I was being sarcastic because I do not wish to argue about it anymore thats all-- thanks though every motor that comes out of the factory is the same just like a muffler will give you 100 horsesDaunttless wrote:Sheesh, I tell ya the same thing earlier and I get taken for a ride...
How much to install KA24E pistons (9.1:1)in a KA24DE?? Benefits?
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Daunttless
- Posts: 4001
- Joined: Sun May 12, 2002 7:20 am
There is no need to get lippy and/or defensive. I'm sorry that you made a claim and we questioned how it was possible. It happens, we don't just accept things. If I just started saying, yeah, my 240SX came with 10.1:1 compression, people would probably question me as to how it happened as well. Its not a normal thing, I was willing to accept the fact that it was possible, because I know of a lot of variation from KA to KA, I had just never heard of THAT much as that is a rather significant change in the scheme of things. I'm sorry that I didn't read your post close enough to realize you were being sarcastic. I read the beginning and though ohh, he must have looked at his records and found out that the mechanics made some changes, since earlier you stated that you could remember a 350 dollar job that you couldn't remember what they did. I don't know why people think we treat new members so horribly, most of us just ask as to how things work and people instantly jump on us for "jumping" on them. Just like the S14 vs. 7HE thing, I'm sorry that one guy said something that pissed you off. This is really starting to get frustrating, and we haven't had nay problems with any other new members. Just because you're new doesn't mean we think you're an idiot, but it DOES mean you have something to prove, I'm sorry, if you show up here and have 1 post and say you're God, I'm probably going to question it. If you say up and claim all sorts of knowledge, thats cool, but if someone calls you out or asks you something it sbecause on our old board we had a lot of problemw ith that. So suck it up, answer the question, and move on, and shortly you'll be one of the "accepted" members that you think are out to get you. We aren't out to get anyone, I've questioned more accepted members in one day than I have either of you added together in the like 3 days you've been here. Now calm down, show that you ahve some knowledge through "actions"/"words" whatever, rather than claims with nothing that backs it up. Argh.
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TrunkMonkey
- Posts: 3529
- Joined: Sun Aug 04, 2002 7:48 am
- Car: 2000 lincoln navigator
Re: Re: one more thing
with a domed piston you run into valve clearance issues. the SOHC 8.6:1 piston is dished while the 9.1:1 is flat.grygst76 wrote:
according to nissan stock compression on a KA24DE in 1992 was 10.1 then it went to 9.51 in 93 and going to 11.1 will cause unsurpassable valve to piston smash with a higher lift cam unless you carefully check the clearances.
(i'm not trying to pick on you or start anything grygst76, but i just felt i needed to correct that little bit of misinformation.)
Daunttless wrote:There is no need to get lippy and/or defensive. I'm sorry that you made a claim and we questioned how it was possible. It happens, we don't just accept things. If I just started saying, yeah, my 240SX came with 10.1:1 compression, people would probably question me as to how it happened as well. Its not a normal thing, I was willing to accept the fact that it was possible, because I know of a lot of variation from KA to KA, I had just never heard of THAT much as that is a rather significant change in the scheme of things. I'm sorry that I didn't read your post close enough to realize you were being sarcastic. I read the beginning and though ohh, he must have looked at his records and found out that the mechanics made some changes, since earlier you stated that you could remember a 350 dollar job that you couldn't remember what they did. I don't know why people think we treat new members so horribly, most of us just ask as to how things work and people instantly jump on us for "jumping" on them. Just like the S14 vs. 7HE thing, I'm sorry that one guy said something that pissed you off. This is really starting to get frustrating, and we haven't had nay problems with any other new members. Just because you're new doesn't mean we think you're an idiot, but it DOES mean you have something to prove, I'm sorry, if you show up here and have 1 post and say you're God, I'm probably going to question it. If you say up and claim all sorts of knowledge, thats cool, but if someone calls you out or asks you something it sbecause on our old board we had a lot of problemw ith that. So suck it up, answer the question, and move on, and shortly you'll be one of the "accepted" members that you think are out to get you. We aren't out to get anyone, I've questioned more accepted members in one day than I have either of you added together in the like 3 days you've been here. Now calm down, show that you ahve some knowledge through "actions"/"words" whatever, rather than claims with nothing that backs it up. Argh.
