DIY: Subwoofer and Amplifier Installation

Forum for Infiniti M37, M56 M35h Hybrid and Q70 owners.
MY2J
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can someone please confirm how much feet in power and ground cable is needed for our vehicles. Thank you!


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Debonair
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MY2J wrote:can someone please confirm how much feet in power and ground cable is needed for our vehicles. Thank you!
I used about 18-ft of power cable and about 2-ft of ground cable. Both of these will vary depending on where and how you mount your amplifier. I would get about at least 20-ft feet to be safe.

Shtoops
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I have a HAT Clarus 12" sub installed on a Zapco DC500.1 .. I ran an RTA against the sub to see what the BOSE amp was doing to the sub signal... I found that BOSE was placing a High Pass Filter on the Sub signal to prevent the 10" OEM IB Sub from bottoming out.. They crossed the sub signal 40hz@12db .. to compensate for the crossover, I used parametric EQ from my Zapco Z8 DSP. +12db @ 20hz with Q=1.7 .. this nulls the crossover and restores the sub bass signal. It's not ideal, but it worked for me. I'm now slamming hard on the low lows.

I'm wanting to reclaim my trunk space .. so I'm thinking about installing an Acoustic Elegance SPB15 15" subwoofer mounted infinite baffle against the trunk pass through. Has anybody done an IB sub install on the M37?

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Debonair
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Shtoops wrote:I have a HAT Clarus 12" sub installed on a Zapco DC500.1 .. I ran an RTA against the sub to see what the BOSE amp was doing to the sub signal... I found that BOSE was placing a High Pass Filter on the Sub signal to prevent the 10" OEM IB Sub from bottoming out.. They crossed the sub signal 40hz@12db .. to compensate for the crossover, I used parametric EQ from my Zapco Z8 DSP. +12db @ 20hz with Q=1.7 .. this nulls the crossover and restores the sub bass signal. It's not ideal, but it worked for me. I'm now slamming hard on the low lows.

I'm wanting to reclaim my trunk space .. so I'm thinking about installing an Acoustic Elegance SPB15 15" subwoofer mounted infinite baffle against the trunk pass through. Has anybody done an IB sub install on the M37?
Good info and solution. Thanks for sharing! What volume and style box do you have for that 12? Pics? :biggrin:

Also welcome to Nico!

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reggiebrown40
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Shtoops wrote:I have a HAT Clarus 12" sub installed on a Zapco DC500.1 .. I ran an RTA against the sub to see what the BOSE amp was doing to the sub signal... I found that BOSE was placing a High Pass Filter on the Sub signal to prevent the 10" OEM IB Sub from bottoming out.. They crossed the sub signal 40hz@12db .. to compensate for the crossover, I used parametric EQ from my Zapco Z8 DSP. +12db @ 20hz with Q=1.7 .. this nulls the crossover and restores the sub bass signal. It's not ideal, but it worked for me. I'm now slamming hard on the low lows.

I'm wanting to reclaim my trunk space .. so I'm thinking about installing an Acoustic Elegance SPB15 15" subwoofer mounted infinite baffle against the trunk pass through. Has anybody done an IB sub install on the M37?
You didn't happen to get a print out of what the Bose amp was doing did you? I seem to be having a different issue than you in that everything in the 40 - 100hz range is missing and everything 40hz and below is boosted.

mrnix
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Shtoops wrote:I have a HAT Clarus 12" sub installed on a Zapco DC500.1 .. I ran an RTA against the sub to see what the BOSE amp was doing to the sub signal... I found that BOSE was placing a High Pass Filter on the Sub signal to prevent the 10" OEM IB Sub from bottoming out.. They crossed the sub signal 40hz@12db .. to compensate for the crossover, I used parametric EQ from my Zapco Z8 DSP. +12db @ 20hz with Q=1.7 .. this nulls the crossover and restores the sub bass signal. It's not ideal, but it worked for me. I'm now slamming hard on the low lows.

I'm wanting to reclaim my trunk space .. so I'm thinking about installing an Acoustic Elegance SPB15 15" subwoofer mounted infinite baffle against the trunk pass through. Has anybody done an IB sub install on the M37?
Where did you get the audio signal to use, so that you can avoid the high pass crossover?

Shtoops
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The RTA was done using pink noise against the output of the speaker .. I haven't had the time to wire up the signal to a direct feed of the subwoofer output to see a true measure of what is going on. I noticed that a roll off was happening where I knew my system should be hitting hard .. The RTA showed me that the sub was rolling off starting @ 40hz .. My assumption based on what the RTA was telling me was 40hz@12db.

For audio signal I tapped the subwoofer output and the front midbass output .. I then summed the signal with my DSP.


I do have a remote turn on issue with my system though. In need of some help! I'm using a PAC LOC w/ signal sensing remote turn on .. when I switch from ACC to ON, I get a loud static pop sound .. i assume this is due to the signal sensing remote turn on from the LOC. Where can I locate a true OEM 12v accessory signal for remote turn on? .. Relying on the PAC LOC is giving me headaches!

RE: The Sub box .. its 1.25 cu ft sealed. It gets the job done! Though, I'm planning on adding a 3rd amp for my HAT L3SE and HAT L1v2s and moving to an infinite baffle situation to reclaim trunk space.

As of right now I have a Zapco Z8 DSP, Zapco DC750.2, Zapco DC500.1 + HAT L6v2s, HAT Clarus C12Sw.

