Engine won’t start on 1st or 2nd crank after warming up

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98_Q45
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I’ve googled around on this info, but pretty close to just taking it to the dealer this time for a diagnostic...same thing with the idle issue during cold weather.

But been having this problem lately. Will crank for 2-3 seconds before it finally starts, and it’ll rumble like it’s about to stall, and then rev up. Used to start up perfectly everytime. Already killed my last starter. Even after starter replaced, it would still happen. So I poured a can of the oil/gas compatible gum out in the gas tank and engine. Instantly cured. For about a month (appx 2,500 miles with my driving). So did it again, cured it again for another month. Started doing it again last week. This time gumout didn’t work. At one point, starter would not turn over at all. Thought my new starter was dead. So changed oil (seems to occur more when oil is past 5,000), both coolant temp switches (based on research=dead coolant switch=Ecu giving false timing to fuel ratio). Still doing it. But atleast the starter is working, but the engine isn’t turning over right away, and feel it could certainly strain my starter.

Cold starts is “usually” cranks up right away, but sometimes does the same as if it were warmed up. Completely stumped. Thought I wasn’t going to have anymore issues.


Ludeaem
Posts: 217
Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2008 8:46 am
Car: 2000 Infiniti Q45 AE
Location: Greenville, SC

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"thought i wasn't going to have anymore issues" hah! You? ;)

My 2000 does fine on cold starts and takes several seconds of cranking when warm. My remedy when warm is to turn key to accessory and wait 3 seconds. Starts fine everytime when i do that. Thinking its an issue with the fuel pump but the car is not my primary mode of transportation so I just live with it.

98_Q45
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Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2017 12:12 am

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Ludeaem wrote:
Tue Apr 14, 2020 2:13 pm
"thought i wasn't going to have anymore issues" hah! You? ;)

My 2000 does fine on cold starts and takes several seconds of cranking when warm. My remedy when warm is to turn key to accessory and wait 3 seconds. Starts fine everytime when i do that. Thinking its an issue with the fuel pump but the car is not my primary mode of transportation so I just live with it.
LOL...well for the most part it’s been pretty trouble free on my last 1,200 mile trip. Nothing too quirky or out of the ordinary. My goal is to get to where it’s not at the mechanic every other month. Basic stuff here and there I can deal with. Just did a transmission drain the other day too.

When I pulled the temp sensor in the back, it pretty much came apart with the connector. Only other codes I have are emissions type things like oxygen sensor and purge flow monitor. But those were going on before the starting up issue began.

I seemed like I was able to fix it with the sea foam in a can stuff, but then it came back. I know my Maxima would require regular doses of that, along with Throttle bottle cleanings every 10,000-15,000 or so....

98_Q45
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Update:

I have partially figured out the cure and possible reasoning for this. After researching different things, and changing everything from spark plugs to fuel filter with no results, I almost sent the fuel pressure regulator route. But then I did some research that pointed to dirty intake valves on GDI engines (not sure if that’s the type of fuel injection we use).

Anyhow, I poured 6 ounces of seafoam into the engine oil before and after changing the oil last week. Then drove 200+ miles. Markable improvement. I was wondering why when I previously did it...it worked and lasted for months until the oil started getting more dirty again.

Adding to fuel tank doesn’t help much because apparently on GDI engines, the fuel never reaches the intake valves. So yeah, problem mostly solved, starts instantly on cold starts, but still doesn’t start up as smoothly everytime on warm starts. But for the most part, 1, sometimes 2 cranks is all it has taken since. May need to run it thru a little longer, maybe add another ounce

Ludeaem
Posts: 217
Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2008 8:46 am
Car: 2000 Infiniti Q45 AE
Location: Greenville, SC

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GDI stands for gasoline direct injection. We have port injection which cleans the valves as fuel dumps in the runners. I cleaned my lower and upper intake manifold of carbon (was not bad at 117k) when I did the knock sensors and that didn't help my hard, warm start. I don't see how seafoam in the oil would help this. To me its a fuel issue. Pump, pressure regulator as you mentioned or something of the like. Luckily for me, this is a 2nd car so I just deal with the turn to ACC and wait 2 seconds method once warm.

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Q451990
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A leaky lower o ring can cause hard warm starts. Fuel leaks down enough to slightly flood the engine, but that fuel dissipates if it sits long enough. Do you see a few puffs of smoke when it starts hard?

98_Q45
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Q451990 wrote:
Thu May 21, 2020 8:11 am
A leaky lower o ring can cause hard warm starts. Fuel leaks down enough to slightly flood the engine, but that fuel dissipates if it sits long enough. Do you see a few puffs of smoke when it starts hard?
Excuse the delay...took a break and just rented a car for a week lol.

But yes, I noticed when the engine is cranking for a long time, i see white smoke flying by the window. However, as of recently, it seems to be back to starting up everytime perfectly. Hot or cold. Idk if the brake booster blowing too much air in the engine is helping it or what. Or if these warmer temperatures seem to make a difference.

I just feel like everything is related to the brake booster. Soon as I get that fixed, hopefully some other issues should be solved as well.

98_Q45
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Problem solved: PCV valve...

Ludeaem
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Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2008 8:46 am
Car: 2000 Infiniti Q45 AE
Location: Greenville, SC

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What? Really? I took mine out and cleaned it as the ball wasn't very free flowing but didn't fix the issue. Update us in a week or two if you don't mind to see if the issue hasn't returned.

98_Q45
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Cleaning won't work. Must replace. As an experiment: I only replaced 1 PCV valve last week. The easy one on the passenger side. However I cleaned both. It worked for a few days, then the hard start slowly gradually started coming back. I quickly ordered 2nd valve, the one by the air intake. It immediately started easily again and has been for the past couple days.

