HPS Silicone Air Intake Hose For 5.6L V8

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Ilya
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macgiver wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 9:31 pm
mac, Dyno testing after installing that Sillycone is tantamount to wanting to Dyno after a 9 O'clock Dump in the J-JON :rotflmao
I can't take it anymore :rotfl...I gotta ask man...

Why do you put "mac," in front of every post you make? We know who's posting.


walt1227
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paranoidjack wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 9:16 pm
Popped the hood of my new ride and took a closer look today. Interesting what I found....looks like someone made a Stillen kit "fit" the car. They did a pretty good job with the finish work. I prefer to make all my own factory mods myself, but I may just leave this alone! Sounds nice under throttle.

Lucky you. Can we get a video with you driving it to see how it sounds? I want to do a intake but don't have time to fab it. Maybe once I start working remote daily then I can do it.

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mac, thank you Ilya , that's a very good question ,I just started doing that and continue , when typing in any replies it looked good to me to enter an "identifier" inside the BOX to begin. Another thing that I sort of dropped , and yeah a little tedious was a GOOFY date at the end of my long Shspeels :lolling: What it was that I had aquaintences asking stuff and I was actually snapping the screen on my phone to send /show them solutions to similar problems - hell I must think I'm CLICK & CLACK :spitout:I'll keep on with the mac header though.I usually get people say back at me "thanks mac" Ba-ba-blah-blah :cool: Hey,by the way Ilya any relation to Kuryakin?? :rotfl
p.s. IF 'n you ate the previous night at Hometown Buffet , next morn. after the J-Jon :whistle: your E.T.'s will be cut by
4 tenths :facepalm:

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armybrat
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paranoidjack wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 9:16 pm
Popped the hood of my new ride and took a closer look today. Interesting what I found....looks like someone made a Stillen kit "fit" the car. They did a pretty good job with the finish work. I prefer to make all my own factory mods myself, but I may just leave this alone! Sounds nice under throttle.

Interesting but no thanks. They still use the ribbed hoses, plus not a big fan of CAI in these cars. I like my HPS hoses, plus 9.5 HP gain (stock tune) according to their dyno from March 2016:
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I had those HPS intake tubes on before and dyno’d before and after. First time I had stock air boxes and K&N drrop in filters and did 306whp even though I had a bad catalytic converter that was rattling at the time. I ended up having Infiniti replace the bad catalytic converter and installed the HPS intake tubes with the K&N drop in filters. Jumping back on the dyno I made 312whp but I believe the increase in whp was due having a brand new catalytic converter installed and not the because of the HPS product. And yes, second time on the dyno the car was re-tuned. With all that said, I’m now running the AEM induction system made for our v6 M37/Q70’s.

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armybrat
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AEM makes good products. I am running their Dryflow air filters in stock airboxes which I modified by drilling a series of holes to help draw in fresh air, sort of like a Venturi effect.

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I know this has been going on for a while and the closest we have to an objective before/after dyno is DKASM37's results. Thanks for sharing.

I see the words "OEM" and "restrictive" thrown around quite a lot when it comes to engine performance. I mostly disagree with any aftermarket manufacturers that use them to claim superior performance to OEM, but then I partly agree but have to ask, "restrictive in what aspect?"

The 4 key components to your modern engine-managed, fuel-injected vehicle that maintain proper air/fuel balance are :
1. MAF - mass airflow sensor, emphasis on Mass
2. MAP - manifold absolute pressure sensor
3. ECU - or ECM. The computer with look-up tables for what parameters the engine should run under
4. O2 sensor - monitor the exhaust gases

These ultimately want the appropriate mass of oxygen to be used to burn the appropriate mass of fuel. The MAF approximates, the MAP sensor fine-tunes, and the oxygen sensor gives feedback (closed loop) as to how well the prior sensors did their jobs, based on the ECU's written guidelines.

I simply see no way to trick the computer to milk any more power out of air that has already been metered. Either introduce a leak or more oxygen after the MAF sensor, but again, you'll get a check engine light/code after the other 2 sensors report the discrepancy.

Air intake tubes leave the factory the way they do for various reasons - noise levels, airflow characteristics, etc... but I almost guarantee if Nissan could squeeze 10 more horses by using $200 hoses, they would have bought it by the mile and paid cents to the Dollar on it. Again, as reported in this thread and elsewhere, a smoother, straight-shot intake tube made of a different material will result in different acoustics and it seems most current owners actually like the modified sound.

