How To: 5 Speed Swap in Convertibles (and other S13s)

The Internet's ONLY forum for 240sx convertible information and the official home of the 240sx Convertible Club of America!
94_240sx
Posts: 7673
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:56 am
Car: 94_240SX
Location: DFW, TX
Contact:

Post

numnutzzz wrote:i remember seeing someone mention something about their speedo not working after the swap. could someone give me some info about that? i've searched these 7 pages but couldn't find it. i must be blind.
I think this is what you are looking for.zerothread?id=284730

I'm not sure about this, but only piggy has this issue???zerothread?id=289831

I did some more research and it looks like your cluster must match with speed sensor to read speed correctly. I have s13 with s13 cluster, but have s14 tranny, so I'll need s13 speed sensor. I'll also have to find out correct gear for s13 with SE wheels. Someone said there are 2 different gears for 2 different size of wheels.


User avatar
biggie
Moderator
Posts: 10330
Joined: Wed Jul 24, 2002 2:31 am
Car: '16 Q70L/'14 Q60S Vert/'19 Armada/'09 FX35
Location: Clemmons, NC

Post

94_240sx wrote:I did some more research and it looks like your cluster must match with speed sensor to read speed correctly. I have s13 with s13 cluster, but have s14 tranny, so I'll need s13 speed sensor. I'll also have to find out correct gear for s13 with SE wheels. Someone said there are 2 different gears for 2 different size of wheels.
Haven't heard of the 2 different S13 sensors, even if there are 2 different ones I wouldn't think they could be more than 1 or 2 mph difference. Different tires were 195 vs 205 I believe.

User avatar
Hijacker
Posts: 15759
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 4:57 am
Car: '92 240sx Convertible
'94 F-150
Location: Fredericksburg, VA

Post

In all of my years of dealing with this crap, I've only seen one part number for the speed sensor. And the overall diameter of the tire is what would cause a step out of speed difference. Nissan did a good job of using correct tire OD to keep the ratios the same between the 195 tire and the 205 tire.

And you will need to match your chassis to the speed sensor. ie S13 chassis needs an S13 sensor, an S14 chassis needs an S14 sensor. They are physically the same size, but the gear ratios on the pinion gear are different.

94_240sx
Posts: 7673
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:56 am
Car: 94_240SX
Location: DFW, TX
Contact:

Post

Hijacker wrote:And you will need to match your chassis to the speed sensor. ie S13 chassis needs an S13 sensor, an S14 chassis needs an S14 sensor.
That's where I made a mistake. I had a choice between s13 and s14 trannies and I picked s14 one. No doubt. It was clean, no sign of leak and had less mileage on it. I should have swapped the speed sensors right there. s13 speed sensor, pinion gear and o-ring runs about $180-190 brand new. I've leared that used s13 speed sensors are not easy to find. Easier to find used s14 speed sensors. Anyway, keep looking now.


User avatar
biggie
Moderator
Posts: 10330
Joined: Wed Jul 24, 2002 2:31 am
Car: '16 Q70L/'14 Q60S Vert/'19 Armada/'09 FX35
Location: Clemmons, NC

Post

94_240sx wrote:
That's where I made a mistake. I had a choice between s13 and s14 trannies and I picked s14 one. No doubt. It was clean, no sign of leak and had less mileage on it. I should have swapped the speed sensors right there. s13 speed sensor, pinion gear and o-ring runs about $180-190 brand new. I've leared that used s13 speed sensors are not easy to find. Easier to find used s14 speed sensors. Anyway, keep looking now.
car-part.com may be you best bet to find one in a junkyard. Just search for transmission and call them.

User avatar
numnutzzz
Posts: 128
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 2:28 pm

Post

the s13 car my friend had has the mph on his windsheild and my 92 s13 has the regular speedo. would this be the cause of it not having any mph reading? i have coolant temp, rpm, and fuel level working on my cluster but speed and mileage clock doesnt move.

User avatar
Hijacker
Posts: 15759
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 4:57 am
Car: '92 240sx Convertible
'94 F-150
Location: Fredericksburg, VA

Post

Are you sure the speed sensor is plugged in? Double check the connection on the subharness

94_240sx
Posts: 7673
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:56 am
Car: 94_240SX
Location: DFW, TX
Contact:

Post

Okay, here's the summary on speed sensors.

KA24E: Same speed sensor just like KA24DE, but has 2 different pinion gears. Sport Pacakage has same pinion gear as KA24DE. KA24DE pinion gear has 20 teeth(not sure if you can go by this or size of it), so be careful if you are dealing with manual tranny from KA24E and it didn't come with speed sensor. Both tranny and speed sensor gears will get messed up if you get a wrong speed sensor and plug it in. KA24DE: s13 and s14 speed sensors are interchangeable. s13 has aluminum casing with long wire and plug attached and s14 speed sensor has plastic housing with no wires. SR20DET tranny speed sensors also have same part numbers as KA24DE s13 & s14, so you can use them for sure.

