....im debating on locking this changing the title to The infamous ams argument.....or just deleting it....its gone way way to far....I think once on nico before this have i seen a true fight maybe twice....this is dumb everyone say there apologies for any personal shots do that now...no more fighting arnt we all grown up and a little old to be fighting on forums any way.

Im closing this thread down tommorrow night thats gives everyone a chance to make up.

Im sorry to joe if i acted immature and took a personal shot at you...

I'm sorry Lando for my umbrella comment

joe645733 wrote: that's exactly what the thread was about. but MrTdawg, king of the internet life keeps whining and pouting about it. it has become amusing how angry he gets about the AMS company. just keep mentioning it.

It's TDogg, joephonenumber, get it right.

joe645733 wrote: 1) the turbos i'm sure can make 400whp.

I don't disagree.

joe645733 wrote:2) i do see the shaft of my shifter, i'm not into the baggy looking shift boots.

joe645733 wrote:3) have you tested any of their products out? i'm guessing not. i can tell you just follow what other people say about things. i can care less if the short shifter gave me head while driving. it was $80 and like i said, i wanted the shifter to be shortened in height and look nice.

-I have witnessed tests by qualified individuals and independent labs. If you read my post here, you'd understand some of these points.

joe645733 wrote:4) quit being a little b**** about the little things in life. i couldn't imagine you trying to handle something actually important. you must ball your eyes out. i had to say it because you just think you're the s***.

- Far from it, we all have our faults and I realize this. Please don't project your own issues with how you handle your life on to me. You don't know me from the hole in your blow-up doll, and only judge me on my passion for the Z32 aftermarket. There are many Zs far greater than mine, but I am also very happy with mine. You're not happy with yours, understood.

joe645733 wrote:5) i don't need to write you a novel about my shifter. i told you i bought it and it shifts/looks nice. that's all you need to know. my AMS shifter opinion was towards the OP in this thread. go make some friends

- I have plenty of friends, both in and out of the Z community, but thanks for your concern on my social abilities. The AMS short shifter, or any shifter for that matter, has NOTHING to do with power goals. Never mind the fact the OP never asked about it in the first place.

joe645733 wrote:exactly, stillen is a well-known company.
i own a full stillen exhaust that is stainless steel, paid well over $1,000 for it (got ripped off, unless it was 1996 when you bought it) and i'm not happy with it. Mr.T thinks name is everything.

Stillen exhausts are great. I had a first generation oval muffler Stillen on my old Z. Sounded awesome, quality materials and manufacturing. Why were you not happy with it? There are definitely better options available for $1k, but the Stillen is a decent choice. It's your car, do what you want. It's Eric's car, he can do what he wants. I'm just trying to show him there are better alternatives to the crap he was looking at.

OK Joe toolshed, I'm not impressed by your naive babbling. Don't take this the wrong way, but you're apparently an idiot. It's painfully clear you don't know what you're talking about, so I just hope you sell your Z to someone who will appreciate it and get a Kia like you really need.

legion wrote:I wish I was an enthusiast. But I have AMS pulleys and manifolds, FML

We all make mistakes, understandable. As shown here, your pulleys don't fit correctly though, so might want to consider changing them. What's important to notice in the link is how Vuk replied. Not a "thanks for bringing this to our attention Bernie, we'll make the appropriate changes to the tool". Just a whole lot of spin control. THEY DON'T CARE ABOUT THE END USER. If it impacts their bottom line, they won't do it. The manifolds, well I assume you were drawn in by the price. That happens. (BTW, I get your sarcasm). Just don't complain if new products being developed for our cars comes to a grinding halt. Truly new products, not knock offs of existing ones. Supporting a company that stifles innovation prevents you from being an enthusiast, by definition.

es.biggs wrote:Gees all the shots at my man Tony. Hope it doesn't turn him away...he's a big help to a lot of people on this board.

No worries Biggie, I'm not goin anywhere. I know there are a lot of intelligent people here, and unfortunately some not so intelligent. But it's way better than 3ZC, that's for sure. There are some things I can learn here and I do hope to continue helping members where I can.

FFRpwner, I sincerely apologize for the train derailment in the preceding pages. Some other members and my self were only trying to shed some light on you build goal. You asked for opinions, and they were given. I had the best intentions in helping someone who is fairly new to the Z game learn from other's mistakes and share the years of experience I have with the car. No shots were taken at you as a person, so I hope you realize it's nothing personal. Best of luck with your build, regardless of the path you choose. Feel free to PM me or others regarding your build, or if you make another post when you get closer purchasing parts I'd be happy to help then.