I'd buy the tube for looks or sound, but without any accompanying exhaust and tuning mods, I wouldn't expect a single pony increase.
The exhaust and tuning stuff is part of another discussion, but look at the intake snorkel of your car. Its intake area isn't very large, is it? For a naturally aspirated engine, whether you make the tube longer, intake colder, throttle body and tube larger or the filter less restrictive, the cylinders will ask for the same volume of air by way of vacuum and the MAF will meter the mass of this air as it passes it and the ECM will correct as necessary. You know, unless the ECM maps have been messed with by tuning.
Another thing that will be saved for a different discussion is the real gains of tuning. Manufacturers establish a tune based on the 3 pillars of a production engine:
1. Power
2. Fuel economy
3. Emissions
Aftermarket tunes can definitely squeeze higher numbers out of one or two of these above, but I don't know how much consideration is given to the last factor... or to reliability/ longevity.


I'd like to conclude by saying that if your car feels more enjoyable to you due to a change or 2 that you made, then that's mostly what matters. :shifter:

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Anyone have a video that captures the sound of these? Still debating them, though I can't find the black ones anywhere

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DoN_BLaZe34 wrote:
Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:04 am
Anyone have a video that captures the sound of these? Still debating them, though I can't find the black ones anywhere
I'm leaving the country for 3 weeks staring tomorrow but if no one provides you with a clip, I can send you one when I get back.

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Maybe I'm thick but consider this. CAI = COLD air intake. The stock version of the car obtains air from the very front of the car (the coolest air possible). When you bypass that, no matter what design you use, you are obtaining air from the hot engine bay - even if you use insulated tubes, K&N filters, etc - the air comes from the hottest part of the engine bay. While these after market pieces look brilliant, they can't make a noticeable gain in any way (10hp = nothing). Common sense and science out-weighs any claims made by the people who make these things. Just do or not, but do it for the looks and don't expect any 'wow! what a difference' results.
Secondly, I personally don't go round showing people my engine bay so the only person who will see this added bling is me (and my mechanic).

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Larz wrote:
Sun Jun 17, 2018 7:10 am
Maybe I'm thick but consider this. CAI = COLD air intake. The stock version of the car obtains air from the very front of the car (the coolest air possible). When you bypass that, no matter what design you use, you are obtaining air from the hot engine bay - even if you use insulated tubes, K&N filters, etc - the air comes from the hottest part of the engine bay. While these after market pieces look brilliant, they can't make a noticeable gain in any way (10hp = nothing). Common sense and science out-weighs any claims made by the people who make these things. Just do or not, but do it for the looks and don't expect any 'wow! what a difference' results.
Secondly, I personally don't go round showing people my engine bay so the only person who will see this added bling is me (and my mechanic).
Agreed. Though I put the HPS tubes on, I don't anticipate any difference. There is a change in sound note for the better - but if the manufacturers of a 50k-70k car could improve performance with some $200 silicon, they would. Also agreed the location that the custom intakes on my car are not as cold as the factory inlet. I'm not sure how much difference it would make, but I do love how the HPS tubes look!

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armybrat
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Larz wrote:
Sun Jun 17, 2018 7:10 am
Maybe I'm thick but consider this. CAI = COLD air intake. The stock version of the car obtains air from the very front of the car (the coolest air possible). When you bypass that, no matter what design you use, you are obtaining air from the hot engine bay - even if you use insulated tubes, K&N filters, etc - the air comes from the hottest part of the engine bay. While these after market pieces look brilliant, they can't make a noticeable gain in any way (10hp = nothing). Common sense and science out-weighs any claims made by the people who make these things. Just do or not, but do it for the looks and don't expect any 'wow! what a difference' results.
Secondly, I personally don't go round showing people my engine bay so the only person who will see this added bling is me (and my mechanic).
For the most part, I agree. However, 10 hp does not equal nothing, it equals 10 hp. (actually up to 9.5 hp, according to the M56 dyno, which BTW, Ilya verified by actually talking to the folks at HPS due to some skepticism) Not bad in the grand scheme of things for a simple bolt on mod. But, in a stock car already making 420 hp at the crank, like you said you won't notice it...however, with a custom exhaust and tune, it will make a difference in the overall performance, which is why I bought a set for my car.

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armybrat
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EdBwoy wrote:
Fri Apr 27, 2018 1:41 pm
I know this has been going on for a while and the closest we have to an objective before/after dyno is DKASM37's results. Thanks for sharing.