I compared s13(Chuki) and s14 speed sensors(from 96) carefully and they are basically the same. Gears look exactly the same and both have 20 teeth. I'll post a side by side picture tonight. I think clusters act differently based on where they getting the inputs from. Anyway, you better match the chassis and speed sensor like Hijacker said.

94_240sx
Posts: 7673
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:56 am
Car: 94_240SX
Location: DFW, TX
Contact:

Post


User avatar
numnutzzz
Posts: 128
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 2:28 pm

Post

first off i would like to thank 94_240sx for the pictures.

this is for hijacker, my top doesnt work (up or down) . i looked through your steps and u said that the two thick wires that i connect directly will make the car think its in park at all times. i did just that and my car will start when its on neutral or any gear (with clutch depressed). what else u think could be the cause?

User avatar
Hijacker
Posts: 15759
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 4:57 am
Car: '92 240sx Convertible
'94 F-150
Location: Fredericksburg, VA

Post

The two pronged thick wired plug gets the car to start. You have to splice the Brown/Yellow and Green/blue wires together to get the top to go up and down

94_240sx
Posts: 7673
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:56 am
Car: 94_240SX
Location: DFW, TX
Contact:

Post

I'll share this with you guys. I figured it'll be better to add to this thread instead of creating a new one.

Front and rear seals replacement on manual tranny. I've never done this before, but decided to give it a try. It was way easier than I thought, so it'll be good if you do this before the swap.

First step. Remove dust cover. My tranny is from s14 and this piece is too small for s13 driveshaft and someone mentioned about this s14 dust boot and s13 driveshaft in one of the previous pages. You don't have to cut or anything. It just pops out. I used flat head screw driver and to pry it out. I'll buy s13 dust cover, and see if it fits there.

Pry the rear seal with a flat head screw driver like this. It came out easily.

Socket for the rear axle fits perfect, so use it to tap the seal in after put some grease on. Size of the rear seal is exactly same as differential side seals. I used the same socket to install the diff seals.

I was afraid of doing the front one, but did it anyway. 5 bolts are holding the front cover.

I tired to pull/pry it out, but failed. There's no way you can pull it out.

There was a hole on the cover just like water pump. You will see leak here if the seal goes bad. I placed a small screw driver and pushed it out. It worked like a charm!

New one is in!!

I have some more stuff to share and will post later.
Modified by 94_240sx at 9:10 AM 2/25/2008

User avatar
numnutzzz
Posts: 128
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 2:28 pm

Post

nice right up, too bad you didn't post this up 19 days ago when i began putting in my motor and tranny. hahhaha

hey hijacker, i checked the wiring, i connected brown/yellow to green/blue and the two thick wires. top still doesnt have power going through up or down. could there be any other causes? i haven't routed the reverse light yet, is that a must to complete a certain circuit other than reverse light?

T_wolbert
Posts: 2
Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2008 8:02 pm
Car: 91 s13.. and 95 s14

Post

do i have to replace any computers for a 5speed swap? people say change the ecu.. but the ecu goes to the motor wiring harness and not the trans, but i do see the trans wires up with the main harness the goes to the fuses and head lights and that has a computer, that would sound more reason able to change. but idk any thing to do, this is my first time.. thanks if you can help me

whoflungpoo
Posts: 288
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2003 8:30 am
Car: 2006 Infinity G35 Sedan
2003 Evolution VIII

Post

it's not necessary, but is commonly done.

My 97 has the auto in it still. It idle's high, which I have heard is a side effect of keeping it, but I believe it has more to do with deleting my EGR and having some vacuum leaks still.

User avatar
Hijacker
Posts: 15759
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 4:57 am
Car: '92 240sx Convertible
'94 F-150
Location: Fredericksburg, VA

Post

numnutzzz wrote:nice right up, too bad you didn't post this up 19 days ago when i began putting in my motor and tranny. hahhaha

hey hijacker, i checked the wiring, i connected brown/yellow to green/blue and the two thick wires. top still doesnt have power going through up or down. could there be any other causes? i haven't routed the reverse light yet, is that a must to complete a certain circuit other than reverse light?
Sorry I didn't see this earlier. Take a test light and confirm you have power going to the green/blue when you have the ignition turned to "On" If you do, then there's something wrong with a fuse/relay somewhere because directly connecting the green/blue and brown/yellow should get the top switch to receive power. The reverse light wiring has no bearing on how the park/neutral wire gets its power

User avatar
numnutzzz
Posts: 128
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 2:28 pm

Post

thanks hijacker, i cant find current going through the blue and green so i linked a wire from the fuel pump to the brown yellow and now the top works. i traced the blue/green wire and it disappeared into the harness so i guess i'll never find out whats wrong with that wire.

now my problem is the speed sensor, any way to test it? because it looks hooked up pretty clean and all but still my speedo doesnt work.

