Good first firearm?

Post by **Dano** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 4:29 pm

Here's another question for ya. Simple cliffnotes of dual action trigger?

-Dan

Post by **fayceoff** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 4:50 pm

You don't even notice it if your finger is on the trigger the way it's supposed to be. Or are you talking about the long first pull, like on a Beretta? Either way, once you've familiarized yourself with the weapon carrying/shooting, no problems.

Post by **Mr1der** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 4:56 pm

double action trigger was first coined on revolvers. the earliest revolvers required that the hammer be manually cocked before firing where on the newer double actions the hammer was cocked as the trigger was pulled but at the cost of having a longer heavier pull.

this same concept holds true in auto pistols too BUT some will have the first shot be double action and the following single action because the slide's rearward movement will c*** the hammer for the following shot

now, with a Double Action Only (DAO) pistol, such as the Glock, each pull of the trigger will both c*** and realease the firing mechanism

Post by **fayceoff** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 5:14 pm

Yeah, that's what I just said.

Post by **Dano** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 9:29 pm

Awesome, thanks James!

Here's the list I'm going to look at, probly won't venture much further than this after looking at lots of stuff. Gonna get my hands on all of them and check em out.

-New Beretta PX4 Storm .40-Glock 23 .40-Sig Sauer SP2022 Pro .40-Springfield XD-40 4" Service which is what i'm still leaning towards right now

Sig Sauer P229R Equinox is cool but at $900, it's more than i'm looking to spend.

-Dan

Post by **Repo Man** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 3:10 am

All good choices Dan, but if it was me I would go with either the Glock or the XD. Be sure to consider your aftermarket options if you want to mod the gun. Way more options for the Glock, parts are cheaper and there are more readily-available armorers. Plus, you can shoot in GSSF meets and be a member, just like me.

http://www.gssfonline.com

Post by **Mr1der** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 3:52 am

Light or Dark side brother...which one are you gonna join?

I'm not really sure which is which though.

I'd opt for which one YOU prefer. The Glock does have a more extensive aftermarket and support system...but it's also been around what? 25 years now?

Originally I WAS gonna get a .357 Glock and do a trigger job to it....

Check out http://www.cheaperthandirt.com for ammo needs....they're pretty cheap on good defense loads and target too really...just make sure that the shipping costs don't outweigh what you can find it locally for.

Post by **Repo Man** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 4:09 am

LOL James. I wasn't trying to stir up a rivalry or anything, I was just saying to consider all angles. When I had an XD and wanted to trick it out, I didn't have many options. I looked at all the options the Glock guys had and it was frustrating. Granted, things have changed a bit over the last couple years, but the aftermarket is still far deeper for a Glock than an XD. Fact, not opinion.

James is right though Dan, if one feels better to you than the other, that's the one you go with.

Post by **Mr1der** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 6:19 am

I'm not either bro, just entertaining myself. No lie though, the glock aftermarket is still lightyears ahead of the XD, but it's slowly coming on strong. Leatham shooting it now instead of a TRP will probably influence it too.

but still either one is a good pic.

it's all about user preference.

Post by **Cold_Zero** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 3:25 pm

Dan,Not a bad list. I would say go with a Glock or XD and take the difference on the SIGs and enroll in a tactical defensive shooting school. I shot an IDPA match today and I found out today there is a lot of things that I need to learn and work on. A school like the one that Andy attended would be a great resource. I was going to say that James, Andy and Dan need to come down the first Saturday of the month and shoot a IDPA match with our local gun club. It is a blast, the other shooters are helpful and you learn a great deal. A great deal about yourself and shooting skills. (Disclaimer: A IDPA match is in by no means a replacement for a good Defensive Shooting course/school). Either that or we all need to enroll in a Tactical Defensive Shooting school together. That would probably be the most rockeness NICO meet ever!

But, as far as keeping loaded mags go, I have had my Glock mags loaded for 3 straight years now 10 rounds in each clip (10 max) and have NEVER had a feeding/loading problem with any of the 5. I figure if I do, I can buy a replacement and not break the bank.

Post by **Dano** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 4:26 pm

Awesome, yeah, the schooling is all in the works down the road. I'm still saving for a truck and working out of the garage, so money is still pretty tight, so a school like that, since it's out of state will be a little down the road, but i'll definately be making it out to the range a lot to start familiarizing myself with it.

I'm probably going tomorrow to Bass Pro Shop to go get my hands on some models. I'll let you know what I come up with.

-Dan

Post by **Cold_Zero** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 4:31 pm

Have fun and let us know how it goes.bud

Post by **Dano** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 4:34 pm

I sure will. Thanks again for all your guys' input!

-Dan

Post by **Mr1der** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 6:10 am

DanO wrote:Awesome, yeah, the schooling is all in the works down the road. I'm still saving for a truck and working out of the garage, so money is still pretty tight, so a school like that, since it's out of state will be a little down the road, but i'll definately be making it out to the range a lot to start familiarizing myself with it.

I'm probably going tomorrow to Bass Pro Shop to go get my hands on some models. I'll let you know what I come up with.

-Dan

I probably wouldn't buy at Bass though...they're usually full blown MSRP.

Dan, I'd really try to find a local shop, they'll always have the best selection and some of the really neat tactical rifles for the local PD to drool over.