I see the words "OEM" and "restrictive" thrown around quite a lot when it comes to engine performance. I mostly disagree with any aftermarket manufacturers that use them to claim superior performance to OEM, but then I partly agree but have to ask, "restrictive in what aspect?"

The 4 key components to your modern engine-managed, fuel-injected vehicle that maintain proper air/fuel balance are :
1. MAF - mass airflow sensor, emphasis on Mass
2. MAP - manifold absolute pressure sensor
3. ECU - or ECM. The computer with look-up tables for what parameters the engine should run under
4. O2 sensor - monitor the exhaust gases

These ultimately want the appropriate mass of oxygen to be used to burn the appropriate mass of fuel. The MAF approximates, the MAP sensor fine-tunes, and the oxygen sensor gives feedback (closed loop) as to how well the prior sensors did their jobs, based on the ECU's written guidelines.

I simply see no way to trick the computer to milk any more power out of air that has already been metered. Either introduce a leak or more oxygen after the MAF sensor, but again, you'll get a check engine light/code after the other 2 sensors report the discrepancy.

Air intake tubes leave the factory the way they do for various reasons - noise levels, airflow characteristics, etc... but I almost guarantee if Nissan could squeeze 10 more horses by using $200 hoses, they would have bought it by the mile and paid cents to the Dollar on it. Again, as reported in this thread and elsewhere, a smoother, straight-shot intake tube made of a different material will result in different acoustics and it seems most current owners actually like the modified sound.

I'd buy the tube for looks or sound, but without any accompanying exhaust and tuning mods, I wouldn't expect a single pony increase.
The exhaust and tuning stuff is part of another discussion, but look at the intake snorkel of your car. Its intake area isn't very large, is it? For a naturally aspirated engine, whether you make the tube longer, intake colder, throttle body and tube larger or the filter less restrictive, the cylinders will ask for the same volume of air by way of vacuum and the MAF will meter the mass of this air as it passes it and the ECM will correct as necessary. You know, unless the ECM maps have been messed with by tuning.
Another thing that will be saved for a different discussion is the real gains of tuning. Manufacturers establish a tune based on the 3 pillars of a production engine:
1. Power
2. Fuel economy
3. Emissions
Aftermarket tunes can definitely squeeze higher numbers out of one or two of these above, but I don't know how much consideration is given to the last factor... or to reliability/ longevity.


I'd like to conclude by saying that if your car feels more enjoyable to you due to a change or 2 that you made, then that's mostly what matters. :shifter:
The dyno results posted by HPS were done on a M56. Yeah it sounded bogus at first which is why Ilya actually called and spoke with them. The gains are for a stock M56. You don't need a custom exhaust or tune to get it. Will you notice it? - not really since the car is already making 420 hp at the crank, but it's there.

On the M sedan, could Nissan have went with the smooth bore hoses like you said to get that 10 hp? Yes. Would they - no. The smooth bore does create more acoustics inside the cabin, which goes against the more refined sound of the M as a luxury sedan. Could Nissan install the sport mufflers as well? Yes. Did they - no. Same reason, they didn't want the M to be too aggressive sounding. They have a certain profile in mind for the M sedan, marketed to a certain clientele.

Personally I wouldn't have bought the hoses without also getting a custom exhaust and tune. The government places limits and restrictions on manufacturer's stock engine performance, such as Clean Air Act, etc. As such, all of our engines are capable of better performance with the addition of aftermarket mods. Performance isn't just about throwing you in the back of your seat. It can be subtle, like simple bolt on mods - intake hoses, a more straight through muffler, performance air filters such as K&N, etc. (yes there is a debate on OEM air filters vs high flow ones like K&N) and of course a custom tune to maximize all of it, the end result being a better running vehicle which gets better mileage while also meeting emissions requirements.

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Thanks for responding armybrat. These days I refrain from posting too much wondering if there was some kind of technical glitch blocking my posts or if I was just rubbing people off the wrong way with my discussions... because most of my technical contributions seem to get ignored around here... But it seems you and the other posters are saying pretty much what I said.

I agree and stated you could squeeze more power by doing one or 2 things. There are several reasons the engine is limited to what it is - NVH, emissions, fuel economy, reliability/longevity and of course the cost of development. A lot of analysis and modeling goes into the decision to not throw 700 hp into a commuter VK56VD. Can it handle it? Yes. Can they guarantee it will run for 350,000 miles without major failure and still be "affordable"? Will it still keep the same targeted driving dynamics? Hmmmm...
We simply can't have it all, but yes, I agree that various aspects of performance can be improved while sacrificing others.