94_240sx
Posts: 7673
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:56 am
Car: 94_240SX
Location: DFW, TX
Contact:

Post

Alright, found some more pics. My clutch pedal from junkyard looked terrible. Good that I took it apart and cleaned it otherwise I woundn't have noticed it. Little plastic part won't last forever, so there's a big chance yours looks like this too. I had to order a pedal and small misc. parts such as spring, plastic bushings and bump stop to rebuild it. Inspect your clutch pedal before installing it. It won't be easy to replace it after it's already on the car. You can do it, but there's not much space. There was not much to go wrong on the brake pedal though. I painted them with silver spray paint, and they came out very nice.


User avatar
numnutzzz
Posts: 128
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 2:28 pm

Post

i have never seen such a clean pedal before in my life till today. hahahha

to correct my previous post. convertible top doesn't work. my wiring enabled the up/down switch to work but the convertible top motor doesnt run so the corner window goes down when i press up or down but the motor doesnt run. i guess more problems to diagnosis.

User avatar
Hijacker
Posts: 15759
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 4:57 am
Car: '92 240sx Convertible
'94 F-150
Location: Fredericksburg, VA

Post

94_240sx wrote:
I've seen that happen to just about every clutch pedal I've had in my hands. Never to that extent though. Mine has a slight guoge cut in it. I figured I'd just zap it with the welder to fill the cut in and then put a new bushing in it. Nice to know we have a part number for it now.

Numnutz, make sure your top motor isn't switched to manual mode (valve on top of the motor)

User avatar
numnutzzz
Posts: 128
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 2:28 pm

Post

it was closed but at least i know i have an alternative solution in dropping my top now.

94_240sx
Posts: 7673
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:56 am
Car: 94_240SX
Location: DFW, TX
Contact:

Post

numnutzzz wrote:it was closed but at least i know i have an alternative solution in dropping my top now.
Well, only thing that I can think of at this point is... How about those relays on the line? If you pull rear seats, you will see wires to the motor and several relays(?) are attached. I wonder what happens if one of those goes bad.
Modified by 94_240sx at 11:48 AM 2/27/2008

User avatar
numnutzzz
Posts: 128
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 2:28 pm

Post

im in school right now so i dont have the time to check. i remember the last time i drop the top and it works perfectly fine. its just after the 5 speed swap that i have this problem so im assuming that the problem is most likely in front of the car and not the back.

i am also thinking that my speedsensor might have made contact with my firewall when i was installing the motor therefore leaving me with no speedo.

User avatar
-RJ-
Posts: 2469
Joined: Wed Aug 09, 2006 4:26 am
Car: S13 Convertible, 99 Frontier, 03 Sportage, 96 Protege
Location: Virginia Beach

Post

ok so from what i read, a KAE speed sensor will not work in a KADE

is that right?

User avatar
numnutzzz
Posts: 128
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 2:28 pm

Post

my swap was the same year, 92 ka24de. the speedo was working before i pulled it off my friends car

94_240sx
Posts: 7673
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:56 am
Car: 94_240SX
Location: DFW, TX
Contact:

Post

Here goes some more...

I used 1 ½" hole saw, and it went very well. It's tad bigger than the cylinder, so you have to make the hole in exact center. Otherwise, you will have to use dremel to make the hole bigger.

This is the where you have to drill 3 holes on the firewall.

I used a nail as a punch. You can drill holes in exact center this way.

This drill was $39.99 shipped from overstock.com. http://www.overstock.com/Home-....htmlHome Depot sells Milwaukee one too, but it's about $120 plus tax.

I taped the drill bit too, so it wouldn't move around.

Done. Make sure to put something underneath. Otherwise, debris will fall and go under the carpet.

I used touch up paint to prevent rust.

Pedals installed. It was much easier with steering shaft out of the car. I took it out to install aluminum bushing.

All done!! It didn't take too long, but the problem was space. You will have to kinda lie down on the floor and do this.

Feel free to ask questions.

User avatar
Kristine
Posts: 331
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2007 11:13 am
Car: 1992 Toyota Paseo
1997 Nissan Altima

Post

im confused on the wiring, im using a s14 tranny and the picture provided looks different. and how am i supposed to wire the speed sensor?

User avatar
-RJ-
Posts: 2469
Joined: Wed Aug 09, 2006 4:26 am
Car: S13 Convertible, 99 Frontier, 03 Sportage, 96 Protege
Location: Virginia Beach

Post

i have a question on the inhibitor switch, im supposed to splice those 3 wires together right? that blue box confuses me

503sandyor
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Mar 23, 2008 6:58 pm

Post


Modified by 503sandyor at 11:22 PM 3/23/2008

User avatar
jiffy08
Posts: 170
Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2007 11:35 am
Car: 92 hatchback 240sx

Post

i'm in the middle of my 5 speed swap right now, and i had A LOT of trouble taking out the auto pilot bearing. It is a PITA to get out. my dad and i rented a pilot bearing puller from autozone, and it was not working. We tried the chizeling method and it still didn't work. The best way to take it out was using the blind hole puller from autozone. That thing grabbed it like nothing. If you're having trouble taking it out, thats what you should get:)


Return to “240SX Convertible Forum”