It's funny because I will agree with most that you say but from a lot of the boards that I subscribed to I try to help and add knowledge from my own personal experience and from what my mechanic friends have taught me. I never go around pretending to know everything like most people I hear and see but I have been working on motors since I was 11 years old starting with chevy's--going to pontiacs--and now I'm trying my luck with imports. It seems that whenever you try and help someone in this day and age they like to argue and what not or completely disbelieve you because they follow the masses and not actual fact. I'm not bashing your beliefs or anyone elses---I'm bashing ignorance since their is so much of it. For example My friend works for a huge chevy dealership and from the factory where he had to go sometimes to pick up special order c5 corvettes (this is just an example) the horsepower and compression varied quite a bit EVEN though they were all stock from the factory. As long as it still passses gvt standards it didn't matter. My buddy Jerry who owns a nissan dealership has told me the same freakin thing so thats why I come to this board with knowledge and I really do try to keep my composure but it gets difficult. Dauntless don't think for a minute I'm razing you cause I'm not, I just try to share real life knowledge and experience. No two engines from the factory are going to be the same due to machining and workers are not machines and machines are not perfect, but when it comes off the line and the gvt standard has been met, the car rolls and gets sold. Because mine has 10.1 cr means I have a special car? No. It means I got lucky and bought one of the few mistakes that came off the line. I'm going to talk more with jerry this weekend because he is going to try and get me into a black top and pass emissions in Mass so I will get more details and share them here, Thanks
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TrunkMonkey
- Posts: 3529
- Joined: Sun Aug 04, 2002 7:48 am
- Car: 2000 lincoln navigator
alright, i can see i'm going to have to put in a little more than 2 cents here.
No two engines from the factory are going to be the same due to machining and workers are not machines and machines are not perfect,
that's why if you read an FSM they don't have exact measurements listed. everything is in ranges. as long as everything falls inside the ranges listed then it is OK.
Because mine has 10.1 cr means I have a special car? No. It means I got lucky and bought one of the few mistakes that came off the line.
an engine's compression ratio is determined when it is being designed. if a manufacturer designs an engine to be at a certain compresssion ratio, and all of the parts are manufactured to the designed specs, there is no way to get an off the assembly line engine with the compression difference that you are claiming. how do you know that your car had 10:1 compression ratio if you haven't blueprinted the engine to know all of it's specs?
6 ways to increase compression ratio
1. larger bore2. longer stroke3. decked engine block4. changing pistons5. thinner head gasket6. milled cylinder head
none of these things will happen on an assembly line.
the main thing that i'm trying to get across is that once an engine has been put together there is absolutely no way to know if it has a higher or lower compression ratio compared to another "identical" engine. if you run a compression test on three of the same engines fresh off the assembly line they will not the same. that does not mean that the compression ratio is not the same. running a compression test will tell you how well an engine holds it's compression. this is why some engines from the factory will feel stronger than others. you might have been blessed with an engine that would read 190psi on all four cylinders, but joe blow's car reads 175, 180, 175, 170. your car will definitely feel stronger, but there is nothing wrong with joe blow's car because it is still within factory specs. how well an engine holds it's compression also affects it's horsepower. on a V8 engine there can be a significant difference in horsepower figures because of displacement.
i'm not trying to start a pissing contest, and by no means do i know everything, but i am telling you what i know from studying and experience NOT from hearsay.
No two engines from the factory are going to be the same due to machining and workers are not machines and machines are not perfect,
that's why if you read an FSM they don't have exact measurements listed. everything is in ranges. as long as everything falls inside the ranges listed then it is OK.
Because mine has 10.1 cr means I have a special car? No. It means I got lucky and bought one of the few mistakes that came off the line.
an engine's compression ratio is determined when it is being designed. if a manufacturer designs an engine to be at a certain compresssion ratio, and all of the parts are manufactured to the designed specs, there is no way to get an off the assembly line engine with the compression difference that you are claiming. how do you know that your car had 10:1 compression ratio if you haven't blueprinted the engine to know all of it's specs?
6 ways to increase compression ratio
1. larger bore2. longer stroke3. decked engine block4. changing pistons5. thinner head gasket6. milled cylinder head
none of these things will happen on an assembly line.
the main thing that i'm trying to get across is that once an engine has been put together there is absolutely no way to know if it has a higher or lower compression ratio compared to another "identical" engine. if you run a compression test on three of the same engines fresh off the assembly line they will not the same. that does not mean that the compression ratio is not the same. running a compression test will tell you how well an engine holds it's compression. this is why some engines from the factory will feel stronger than others. you might have been blessed with an engine that would read 190psi on all four cylinders, but joe blow's car reads 175, 180, 175, 170. your car will definitely feel stronger, but there is nothing wrong with joe blow's car because it is still within factory specs. how well an engine holds it's compression also affects it's horsepower. on a V8 engine there can be a significant difference in horsepower figures because of displacement.
i'm not trying to start a pissing contest, and by no means do i know everything, but i am telling you what i know from studying and experience NOT from hearsay.
demcj wrote:alright, i can see i'm going to have to put in a little more than 2 cents here.