BigTDogg (MA) wrote:
We all make mistakes, understandable. As shown here, your pulleys don't fit correctly though, so might want to consider changing them. What's important to notice in the link is how Vuk replied. Not a "thanks for bringing this to our attention Bernie, we'll make the appropriate changes to the tool". Just a whole lot of spin control. THEY DON'T CARE ABOUT THE END USER. If it impacts their bottom line, they won't do it. The manifolds, well I assume you were drawn in by the price. That happens. (BTW, I get your sarcasm). Just don't complain if new products being developed for our cars comes to a grinding halt. Truly new products, not knock offs of existing ones. Supporting a company that stifles innovation prevents you from being an enthusiast, by definition.

how can anyone defend ams products after this? the pulleys don't fit correctly.

All I'm going to say is sorry to FFRpwner for that one post. I get frustrated when someone just ignores the facts or the logical explination. I deal with this several times a week in the field of my studies (The Bible, early Judaism, early Christianity, Mormonism, ect.) I have emailed authors and PH. Ds about s*** they were wrong about or just flat out ignored. Normally with these people I just keep giving them fact after fact after fact until they shut up but a lot of times it's like beating a dead horse with a stick and I get a little frustrated...
I figured you were like one of those people but I actually gained a ton of respect for you by actually being logical and taking peoples advice. I really didn't think you would change your stance. After you did I felt kinda bad because I could feel the air leave your balloon but I think in the long run you made the right choice and will be a lot happier with your car.

vulcanrush wrote: how can anyone defend ams products after this? the pulleys don't fit correctly.

I agree...I mean this says it all right here...

Additionally I placed both the AMS & HI pulleys onto a standard shipping scale. The scale was calibrated to "0" before each item was placed on it. Given the holes cut into the mating surface of the AMS product the results might surprise you.

HI 4.4oz


AMS 4.8oz

This is all that needs to be said. They are apparently both aluminum but the AMS has large holes in it which should make it lighter...yet it weighs more. They are obviously lying when they say "Aircraft grade aluminum, the lightest and most efficient spinner on the market at only approximately 4.56 ounces, stock unit is over 10 ounces."
1. I doubt it's Aircraft grade aluminum since it isn't even aluminum...
2. It's not the lightest...
3. It doesn't come in at 4.56 ounces (and that still wouldn't make it the lightest)
4. And it for sure isn't the most efficent if it doesn't even line up properly...

You lie that many times about a single product how many lies are there in the entire company...

I think the only way you can defend this product is if you are one of the people that thinks the Shake Weight is going to make you ripped...in other words, a total idiot.

BigTDogg (MA) wrote:

legion wrote:I wish I was an enthusiast. But I have AMS pulleys and manifolds, FML

We all make mistakes, understandable. As shown here, your pulleys don't fit correctly though, so might want to consider changing them. What's important to notice in the link is how Vuk replied. Not a "thanks for bringing this to our attention Bernie, we'll make the appropriate changes to the tool". Just a whole lot of spin control. THEY DON'T CARE ABOUT THE END USER. If it impacts their bottom line, they won't do it. The manifolds, well I assume you were drawn in by the price. That happens. (BTW, I get your sarcasm). Just don't complain if new products being developed for our cars comes to a grinding halt. Truly new products, not knock offs of existing ones. Supporting a company that stifles innovation prevents you from being an enthusiast, by definition.

I'm glad you caught my sarcasm lol. And I'm not saying that AMS is better by any means, because clearly they are not. I purchased these parts before I knew about the whole AMS-war, and they will have to do for now. If I had a chance to re-do it, I would most likely wait and buy the MSP manifolds and maybe UR pulleys. It just ticked me off being called a non-enthusiast after spending the past 2 years taking a car that wasn't well maintained and eventually not running, into a good looking, actually driveable beast of a Z (yes, even with a couple AMS parts).

