KA-T "Components required for this amount of power" breakdown.

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KA-T "Components required for this amount of power" breakdown.

Postby PapaSmurf2k3 » Mon Mar 15, 2010 4:28 am

There have been a lot of "what do I need to get me to XXX horsepower" questions lately, both on the board and by email, so I figured I'd slap together this quicky list here. Feel free to post any edit suggestions or questions. If you are reading this, and there is something you see, but don't know what it is, please try doing a NICO search before asking.

Basic KA-T setup (180-220whp)Required:T25-T28 sized turboTurbo Manifold (JGS?)rrfpr (8:1?)oil line kitsome sort of wastegate (if turbo isn't internally gated)

Suggested:Everything in required, plus-FMICupgraded clutchWalbro 255lph fuel pump370cc injectors + SAFCBlow off valveexhaustHeat shielding for the turbo or brake master cylinder resevoir

Medium KA-T setup (230-300whp)Required:T28 or T3 turboTurbo manifoldclutchoil line kitWalbro fuel pump440cc injectorsSome sort of engine managementZ32TT N62 MAFFMICWastegateExhaustColder spark plugsHeat shielding for the turbo or brake master cylinder resevoir

Suggested:Blow off valveboost controllerboost gaugeadjustable fuel pressure regulator

Advanced KA-T setup (300-400whp)RequiredT3/T4 50 trim or similarTurbo manifoldWastegateFMIC550cc injectorswalbro fuel pumpEngine managementforged pistonsZ32TT N62 MAFClutchoil line kitexhaustColder spark plugsHeat shielding for the turbo or brake master cylinder resevoir

suggestedBlow off valveboost controllerboost gaugeadjustable fuel pressure regulatorforged connecting rodsIgnition timing control with engine managementwater/methanol injectionARP hardwareLimited slip rear diffRacing radiatorManifold heat wrapT-bolt clamps on all charge pipe connectionsLarger fuel rail

Monster KA-T setup (400+ whp)requiredGT35 Turbo or similarTurbo manifoldWastegateFMIC850cc injectorswalbro fuel pumpEngine management (fuel and ignition)forged pistonsforged connecting rodsZ32TT N62 MAFClutchoil line kitBlow off valveboost controllerExhaustWater/methanol injectionARP hardwareHead GasketRacing radiatorColder spark plugsHeat shielding for the turbo or brake master cylinder resevoirLarger fuel railT-bolt clamps on all charge pipe connectors

suggestedLimited slip rear diffFlywheelWheelsBrakesTiresroll cage (required at some tracks for faster cars)Manifold heat wrapFire extinguisher (required at some tracks)

I know I'm forgetting some stuff... but its a start.


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Re: KA-T "Components required for this amou ... (PapaSmurf2k3)

Postby scotty-2-forty » Mon Mar 15, 2010 6:35 am

PapaSmurf2k3 wrote:... 8500cc injectors ... I know I'm forgetting some stuff... but its a start.
!!!!! What are you building???

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Postby biggie » Mon Mar 15, 2010 7:16 am

Fixeded the '8500' thing.

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Re: (biggie)

Postby scotty-2-forty » Mon Mar 15, 2010 7:31 am

biggie wrote:Fixeded the '8500' thing.
Man, I was lookin' forward to that build! Good stuff though. : May I suggest adding:

- 'Colder' spark plugs- A higher rated PSI radiator cap- Heat shielding for the turbo so you don't roast the brake fluid resevior- Gauges like Oil Temp and Press, boost, AFR ... - Adjustable fuel pressure regulator, 'quality' fuel filter (no paper), upgraded fuel lines, larger fuel rail.- Larger cams- Heat porting- Maybe a driveshaft loop for safety- Some sort of fire extinguishing capability whether on-board or hand held- T-bolt clamps on all piping connections and a bead welded to the edge of the charge pipes so the clamps have something help grip on

Yes, some of the above may be 'power' specific, but then I'm in the 400+ club.
Modified by scotty-2-forty at 1:37 PM 3/17/2010

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Re: KA-T "Components required for this amou ... (PapaSmurf2k3)

Postby Gabes13 » Mon Mar 15, 2010 8:03 am

This is like the same thing on ka-t.org.