What I disagree with is that changing this specific tube is guaranteed to give a power increase under objective testing. That's just not the way our engines work... especially less effective for our intake manifold design and direct injected engines.
I am no pro at dyno-tuning but I know enough to know that I can get the same bone stock vehicle on the same dyno to swing 5% in torque, hence horsepower numbers. When 30 comparative data points have been collected, now we are talking.

I will be glad to see some objective data from a dyno run, and I will stand on this same ground and say I have been proven wrong. (I always side with the facts)... And I will go back to my school to demand a refund for misleading me, including in my coursework of internal combustion engines.

My goal was not to say don't do it. Rather, my purpose was to educate so that people don't come with big expectations on power.
But I know and respect that people modify their cars for different reasons, and as long as the owner is happy, I'm happy for them.

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I'm still just wishing we could drop this and a proper set of intakes could be made. Along with high flow cats and more cat back options.

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EdBwoy wrote:
Mon Jun 18, 2018 11:44 am
Thanks for responding armybrat. These days I refrain from posting too much wondering if there was some kind of technical glitch blocking my posts or if I was just rubbing people off the wrong way with my discussions... because most of my technical contributions seem to get ignored around here... But it seems you and the other posters are saying pretty much what I said.

I agree and stated you could squeeze more power by doing one or 2 things. There are several reasons the engine is limited to what it is - NVH, emissions, fuel economy, reliability/longevity and of course the cost of development. A lot of analysis and modeling goes into the decision to not throw 700 hp into a commuter VK56VD. Can it handle it? Yes. Can they guarantee it will run for 350,000 miles without major failure and still be "affordable"? Will it still keep the same targeted driving dynamics? Hmmmm...
We simply can't have it all, but yes, I agree that various aspects of performance can be improved while sacrificing others.

What I disagree with is that changing this specific tube is guaranteed to give a power increase under objective testing. That's just not the way our engines work... especially less effective for our intake manifold design and direct injected engines.
I am no pro at dyno-tuning but I know enough to know that I can get the same bone stock vehicle on the same dyno to swing 5% in torque, hence horsepower numbers. When 30 comparative data points have been collected, now we are talking.

I will be glad to see some objective data from a dyno run, and I will stand on this same ground and say I have been proven wrong. (I always side with the facts)... And I will go back to my school to demand a refund for misleading me, including in my coursework of internal combustion engines.

My goal was not to say don't do it. Rather, my purpose was to educate so that people don't come with big expectations on power.
But I know and respect that people modify their cars for different reasons, and as long as the owner is happy, I'm happy for them.
Well said. I always appreciate feedback, as it's always good to hear other opinions. I've learned a lot from reading other posts, so keep 'em coming. My understanding of the HPS dyno results (from what Ilya posted in the 1st page of this thread) is that they did run multiple tests to confirm the gains; not only on this model but a Honda Civic as well. Maybe he can elaborate more on the actual conversation. I do agree that a lot of folks buy these, as well as modifying their exhaust and intake, and expect to be thrown back in their seats. If anything, without a tune, you can actually decrease the efficiency and performance if you alter the intake and exhaust air flow too much.

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Okay, I'm guessing I'm in the right place, seeing as this topic does generally cover intake options and not specifically only the HPS tubes.

Firstly, has any aftermarket manufacturer made a CAI for the m56 yet? I'm looking for something SS or aluminium, conical filter preferably, but I seem to have absolutely no luck. Might resort to custom fab if the answer is no.

Second, how are you guys getting such low numbers on your baseline dyno runs? Genuinely curious, because I took my RWD 56S to a renowned tuner here (I believe he uses a Mustang dyno) just to see what baseline numbers it puts down. Bone stock, no tune, nothing, and I ran 342whp and 344wtq consistently over 6 runs. It was 105 degrees outside as well.

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AshtiM56S wrote:
Mon Jun 25, 2018 5:38 pm
... I took my RWD 56S to a renowned tuner here (I believe he uses a Mustang dyno) just to see what baseline numbers it puts down. Bone stock, no tune, nothing, and I ran 342whp and 344wtq consistently over 6 runs. It was 105 degrees outside as well.
Unfortunately I can't answer your questions, but I like seeing data.

How much did the dyno facility charge you for those 6 runs?