And the rattle on the air intake valve was actually much slower than a new one...even though it seemed okay last week. The passenger side one was completely gummed. You don't get much dirt out, i just think the valve itself wears out. Kinda like a thermostat that doesn't open fully and doesn't overheat driving around town, but does on steep mountain grades.

Ludeaem
Posts: 217
Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2008 8:46 am
Car: 2000 Infiniti Q45 AE
Location: Greenville, SC

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Just bought 2 new ones and will test it out. We shall see. Thanks for the input

Ludeaem
Posts: 217
Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2008 8:46 am
Car: 2000 Infiniti Q45 AE
Location: Greenville, SC

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ok i replaced both this morning and did the 'wait 30 minutes after its warm to restart' procedure. No go, still takes too long to turn over.

98_Q45
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Ludeaem wrote:
Sat Jul 25, 2020 4:48 pm
ok i replaced both this morning and did the 'wait 30 minutes after its warm to restart' procedure. No go, still takes too long to turn over.
Hi, I've been away for a couple weeks. Any luck? I know for me it took a day and some driving highway for the system to catch onto it. What year miles etc do you have?

Also with me I did a plethora of things before finally getting to this. Spark plugs and boots that had only been in for 20,000 miles. Changing out coolant temperature sensors and such. But I don't think you'd need go that far...but they aren't all that hard to get to. The one by the injectors was a little bit of a hassle, but again...even after doing that it didn't help (and I really wasn't having cooling issues anyway).

Other thing to try is fuel filter (may be clogged), throttle body cleaning (i actually flooded the intake chamber out of desperation and got a nice plume of smoke). I didn't do the whole process as described on the new seafoam cans, I just spray for a few seconds a little in the can into the throttle body and intake on hot engine, and let sit while I reconnect everything and start up.

One last ditch effort may be to add the liquid seafoam/gumout to your oil and change the oil and filter again. I cited the issue seems to prevail with dirty or inferior oil: and couple weeks ago it seemed to be trying to give me issues again. I dumped the oil after 1,000 miles (had put seafoam and "stop smoke" additive in there anyway) and added Castrol Magnatec or whatever their full synthetic high mileage is. And WOW, it made a huge difference. Exhaust isn't smoking as much, engine starting as soon as I turn the key on hot or cold.

So idk...I know I couldn't find a mechanic to give me any straight answer, so it just came down to process of elimination as to what will work. I know my 97 Maxima had the problem for years, and I changed it's pcv valve before too. Eventually I just lived with it. But it always seemed like a regular every 3,500 mile throttle body cleaning and seafoam in tank with oil change made it start better. It doesn't start as quick as the Q, but it generally doesn't fail like it used to.

I also won't be pushing any extended OCIs either. I was doing 7,500...but seems like I run into issues going past 3,500 on the 90s cars. Even if it's mostly highway.

Ludeaem
Posts: 217
Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2008 8:46 am
Car: 2000 Infiniti Q45 AE
Location: Greenville, SC

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I've done a lot of maintenence with this car since buying it a year ago.

Fuel filter
Fuel system cleaner
knock sensors
upper and lower intake manifold cleaned. TB cleaned
new PCV valves
High mileage synthetic 5w-30 Every 5-6k. I am going to do an oil analysis when changing my oil next time but the engine runs really well.

I still think this has to do fuel returning to the tank. Just a hunch but its not a big deal, I just prime the pump for 2 seconds and fires up fine each time. When its cold it cranks up right away.

98_Q45
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Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2017 12:12 am

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Ludeaem wrote:
Wed Aug 05, 2020 2:47 pm
I've done a lot of maintenence with this car since buying it a year ago.

Fuel filter
Fuel system cleaner
knock sensors
upper and lower intake manifold cleaned. TB cleaned
new PCV valves
High mileage synthetic 5w-30 Every 5-6k. I am going to do an oil analysis when changing my oil next time but the engine runs really well.

I still think this has to do fuel returning to the tank. Just a hunch but its not a big deal, I just prime the pump for 2 seconds and fires up fine each time. When its cold it cranks up right away.
In that case, you might want to consider the fuel pressure regulator. I almost went that route, but I didn't wanna remove the manifold to get to it. Plus I was getting a too lean code...which would make sense why the pcv valves made a difference. I also didn't go that route because it seemed like it would work fine right after oil change, so I started eliminating fuel delivery as the issue.

When you say prime the pump, do you mean turn the key to on for a couple seconds before starting? In my case that didn't work...including all the other on/off tricks (didn't work with airbag light either last year...was a dealer fix). If that is the case, maybe stick with that. Intake manifold gasket only sold thru infiniti.

Ludeaem
Posts: 217
Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2008 8:46 am
Car: 2000 Infiniti Q45 AE
Location: Greenville, SC

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Correct, when i say prime i am turning the key to 'accessory' and waiting 2 seconds before cranking. No issues when I do that.

98_Q45
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Ludeaem wrote:
Sat Aug 08, 2020 10:51 am
Correct, when i say prime i am turning the key to 'accessory' and waiting 2 seconds before cranking. No issues when I do that.
Ah... probably something different than PCV valve then. I read that is more of a fuel pump or regulator issue.

In my case, I’ve been fine starting up but still have to keep watch on the oil intervals. Seems like it’s trying to give me issues again... lately it has been turning at the instant I turn the key, as the oil gets dirtier it seems like it’s hesitating a bit.

I can’t expect the issue to vanish completely considering I’ve still got a blow by issue and white/blue smoking exhaust. And running the A/C compressor it really smokes, add in 90 degree temps everyday and driving thru a mix of dusty cornfields, and urban sprawl traffic, my engine seems to want an oil change every 2,500 miles in order to maintain consistent startup.


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