encyclopedia of making a Nissan haul a$$. :)

Can't wait to see this one on the circuit and tearing up Time Attack.

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby mautsukuda » Sun Jun 09, 2013 9:47 am

This is freaking awesome man. I wish I had the skills, space, money, time, and the right friends to do something like this. Good luck with the project. Can't wait to see it finished.

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby RocketOgre » Sun Jun 09, 2013 9:59 am

Awesome project! Can't wait to see it complete.

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Tofubadguy » Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:46 am

So the carrier bearing mount is all cleaned up and I hit it with a bit of rattle can for now to keep the raw metal protected. Driveshaft is in and the carrier lined right up and has a 1/2" of axial movement in each direction of center. Perfect! :)

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Got the exhaust Y-pipe back from jet hot coating place earlier last week, and finally bolted it in as well. It's the best looking thing under the car for now. lol

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What's left now? Realized I need to swap the tierod ends from the GTR rack to the 240 rack. Then hook them up, do a little eyeball adjustment and get it loaded on my trailer and out of my buddy Vern's way! This 1 year project has turned into almost 3 1/2 years of ocassional Mondays and a few weekends here and there. I bet it'd add up to less than a 90 days of actaul work though. Sorry Vern! lol

Off to MAK Auto it will go and probably stay there for all the small stuff until it is street worthy and on it's way to get street legal. Yea!

Thanks for the compliments again folks! I promise I'll bring it by and make sure you're one of the first people to see it when it's done Greg! :)

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby AZhitman » Wed Jun 12, 2013 8:25 pm

WOO HOO!

I still want to drive the R32... ;)

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Tofubadguy » Thu Jun 13, 2013 12:32 pm

Sure Greg! Only a few people have driven it other than myself since I've had it. UMS Tony, NASA Tage, and Snail Performance Taylor, all on track. Wouldn't mind at all to add you to the list. Just a heads up though... have you ever sat in one? My buddy at work is 6'4" and with all the adjustment as far in his favor as possible, his knees are still against the steering wheel. lol

The next track days we have scheduled that I'm going to attend (ones that have a points bearing effect on our season) are below. Any chance you could make it to either? Anything MORE local will have to wait till next year with the addition of all the Firebird tracks again. You'd have to register in HPDE or something to be an elligible driver, but I think you've been there, done that before. ;)

October 12-13, 2013 (Sat & Sun) - INDE Motorsports Ranch - Willcox, AZ

November 2-3, 2013 (Sat & Sun) - Chuckwalla Valley Raceway (CVR) "Clockwise"

http://forums.nasaaz.com/showthread.php?t=5358
Schedule

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby AZhitman » Thu Jun 13, 2013 9:55 pm

Yep. Drove a couple stock R32's back when the local shadies were importing them in pieces. I'm only 6'1". :)

Now that Bex has a capable vehicle ('13 Speed3), we're thinking of doing some DE once the weather cools down.

/threadjack - Thanks man!

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Tofubadguy » Wed Jul 10, 2013 11:36 am

Update: Minor delay

My truck has been down for a couple weeks for repairs. My Gearvendors overdrive unit was finally acting up too much so I pulled it out before it left me stranded somewhere. Needed to get it out to ship it back to be rebuilt anyhow, but wanted to swap it with standard factory OEM stuff for the time being. This is what proved to be a little difficult (short tailstock / longer driveshaft / carrier bearing update mod). Good news is that we have all the right stuff and it'll be back on the road today or tomorrow.

My GTR has been stuck on the trailer since the last event as well, so this weekend I can unload it and get the 240 loaded up and on its way to MAK Auto. :)

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Dirtfall » Sat Nov 02, 2013 8:16 pm

Progress? Ive enjoyed reading your build thread.

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Tofubadguy » Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:33 pm

It sadly is still loaded on the trailer next to the house. Still not wired yet, but I do hope to pick back up on it soon.

I redirected some extra funds to finish this NASA AZ track season with the GTR. Got 2nd place in Unlimited Time Attack, and 3rd I think in TT1, Time Trial 1.

This coming year I'm going to tapper off on my NASA participation, again redirecting my would be extra funds to my new son who should be in the outside world and with us in early January. If there is some extra left over I'll invest it into getting a replacement turbo on my Silvia, getting it street legal, and finishing the AWD 240SX.

Thanks for following! I promise to update the tread as soon as the next step happens and I get it dropped of at MAK Auto. Don't want to drop it in Matt's lap and take up shop room until I can be serious and get money going his way.

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby 10psitx » Mon Nov 18, 2013 8:50 am

Are you looking for a t25 for the silvia?...if you are pm me, i have a spare one you can have just handle the shipping.

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby waxdnuggz » Mon Nov 25, 2013 12:57 am

not sure if you mentioned this i kinda skim over this build just to look at the awesome pics :) but why a 2 pc driveshaft? i dont understand?

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby HxC_Nismo » Thu Nov 28, 2013 1:38 pm

Great fab work there bud, post some vids up when she is all done, I would like to see this bad boy in action.

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Tofubadguy » Tue Dec 03, 2013 3:53 pm

waxdnuggz wrote:not sure if you mentioned this i kinda skim over this build just to look at the awesome pics :) but why a 2 pc driveshaft? i dont understand?
It's a good question really. I've taken out two piece drive shafts out of cars before and replaced them with a one piece. I'm all about trying to simplify and minimize the parts list, but this situation was a little different.

The axial slip area, so it can 'breath' a bit axially wasn't at the tail stock/spline like many many cars have. This axial slip area is right near the carrier bearing. Since the transmission is mounted fairly solid and hopefully shouldn't move at all axially, and the rear subframe is also mounted fairly solidly, there needed to be a slip joint.

If the shaft incurred even a little bit of axial thrust I didn't want all that force to land in the trans or on the pinion bearing in the diff. Besides the diff has a recessed lip the shaft mounts into so some slip is needed. The trans and the diff are both flanged/bolt patterned fits.

I could've made some type of adapter that bolted to the trans flange and turned into a splinned slip joint before the universal joint, but it was much easier to use the existing slip joint and universals, and carrier bearing, but just trim it down a tad. It was the cheapest thing to do, and of it's good enough for my GTR, then I'm sure it'll be good enough for my AWD-S13. :)
HxC_Nismo wrote:Great fab work there bud, post some vids up when she is all done, I would like to see this bad boy in action.
Thanks! I plan to indeed! :)

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Re: My AWD RB26 S13 Coupe Project

Postby Tofubadguy » Tue Dec 03, 2013 4:06 pm

10psitx wrote:Are you looking for a t25 for the silvia?...if you are pm me, i have a spare one you can have just handle the shipping.
Just so you know, your PM function has been and still is turned off. ;)


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