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No CAI available for the V8. Only these tubes.

For the dyno, IIRC Mustang dynos read higher always. That being said, the difference between 420 crank and 340 wheel HP is pretty drastic...I would have expected the V8 to be more in the neighborhood of 375whp stock.

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EdBwoy wrote:
Wed Jun 27, 2018 8:20 am
AshtiM56S wrote:
Mon Jun 25, 2018 5:38 pm
... I took my RWD 56S to a renowned tuner here (I believe he uses a Mustang dyno) just to see what baseline numbers it puts down. Bone stock, no tune, nothing, and I ran 342whp and 344wtq consistently over 6 runs. It was 105 degrees outside as well.
Unfortunately I can't answer your questions, but I like seeing data.

How much did the dyno facility charge you for those 6 runs?
They rent out their dyno by the hour (you can either utilise the in-house tuner or bring your own), and I got a friends-of-the-business discount for helping them organise their drag racing events every year, so it was $100 for me.
Ilya wrote:
Wed Jun 27, 2018 12:16 pm
No CAI available for the V8. Only these tubes.

For the dyno, IIRC Mustang dynos read higher always. That being said, the difference between 420 crank and 340 wheel HP is pretty drastic...I would have expected the V8 to be more in the neighborhood of 375whp stock.
Just doubled checked that today, not Mustang. Dynojet. And a 19% loss from crank to wheel isn't bad considering the car was built as a luxury sedan, not a sports car. How restrictive the stock exhaust is should be the biggest indicator of that.
Also, very sad that there's no CAIs, I guess I'll have to fab one. I'll post the results when I do.

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IMO 99% of CAIs are actually HAIs lol. I'd be more interested in something like a plenum spacer for this car than an intake. The stock one modified like some of us have done plus the tubes is more than enough.

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Ilya wrote:
Thu Jun 28, 2018 4:30 am
IMO 99% of CAIs are actually HAIs lol. I'd be more interested in something like a plenum spacer for this car than an intake. The stock one modified like some of us have done plus the tubes is more than enough.
A plenum spacer would be a good idea as well. The only reason I'm looking into a full intake fab is to switch from screen filters to conical. I know there's not much of a performance difference there, but it would be more aesthetically pleasing. Plus, I got the Stillen Z-tube for my old FX35 and had to get a filter cone; the louder intake woosh was very satisfying.

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One man's opinion/testimony on the OEM intake setup after some dyno testing:

ken in az wrote:
Thu Apr 09, 2020 8:03 pm
.... Also, the cold air "scoop" or whatever you want to call it definitely made a difference for the better and is not a restriction. Observing both the MAP and MAF sensors, either on or off, there was no difference in the MAF reading, MAP reading, not Horsepower. Actually with it off I lost HP, down like 5-8hp depending on the run.
...

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So did it make a difference after installing on stock M56. I have read mixed reviews. Don't want to drop $200 unless I feel more power. Also thinking of buying K&N drop air filter in the stock box.

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Pakitullanc wrote:
Fri May 07, 2021 12:20 pm
So did it make a difference after installing on stock M56. I have read mixed reviews. Don't want to drop $200 unless I feel more power. Also thinking of buying K&N drop air filter in the stock box.
If you want to go with the K&N filters I have 2 of them that I had for a little while that I kept after trading. Just let me know, they would be cheap for anyone on here.

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Thanks for the offer. I bought from another member here. But I am looking for the HPS tubes?

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Never had the tubes. Always wished there were more aftermarket for the 5.6.

Only things I have left from my car other than the filters is floor mats that no one seems to need. Have carpet and all weather.

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Got both kinds of mat. Thx

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1) The HPS tubes with the stock intake air scoop/hood should give you a little bit of extra sound and maybe 1-2HP more AFTER tune
2) K&N or ANY oiled filter = bad idea for Nissan/Infiniti products. These cars have VERY sensitive MAF sensors and oil is likely to damage them. Ask me how I know lol (actually, I'll just tell you - I had a brand new K&N, pre-oiled from factory, destroy my MAF on a 99 Maxima SE within the first 100 miles of use - cost me $250 to replace the MAF). I only use those types of filters on non-MAF vehicles such as some motorcycles, etc. Otherwise, my cars all get good ol paper filters but just changed every 15kmi.

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K&N's are a bad idea anyway, for any engine:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/a ... 7316301475

There's pseudo-science and actual science, I prefer the latter.


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