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Postby HGOTBOOST » Mon Mar 15, 2010 9:32 am

bump for some good info.

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Postby frapjap » Mon Mar 15, 2010 2:20 pm

How about some estimated TQ numbers?I'm sure some of the guys here with the estimated builds could toss in a range?

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Re: KA-T "Components required for this amou ... (scotty-2-forty)

Postby WDRacing » Mon Mar 15, 2010 2:36 pm

scotty-2-forty wrote:
!!!!! What are you building???
In 02 I was looking at the Summit Racing Compact drag car...it had 3 110lb injectors per runner. I believe it was a 3.3 liter motor...same day they broke whatever the current speed/time record was in the country.

That was a good weekend. Granted they were using methanol...but still. That's a fire hose worth of fuel

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Re: KA-T "Components required for this amou ... (pandapants)

Postby WDRacing » Mon Mar 15, 2010 2:46 pm

pandapants wrote:This is like the same thing on ka-t.org.
A basic component breakdown is something we didn't really have. Just because the .ORG has one doesn't really matter. I'm quite sure that every forum worth a damn has a basic parts break down for various (blah blah insert forum topic here).

Nothing against the .ORG....just saying I'll come up some additions tomorrow and possibly edit the main post to reflect what we can all come up with

WD

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Re: KA-T "Components required for this amou ... (PapaSmurf2k3)

Postby OM3GA » Tue Mar 23, 2010 10:04 am

Sweet info.

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Re: KA-T "Components required for this amou ... (OM3GA)

Postby DMan II-40 » Thu Mar 25, 2010 12:00 pm

good basic info to start someone in the right direction.

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Re: KA-T

Postby Promise Land » Mon Apr 04, 2011 2:14 pm

bump for a good thread. why no sticky? :gotme

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Re: KA-T

Postby Gundyy » Mon Apr 04, 2011 10:28 pm

definitely would have saved a lot of time for when i got here :bigthumb:
1 question: engine management system is like a piggy back system or stand alone? or both?

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Re: KA-T

Postby PapaSmurf2k3 » Tue Apr 05, 2011 10:36 am

Engine Management is sort of an all encompassing term meaning "something that can alter your fuel and/or timing (among other things)". To what degree it can do that (and how much you need it to do) is based both on how much power you want, and how much you are willing to spend.

Piggy backs for low budget, low HP goals, NISTUNE & full stand alone for the big boys.

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Re: KA-T

Postby mixeds14 » Tue Apr 05, 2011 2:47 pm

dont foget ur tuned ecu's.... like jwt,ethalpy, ect..

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Re: KA-T

Postby PapaSmurf2k3 » Tue Apr 05, 2011 4:16 pm

mixeds14 wrote:dont foget ur tuned ecu's.... like jwt,ethalpy, ect..
Yes, especially when coupled with a piggyback (to fine tune), you can get a great setup from them.

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Re: KA-T

Postby Dub's » Thu Dec 22, 2011 1:32 pm

What if i need 800rwhp+?

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Re: KA-T

Postby WDRacing » Fri Dec 23, 2011 4:29 am

V8 Swap is your best bet if you truly need that much power.

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Re: KA-T

Postby PapaSmurf2k3 » Sat Dec 24, 2011 3:59 pm

The boys over at AMS (http://www.amsperformance.com/) built a 1000 hp KA. It was quite expensive, and took a lot of effort and in-depth technical know-how.

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Re: KA-T

Postby GodzillaS15sx » Tue Jan 19, 2016 8:52 pm

This was a great write up. I am currently in the planning stages of a 240 build and my end goal is 400-450whp :dblthumb: and I would like to be able to drive the car without it being too "drag car like"

Is this a realistic goal for a KA-T build? And Yes I understand that it will take time and planning, and money to put this together but if my goals are a tad lofty :ohno: for a KA-T then I need to look towards another engine :facepalm: . Thank you in advance.