Sh*t man got to make more popcorn

Z32TT wrote:Sh*t man got to make more popcorn

and grab another beer

FFR dont lock this thread it is great and amuzing. If anything change the title to
"If you want to b*tch and argue with someone do it here" .
it would be come the battle ground for all who want to argue/ debat anything or "Flex their mod nuts" . sorry i had to say that. that way it wont get mixed in with other threads. insted of saying "wanna take this outside" People can say "lets take this to the battle ground thread"

just my cents. It has the potential for more pages than Venassa thread

Well I guess if some of you guys would rather just humor yourselves reading this thread as opposed to actually trying to help someone out or steer them in the right direction I don't have a problem with renaming the thread. I feel like some of you guys are the kind of people that would stand around and watch someone get beat up because it's not your problem. At least I was trying to make a difference.

vikesfankevin1986 wrote:Well I guess if some of you guys would rather just humor yourselves reading this thread as opposed to actually trying to help someone out or steer them in the right direction I don't have a problem with renaming the thread. I feel like some of you guys are the kind of people that would stand around and watch someone get beat up because it's not your problem. At least I was trying to make a difference.

this thread topic just got off topic a long time ago, that why it should be renamed. Then FFR can start a new thread and people people wont be argueing about parts and he will get the help he needs and be pointed in the right direction minus the BS

vikesfankevin1986 wrote:Well I guess if some of you guys would rather just humor yourselves reading this thread as opposed to actually trying to help someone out or steer them in the right direction I don't have a problem with renaming the thread. I feel like some of you guys are the kind of people that would stand around and watch someone get beat up because it's not your problem. At least I was trying to make a difference.

sounds like you where one of those guys that got beat up in a parking lot and no one helped you ...

JK

but if i wasnt and i wanted to start an e-fight this would be the place

vulcanrush wrote:

BigTDogg (MA) wrote:
We all make mistakes, understandable. As shown here, your pulleys don't fit correctly though, so might want to consider changing them. What's important to notice in the link is how Vuk replied. Not a "thanks for bringing this to our attention Bernie, we'll make the appropriate changes to the tool". Just a whole lot of spin control. THEY DON'T CARE ABOUT THE END USER. If it impacts their bottom line, they won't do it. The manifolds, well I assume you were drawn in by the price. That happens. (BTW, I get your sarcasm). Just don't complain if new products being developed for our cars comes to a grinding halt. Truly new products, not knock offs of existing ones. Supporting a company that stifles innovation prevents you from being an enthusiast, by definition.

how can anyone defend ams products after this? the pulleys don't fit correctly.

i would say they didn't fit his due to a defect. i bet someone on this earth is driving with one

FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT!
lol

in refrence to the guy getting beat up with everyone standing around.

BigTDogg (MA) wrote: OK Joe toolshed, I'm not impressed by your naive babbling. Don't take this the wrong way, but you're apparently an idiot. It's painfully clear you don't know what you're talking about, so I just hope you sell your Z to someone who will appreciate it and get a Kia like you really need.

i'm a tool? you're the one who thinks he's hot-s*** on a forum about cars lol. in every one of your posts, you sound like you should be treated like a king or something. but of course, it's because you have more posts and spend more time than i do.

so i guess people who have low posts like myself, shouldn't have a say or an opinion about anything.
get a life.

joe645733 wrote: i'm a tool? you're the one who thinks he's hot-s*** on a forum about cars lol. in every one of your posts, you sound like you should be treated like a king or something. but of course, it's because you have more posts and spend more time than i do.

so i guess people who have low posts like myself, shouldn't have a say or an opinion about anything.
get a life.

You have a right to your opinion but if you don't have anything worth adding maybe you should...YOU sound like you should be treated like a king. Here was your first post in here.

joe645733 wrote:i had a feeling this was just another, "high HP build with no money", thread.
how can you first set your goal to 450rwhp then settle for 380? lol i'm a little over 380whp and i'm bored as s*** with it. i wish i can make it more powerful but it's not worth putting the thousands and thousands of dollars into it. that's why i'm selling it.
and to the people bashing about your choice and opinion on what parts you want, go with whatever you feel. a lot of these people are just stubborn internet snobs who will critisize a product until it's tested. then they say, "oh".
for example, look at godpseed intercoolers or their radiators. look how much crap people gave them and now they're on 700hp 300zx's. i've heard some horror stories about AMS and i've heard good stories. it's your money, buy what you want. that is, if you really had the money to build your Z. you seemed pretty quick to change your mind with just a couple of comments from strangers.

You come off as a d!ck with nothing positive to say. People were trying to save him from buying garbage. You sir, come on here and called people stubborn internet snobs.
"i've heard some horror stories about AMS and i've heard good stories."
Let's hear some good stories...like let me guess...the part worked? And you admit you have heard horror stories. Well could you give me some horror stories about Specialty Z products? How about some about JWT, or Stillen. I would be more than happy to hear 1, let alone a number of them.
I guess the only positive thing you said to him was "go with whatever you feel." and "you seemed pretty quick to change your mind with just a couple of comments from strangers."
Wow good advice. Your opinion is so worth it. You talk like you are king and you know everything but you don't provide anything to support what you say other than insults.
You can't come on here and insult people and give garbage opinions and expect people to just thank you for your genius. What did you think people were going to say after that first post?

whoa, whoa, whoa, Kevin, relax.

i think tony's cool, so i'm biased, but joe's not a jerk or anything...in fact, he's pretty sensible (even though i disagree that ams parts are quality).

but whoa, let's calm down.