No two engines from the factory are going to be the same due to machining and workers are not machines and machines are not perfect,
that's why if you read an FSM they don't have exact measurements listed. everything is in ranges. as long as everything falls inside the ranges listed then it is OK.
Because mine has 10.1 cr means I have a special car? No. It means I got lucky and bought one of the few mistakes that came off the line.
an engine's compression ratio is determined when it is being designed. if a manufacturer designs an engine to be at a certain compresssion ratio, and all of the parts are manufactured to the designed specs, there is no way to get an off the assembly line engine with the compression difference that you are claiming. how do you know that your car had 10:1 compression ratio if you haven't blueprinted the engine to know all of it's specs?
6 ways to increase compression ratio
1. larger bore2. longer stroke3. decked engine block4. changing pistons5. thinner head gasket6. milled cylinder head
none of these things will happen on an assembly line.
the main thing that i'm trying to get across is that once an engine has been put together there is absolutely no way to know if it has a higher or lower compression ratio compared to another "identical" engine. if you run a compression test on three of the same engines fresh off the assembly line they will not the same. that does not mean that the compression ratio is not the same. running a compression test will tell you how well an engine holds it's compression. this is why some engines from the factory will feel stronger than others. you might have been blessed with an engine that would read 190psi on all four cylinders, but joe blow's car reads 175, 180, 175, 170. your car will definitely feel stronger, but there is nothing wrong with joe blow's car because it is still within factory specs. how well an engine holds it's compression also affects it's horsepower. on a V8 engine there can be a significant difference in horsepower figures because of displacement.
i'm not trying to start a pissing contest, and by no means do i know everything, but i am telling you what i know from studying and experience NOT from hearsay.
This weekend I brought my 240 into my buddies shop and they took it apart just the top half because I failed emissions here in Mass and wanted them to find out why. They did a volume test on the head and relating to piston---I was wrong the first time and so were they. Do you know what my compression ratio is? 9.945!!!!so I was off by a few thousandths whoopdeedoo!!!! I then asked why would it be so high Mr. Nissan Mechanic for the past 13 years? He said "well Mr. Gary, it's because of several factors, 1 is that you kept very good care of this motor by following the proper break in and running good gas, and 2 the leakdown test showed the rings are doing a great job holding blowby with a 1% margin, and 3 is your head gasket for some reason was thinner then normal at .40 instead of .043. And like I said I've owned this car since new with only 15 miles on it. So now we had to put the same head gasket back on it and the gasket was special order so I have to wait until tonight to get it @165.00$$ So I guess fact overwrites fiction again. Now I will say my car is special--special to me and special to the Mr. Nissan Mechanics that took it apart, Also Like to add that their was very very little build up on the valves and almost none on the pistons (due to always using 92 or better octane and boost every 5 tanks. I just like to thank you guys for giving me the courage to pull it apart and find out the truth once and for all!!!!!
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TrunkMonkey
- Posts: 3529
- Joined: Sun Aug 04, 2002 7:48 am
- Car: 2000 lincoln navigator
grygst76 wrote:They did a volume test on the head and relating to piston---I was wrong the first time and so were they. Do you know what my compression ratio is? 9.945!!!!so I was off by a few thousandths whoopdeedoo!!!! I then asked why would it be so high Mr. Nissan Mechanic for the past 13 years?
you still don't get it do you? unless you physically alter the internals of your engine the compression ratio will NEVER change. i don't care if your car is 100 years old, you will always have a 9.5:1 compression ratio.
He said "well Mr. Gary, it's because of several factors, 1 is that you kept very good care of this motor by following the proper break in and running good gas, and 2 the leakdown test showed the rings are doing a great job holding blowby with a 1% margin,
this was your compression test (which sounds good by the way) and has NOTHING to do with your compression ratio.
and 3 is your head gasket for some reason was thinner then normal at .40 instead of .043. And like I said I've owned this car since new with only 15 miles on it. So now we had to put the same head gasket back on it and the gasket was special order so I have to wait until tonight to get it @165.00$$
this is how your compression ratio got bumped up. please let everyone know where you got a thinner head gasket from. i'm sure people are very interested.
if you reused it, was it metal?
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