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Re: KA-T

Postby WDRacing » Wed Jan 20, 2016 6:20 am

GodzillaS15sx wrote:This was a great write up. I am currently in the planning stages of a 240 build and my end goal is 400-450whp :dblthumb: and I would like to be able to drive the car without it being too "drag car like"

Is this a realistic goal for a KA-T build? And Yes I understand that it will take time and planning, and money to put this together but if my goals are a tad lofty :ohno: for a KA-T then I need to look towards another engine :facepalm: . Thank you in advance.
400-450 is doable. It's not even that complicated really. You need fuel injectors big enough to support that much power plus the MAF and ECU to go with. A fully built motor and cooling system. A turbo large enough to support that without becoming a heat pump. A set of cams wouldn't hurt either, allowing you to make more power with less boost.

Just money and time really.

WD

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Re: KA-T

Postby GodzillaS15sx » Wed Jan 20, 2016 7:29 am

WDRacing wrote:
400-450 is doable. It's not even that complicated really. You need fuel injectors big enough to support that much power plus the MAF and ECU to go with. A fully built motor and cooling system. A turbo large enough to support that without becoming a heat pump. A set of cams wouldn't hurt either, allowing you to make more power with less boost.

Just money and time really.

WD
Do you mind explaining this? And what size turbo would be sufficient to get to that range? Ive been reading that Holset HX35 are decent even though they are from diesel trucks, or would it be better to go with a Garrett, Greddy, Precision, BW etc.

Also are there ECU set ups that would allow two programs where you can change by pushing a button or hooking up to a laptop? what I mean is when you get a JW (or another professional tune) do they have things where you can have a street tune say 12 psi and a "track" tune where you have 24 psi? or do you have to have just one program in the computer? Im a dreamer what can I say...if I have to have one tune program the wife wont be driving a 450whp rear wheel drive anything... :woot:

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Re: KA-T

Postby WDRacing » Wed Jan 20, 2016 12:04 pm

A small turbo will have to spin faster to create the same amount of boost as a larger turbo. The faster the compressor spins the hotter it's aircharge becomes. It also becomes inefficient past a certain point. A GT35, Holset HX35 or any turbo of similar size from one of the reputable companies you mentioned will work fine. You'll be running between 20 and 25 psi to make 450WHP depending on supporting mods and such. There are some really awesome turbo's available these days. The turbo selection has a lot to do with budget. I'd recommend ball bearings instead of journal bearings. Obviously stay away from knock-off brand turbo's. They're all junk.

As far as the tune goes. Lets say you go with a Jim Wolf or Enthalpy ECU. They come tuned to work with a specific injector and specific MAF as a matched set. So it's important you buy them as a set. If you get an ECU tune that supports 100lb fuel injectors and a 300ZX MAF you'll be able to run 25 psi of boost. That doesn't mean that you HAVE to run 25 psi of boost.

The boost level is determined by a boost controller. I personally use an old fashioned TurboXS Dual Stg controller. Inside the cockpit there is a toggle switch. One position for low boost, one position for high boost. There are electronic controllers that will do the same thing. The ECU controls fuel flow and ignition timing based on the signal it receives from the MAF sensor. So it can peter around at 12 psi all day every day or rip up to 30 psi on at the track. So there isn't a need for multiple tunes...unless you're running different types of fuel.

Don't be afraid to ask questions, even if you think they're noobish.

WD

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Re: KA-T

Postby PapaSmurf2k3 » Wed Jan 20, 2016 12:05 pm

There are a multitude of turbos that would support that power. Cheap ones might not last as long, or spool as quickly, or take up more space, etc.
Check out www.turbodriven.com for Borgwarner turbos (and they also have a mapping tool)
and www.turbobygarrett.com for Garrett turbos.
Here's a thread about compressor maps, and plotting them on your own:
so-i-made-you-guys-some-compressor-map- ... 29705.html

As far as ECU setups go- if you go with a stand-alone system that utilizes a MAP sensor (otherwise known as speed density ECU), you can just have your tune go all the way up to your max boost pressure. At that point, your boost controller is all you need to determine your power level.


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