I'd highly suggest a good 12ga too. I prefer the Mossberg 500/590 because I'm a southpaw and the safety and action lock are well placed for lefties.

a Remington 870 is an excellent choice too, and both can be had in nice trim for 300 or less.

I really need to get an 8 shot pump next. My old bird gun has seen better days....honestly I need to tear it down and give it a full cleaning and new safety button. it's a 500A with a 28" Barrel and accu-chokeII choke system. I've had it for 13 years now....needless to say, it's had a rough life in terms of shooting.

it DOES have 3 confirmed bat kills on it though.

Post by **fayceoff** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 6:13 am

Mr1der wrote:it DOES have 3 confirmed bat kills on it though.

Uhmm.... wow.

Post by **Mr1der** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 8:18 am

try shooting the little bastards sometime.

it's only for the skilled wing shooters...kinda like hummingbirds...I've only gotten one of those.

Post by **Dano** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 11:44 am

Haha, dammit James, I know enough not to buy from Bass Pro or the like, i'm just going to get a feel. Give me SOME credit.

-Dan

Post by **fayceoff** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 11:52 am

Mr1der wrote:try shooting the little bastards sometime.

it's only for the skilled wing shooters...kinda like hummingbirds...I've only gotten one of those.

Hummingbirds are so small... If you're shooting at one with a 12GA, how do know if you hit it or just scared it away? (I would NEVER shoot a hummingbird, personally - my mom and grandmother are from Mississippi and it's bad luck or something to kill them)

Post by **Mr1der** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 12:26 pm

the feather explosion.

they've got a lot of small soft feathers.

with a normal #8 birdshot, they tend to just get knocked about 10 feet from where you hit them.

Post by **fayceoff** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 1:54 pm

You're a sick man.

Post by **Mr1der** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 3:18 pm

I'm very aware.

god I love my 12ga.

I need to find a good dove field this season...they're easy prey though.

Post by **fayceoff** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 3:33 pm

Doves are stupid. I hit one with my Galant coming off an exit ramp a long time ago... They have lots of soft feathers, too.

Post by **Mr1der** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 3:52 pm

mmm hmmm.

it's easier to pluck a ****in' turkey.

Post by **Dano** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 7:52 pm

SOOOOOO.

I went, I looked, I touched, I handled.

It's between 2. XD-40 and Sig SP2022 PRO.

Glock 23 is out. I loved the sights, simplicity, and look, but didn't feel good in my hand, in fact, felt horrible. I'd have to use a grip extension on it before i'd even consider looking at it again, but still didn't feel good with my hand wrapping around it. I was really disappointed as that was one my 2 big choices to look at.

The XD-40 felt great, guy took the trigger lock off so I could feel the the trigger safety. Didn't dry fire but really liked how it sat in my hand, felt good. Only grip was the grip was just a *hair* narrow for my liking, but i'm sure that's very easily fixable and definately not something I couldn't live with. It just felt good.

Sig Sauer P226 and P229 i'm counting as one gun, even though the 226 is larger, they both felt the same. They felt great actually but the price for my first gun is a huge turnoff, so we'll save one of those for maybe down the line. Great feel though on both of them.

Sig Sauer SP2022 PRO felt great, is about the same price as the XD, and just fit my hand great as well. I need to do more research on this piece as I don't know much about. I've focused most of my research on the other guns so want to read up on this one.

Beretta PX4 Storm. Didn't hold it, didn't really look at it. So far I've only heard "I like it" or "I hate it" and none of the "I like it"'s ever gave reasons why. Only the dislikers, so, no go for me. Killer looks though!

So, XD-40 or SP2022 PRO right now, and I'm still on the XD side of the teeter totter.

-Dan

Post by **Mr1der** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 5:12 am

you can actually change out the backstrap on the SIG Pro's for a more personalized fit.

try holding a .45 XD as well Dan, the grip is slightly bigger.

Post by **Dano** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 5:46 am

I will at some point, right now i'm just focusing on .40's.

-Dan

Post by **Mr1der** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 6:39 am

see if you can find a Sig Pro in one of the stores that'll let you mess with the backstrap.

also...look into a Walther p99.

they're small, neat looking and a good design. I think they usually run 600 though.

Post by **Repo Man** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 7:45 am

Dan needs a big grip. Hehehehehehehehe...

Post by **Dano** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 8:56 am

James, I sort of glanced at the P99, love the looks of it, have an airsoft version of it, but after talking to a few people that either owned one or spent some time with one and weren't necessarily pleased with reliability (they complained of more than a couple jams within the first few hundred rounds through the gun) It's not something I want for a first firearm.

Andy... HA, HA, HA.

What do you gus think about the SP2022 PRO? What are the ups and downs in your opinions in design? I know you guys don't have one but just curious on your basic opinions.

For the people that don't know what they look like:

Sig SP2022 Pro

XD-40

-Dan

Post by **Mr1der** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 10:08 am

I've never honestly messed with a SIG Pro...but with the name it's wearing, I doubt it'll be a let down.

dry fire or live fire both Dan.

the Sig Pro is a traditional double action, it's intent to be carried loaded with the hammer down. the first trigger pull will be long and heavy.

the XD however is a SA where in it is meant to be holstered cocked. it has no decocker on it. It's only gonna have trigger pull to get accustom to.

Good first firearm?

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