I'm calm...I'm just saying...All I know about Joe is what he has posted in this thread and like I said above it didn't seem very positive. Maybe I am reading it wrong or missing something but he came off very strong in a bad way. Maybe he does know his stuff but he hasn't given me any reason to believe that.
He just comes off like one of the people I deal with almost every day that simply says "yea well your wrong because your wrong and I'm right" or something to that extent.
It's like the classic God/Christianity/Bible argument. This one guy said that only Christianity should be taught in schools because it's the correct religion. I asked him how he knows its the correct religion and he told me because the Bible says so. I asked him how he knows the Bible is right and he said because it says so. No dude that's not an argument. That's like saying I'm right because I say so. Try that one in court.

I am calm...that's just the feeling I get from Joe. He just seems to have nothing nice to say or anything to back up anything he says. I mean come on he was bashing someone's grammar...

I was wondering how the hell a built thread can get to 5 pages with almost 200 replies and 1k+ views when the OP hadn't even started the work yet lol. Erik, is it your new method of forum trafficking ? haha

FFR

thanks for changing the thread title but it was a horrible one at that



wanna fight

joe645733 wrote:i would say they didn't fit his due to a defect. i bet someone on this earth is driving with one

Yeah, the defect is the part is made incorrectly... c'mon man, use that brain, you can do it!

6 pages w00t!

vikesfankevin1986 wrote: You come off as a d!ck with nothing positive to say. People were trying to save him from buying garbage. You sir, come on here and called people stubborn internet snobs.
"i've heard some horror stories about AMS and i've heard good stories."
Let's hear some good stories...like let me guess...the part worked? And you admit you have heard horror stories. Well could you give me some horror stories about Specialty Z products? How about some about JWT, or Stillen. I would be more than happy to hear 1, let alone a number of them.
I guess the only positive thing you said to him was "go with whatever you feel." and "you seemed pretty quick to change your mind with just a couple of comments from strangers."
Wow good advice. Your opinion is so worth it. You talk like you are king and you know everything but you don't provide anything to support what you say other than insults.
You can't come on here and insult people and give garbage opinions and expect people to just thank you for your genius. What did you think people were going to say after that first post?

i can care less whether my opinion is help or not. it's called an opinion for a reason, everyone has them. do you seriously think i come on here just for doing a good deed? lol no. if there's a thread that catches my eye that i wanna post in, i'm going to post. that's something you're going to have to deal with. if i can help the person? then sure, i'll post to try and help him out. alls i was trying to say was, all AMS products aren't junk. how can i say that? because i have their short shifter and you guys i guess can't handle that lol. that's all. but you have people on here like you and MrT. who nearly ball their eyes out behind the computer over things, relax, it's a forum.
you're making yourself look real dumb by just pouting over the stupidest things ever. it's the internet!

BigTDogg (MA) wrote:

joe645733 wrote:i would say they didn't fit his due to a defect. i bet someone on this earth is driving with one

Yeah, the defect is the part is made incorrectly... c'mon man, use that brain, you can do it!

6 pages w00t!

you're saying all AMS parts i junk. i highly doubt that.
you shouldn't have a computer dude. i can tell this thread is stressing you out too much.
take a deep breathe.

joe645733 wrote:you're saying all AMS parts i junk. i highly doubt that.
you shouldn't have a computer dude. i can tell this thread is stressing you out too much.
take a deep breathe.

*breath.

I'm not stressed.

