Hot Tanked and HOned

[DriFt3r]

How much will it cost to have the engine hot tanked, honed, bored, and putting new pistons in? Anyone ever done this?

[Nathan]

The price I was quoted last week for some machine work:degrease block (dunno if its the same as hot tanking) : 75bore and hone: 65align hone: 85resurface block: 95balance rotating assembly: 125clean and assemble short block: 200re-grind crank: 65

I dont think I'll be getting all of that done, but there's an estimate for you. I included the assembly since you mentiond getting pistons put in. For me, assembly includes file fitting the rings, determining which bearings are needed, checking clearances on everything and putting it all together, I think 200 bucks is well worth that I should be out the door for between 6 and 800 including bearings and gaskets.

[andrave]

if your crank is fine and your head doesn't need surfaced then you can cut some cost off of that.And if you go with quality pistons that are within a few grams of each other, balancing them is overkill for an engine with stock cams that will operate below the stock redline.

[Nathan]

A piston .25 grams out of balance = 67lbs. out of balance at 2000rpms according to one machine shop I spoke with...balancing them is cheap enough and makes me feel better. I doubt I will have the block resurfaced, I might though since I can NOT get it clean no matter what I try. I agree about the crank too Andrave, but I think I somehow touched the journals and put a mark or two on them. The shop is going to take a look at it when I bring it in and tell me what they think (probably means they'll think it needs a re-grind but oh well). I actually wanted to avoid regrinding the crank at all costs but since I found those marks I think I might just do it. I also flirted with the idea of using 1500 grit sandpaper followed by buffing the affected journals with polishing compound but it seems a bit too shade-tree even for me

[andrave]

you wouldn't want to do the crank yourself. You would probably get the journals off round, and that would eventualy deform the bearing and... well, **** things up. You may be right about the pistons, I'm not sure... I've known people who bought ross pistons, which are supposedly matched very well from the factory (claimed 2 grams but most people have weighed theirs and they are much closer) and not had them balanced.

[Nathan]

Yeah, I have ross pistons and I'm not anticipating them having to do much at all to them Are you doubting my skills with sandpaper and a drill with a buffing pad and compound? how DARE you!! haha, like I said, I just flirted with the idea and have pretty much decided that the shop can just do it, they have the experience, I dont.

[andrave]

oh yeah, I've heard big differences in pricing if you shop around, you might want to get quotes from a couple other shops.

[Nathan]

Funny enough there are CRAZY differences in pricing, I contacted a lot of machine shops and it ran the gamut from 500 done and put back together to 1600 (note, not all the same machine work for those estimates). For instance, a bore and hone at one place was somewhere around 250 (with a torque plate) but is only 65 at the place I will have it done at (without torque plate). I actually chose the place I'm having the work done at because they have a LOT of high power V8 experience and are starting to get a good number of imports too, were very knowledgeable, had a good size shop, very curteous, very foul language (I like people that dont try to impress me), and seem to be doing quite good business and they ONLY sell performance parts. One place I checked out sold altezzas, that just ain't right! The best part is they are less than a mile from my front door, so I can always go down and check things out myself.

[WDRacing]

On the crank, get the oil holes chamfered, the bearing journals micropolished and the counterweights knife edged. I totally agree with getting the whole rotating assembly balanced, but you need to include the flywheel into the eqaution also. With all that balanced the car will perform so much better. With a new valve train, even stock, you can extend the redline safely.

Another thing to think about, if your getting the block decked, you really should get the head decked as well, especially since aluminum warps before iron does. Then have your pistons cut for compression. Depending on how much material the machine shop has to actually remove.

WD

[DAEDALUS]

I don't think you should hot tank anything aluminum. It'll change color at the very least, or begin to dissolve if left in too long. The machine shop should be able to guide you on what to clean and how, since really they're the ones who need it done more than you.What's the goal here? Are you seeking higher performance than stock, or is the stocker just too worn out?

[kettnerc]

Check out http://www.vtengines.com and look at some of their prices under "Services." I'm heading there this afternoon actually to work out a price and package for building up my KA.

[Nathan]

I disagree on knife edging the crank, bull nosing yes, knife edging no. In my opinion it's just ridiculous overkill for a street motor and while it will allow it to spin up faster, there's a reason the little men in white coats made those counterweights so heavy. My understanding is that your counterweights should be twice as heavy as your piston/rod combination for maximum engine longevity (thats from a machinist). When you have a rotating assembly balanced, EVERYTHING should be included, that means pistons, rods, flywheel, pressure plate, flywheel bolts, pressure plate bolts, and the front pulley. If it's attached to that crank in any way it should be balanced both individually and as one whole unit.

[WDRacing]

By knife edging the crank your losing wt and losing the paracitic loss of the crank dragging through the oil. If your worried about your rotating mass not having enough inertia, stay with a heavier flywheel. A street motor will enjoy the revibilty of a light wt balanced motor. But thats also my opinion...to each his own. Either way, I say the rest of the work should be done.

WD

[Nathan]

I wasn't even talking about it from a revability standpoint, just a longevity standpoint I guess knifed edged flywheels just scare me since it's so far from what the designers originally intended. I'd prefer just a full balance with a lightweight flywheel. Hey WD, I've tried searching around and dont want to wait a few days...could you explain chamfering the crank really quick?

[WDRacing]

Sure, the oil wholes for the main bearings simply get elongated, which is to say the get wider at the opening. Kind of like making a hole for a countersunk screw. The hole is beveled inward, this is to allow for more oil flow to the bearings. I've actually seen guys do it themselves..lol. I'd stick with the machine shop.

WD

[Nathan]

Ok, thats what I thought...they are allready countersunk but chamfering elongates them. Makes sense, thanks!

[WDRacing]

No problem, whether or not it has alot of effect, I can't say for sure, Its just somthing I was always told to have done.

WD

[Kadath128]

Hehe gotta love blind obedience... that's military bearing for ya :P

<- US Army so no flames please