AMS is junk as a company. Many of their parts are also garbage. It's really not a difficult concept to grasp.

joe645733 wrote:

vikesfankevin1986 wrote: You come off as a d!ck with nothing positive to say. People were trying to save him from buying garbage. You sir, come on here and called people stubborn internet snobs.
"i've heard some horror stories about AMS and i've heard good stories."
Let's hear some good stories...like let me guess...the part worked? And you admit you have heard horror stories. Well could you give me some horror stories about Specialty Z products? How about some about JWT, or Stillen. I would be more than happy to hear 1, let alone a number of them.
I guess the only positive thing you said to him was "go with whatever you feel." and "you seemed pretty quick to change your mind with just a couple of comments from strangers."
Wow good advice. Your opinion is so worth it. You talk like you are king and you know everything but you don't provide anything to support what you say other than insults.
You can't come on here and insult people and give garbage opinions and expect people to just thank you for your genius. What did you think people were going to say after that first post?

i can care less whether my opinion is help or not. it's called an opinion for a reason, everyone has them. do you seriously think i come on here just for doing a good deed? lol no. if there's a thread that catches my eye that i wanna post in, i'm going to post. that's something you're going to have to deal with. if i can help the person? then sure, i'll post to try and help him out. alls i was trying to say was, all AMS products aren't junk. how can i say that? because i have their short shifter and you guys i guess can't handle that lol. that's all. but you have people on here like you and MrT. who nearly ball their eyes out behind the computer over things, relax, it's a forum.
you're making yourself look real dumb by just pouting over the stupidest things ever. it's the internet!

Well at least you are honest in saying that you are not here to do a good deed and your opinions are worthless. At least I know who to ignore advice from. I'm not crying or pouting. You keep mentioning this is a forum and this is the internet and that we are making ourselves look dumb but are you not doing the exact same thing? You are sitting on here arguing with the rest of us in a forum on the internet. Now go back to sleep in mommy and daddy's basement.

BigTDogg (MA) wrote:

joe645733 wrote:you're saying all AMS parts i junk. i highly doubt that.
you shouldn't have a computer dude. i can tell this thread is stressing you out too much.
take a deep breathe.

*breath.

I'm not stressed.

AMS is junk as a company. Many of their parts are also garbage. It's really not a difficult concept to grasp.

I have come to realize idiots can't grasp concepts...

haha. not joking about the 4 + pages of argument.
you know, I got ahold of some AMS SMIC' before I knew the companies reputation. they seemed to be made okay, no defects, and they added power. I never did a before/after dyno to see the power increase, but I could feel it. from a "bang for your buck" standpoint, they were decent, I guess.

I didn't know the reputation of the company before I bought them, however. and in hind-sight, I really wish they weren't on my car. not necessarily because of the quality, but simply because of the reputation of the company.

when dealing with ANY parts you basically "get what you pay for". everyone should know and understand the can of worms you're opening by buying bargain parts off of ebay, but that never really was the point of why so many people hate AMS.. the reason is because they screwed over a s*** of people that are actually developing new parts for the Z32 community, and they are the #1 reason we don't see new parts coming out for our cars.

most of this s*** has already been said, so I'll try to keep my opinion short:
I plan on owning a z32 for the rest of my life. and 15 years from now, I would like to think there will still be enough parts out there to keep the Z somewhat competitive with the rest of the cars on the road, I would like to see new parts being made/tweaked, and I would like those parts to be developed and manufactured by enthusiasts.. but nobody is going to make new parts for a car if they just get their s*** stolen. I'll never touch AMS parts again. ever. and, though I can understand (but not recommend) buying cheap parts just to get a good deal, I don't see how any true 300zx enthusiast could buy from them with a clear conscience. I wish their intercoolers weren't on my car =/

^^ Just a heads up, you have AVS, not AMS intercoolers. Apparently it's CZP's cheap chinese copy of Z1's intercoolers. Not saying it's any better but just thought I'd clarify that lol

If you buy them when you don't know that is one thing but if you buy them after everyone makes the facts clearly obvious that is another. I'm sure the stuff does increase power but not as much as it could and I question the longevity of it. I am just glad I didn't buy everything at once without asking people. By spending the extra time and money I know my stuff will be top notch.

legion wrote:^^ Just a heads up, you have AVS, not AMS intercoolers. Apparently it's CZP's cheap chinese copy of Z1's intercoolers. Not saying it's any better but just thought I'd clarify that lol

haha, right. forgot about that. but iirc AVS = AMS. I might be mistaken on that, though :P aside from the douchebaggery of the company they were marketed by, I was pleased with the SMICs for the price I payed. I'll end up replacing them before I hit 450ish hp, simply because I would prefer to give the business to the people that deserve it, and because I'm not 100% sure what these intercoolers are capable of.. but it made a noticeable difference in HP @ 15 psi.

and just an FYI: there were defects with my *ams* smics. the metal inlets on the intake side of one of the intercoolers was thicker than the other, making it a pain in the a** getting the hose on. also, the threads for one of the mounting bolts were messed up, so I had to re-tap it.. just pisses me off that they didn't even bother to do a quality check before they shipped them. yet another reason I will never buy from them again.