Shtoops
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Reggie.. The 50hz-100hz could be due to phase/xo slope/TA settings.

Ive tried a few things to make the midbass centered and the sub sound like its coming from the front.

After flipping phase and trying different XO slopes i found the setting that clicked in

Sub xo: 70hz @ 36db (polarity reversed)
Midbass xo: 70hz @ 36db

~3ms delay on the sub
~1.5ms delay on the right midbass

-5db cut @ 50hz on the sub
+12db boost @ 20hz/Q:1.7 on the sub

Left midbass attenuated -2db


My suggestion for you would be to play a 80hz tone with your sub off. Flip polarity on one midbass.. Then the other.. Find the setting that makes the tone sound full.. Then integrate the sub, if it sounds like it canceled the tone, flip phase or polarity in the sub. If you have TA, use it.

If you dont have midbasses on an amp and only have a sub.. Try playing with the sub's polarity..

I also fade 1 click away from front for the upfront bass.. I dont like having rears playing.

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Debonair
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Shtoops wrote:I do have a remote turn on issue with my system though. In need of some help! I'm using a PAC LOC w/ signal sensing remote turn on .. when I switch from ACC to ON, I get a loud static pop sound .. i assume this is due to the signal sensing remote turn on from the LOC. Where can I locate a true OEM 12v accessory signal for remote turn on? .. Relying on the PAC LOC is giving me headaches!

RE: The Sub box .. its 1.25 cu ft sealed. It gets the job done! Though, I'm planning on adding a 3rd amp for my HAT L3SE and HAT L1v2s and moving to an infinite baffle situation to reclaim trunk space.

As of right now I have a Zapco Z8 DSP, Zapco DC750.2, Zapco DC500.1 + HAT L6v2s, HAT Clarus C12Sw.
Weird. I am using an original PAC Trunk-LOC speaker trigger for my amp turn on and not getting any pop. The Zapco's may not have a soft power on function to avoid the pop. You can install a power on delay module like THIS or THIS.

Or for a different 12V trigger you can run a wire from the fuse box. I did this while running the main power cable for my amp but am not using it. You can go that route or try tapping the OEM amp's remote turn on wire, #15 (green). Given the price of this OEM amp and how picky this cars electrical can be I personally would skip this route and run a dedicated wire or a power-on-pop module like mentioned above.

Image

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reggiebrown40
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Thanks for the info Shtoops. I think you may be right regarding the speaker being out of phase. I'll mess around with it this weekend. For turn on lead I would tap into the green wire as suggested by Debonaire, but I would use an in-line fuse and then feed it to a relay and then to a mini distribution block. This way if there is ever a problem it would pop the fuse and not anything in the amp or anywhere else in the car. With a distribution block in place you could power anything else you wanted, fans, lights, etc and they would turn on and off with the car.

R

mrnix
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Shtoops wrote:

For audio signal I tapped the subwoofer output and the front midbass output .. I then summed the signal with my DSP.
I won't be using a DSP, so now I'm worried about this possible sub-40hz cutoff when I put in my amp and sub.

Shtoops
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Thanks all! Is there a way to tap the signal prior to the Bose amp? This route would be ideal for SQ .. But cant find any info for the M37.

Shtoops
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mrnix wrote:
I won't be using a DSP, so now I'm worried about this possible sub-40hz cutoff when I put in my amp and sub.
Mrnix, go ahead and put it in. Not much music content is below 30hz.. At that point, you are only down 6db. A little EQ or bass boost at 30hz will do the trick. Even if you dont have boost or EQ., it will still sound great. I had to cut 50hz significantly due to cabin gain.

mrnix
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Shtoops wrote:
mrnix wrote:
I won't be using a DSP, so now I'm worried about this possible sub-40hz cutoff when I put in my amp and sub.
Mrnix, go ahead and put it in. Not much music content is below 30hz.. At that point, you are only down 6db. A little EQ or bass boost at 30hz will do the trick. Even if you dont have boost or EQ., it will still sound great. I had to cut 50hz significantly due to cabin gain.
thanks. I have the back side of the enclosure done. Now I need to actually order the sub and make the front and work the port into there. My pace is awfully slow, though. I hope to have it in by labor day.

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reggiebrown40
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Shtoops wrote:The RTA was done using pink noise against the output of the speaker .. I haven't had the time to wire up the signal to a direct feed of the subwoofer output to see a true measure of what is going on. I noticed that a roll off was happening where I knew my system should be hitting hard .. The RTA showed me that the sub was rolling off starting @ 40hz .. My assumption based on what the RTA was telling me was 40hz@12db.

For audio signal I tapped the subwoofer output and the front midbass output .. I then summed the signal with my DSP.
I totally missed this post. What you did is what I suspected was the issue -- Bose crosses over the door speaker somewhere between 40hz and 50hz and the subwoofer only plays 50hz and below. I can't confirm until I hook everything up to an RTA but that's what I think is happening. Summing the front speakers with the subwoofer output is probably what's needed to correct the bass signal. After you sum the signal you can crossover at whatever point you need, 100hz or 80hz or whatever. But that would restore the bass signal.

I will start looking into getting a dsp in the future, and another 5 or 6 channel amp. It sucks but I don't think you can get an accurate sounding system without summing signals.

Shtoops
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Reggie.. Not only did I have to sum the midbass and sub signals .. i also had to add +12db @ 20hz for the whole 20-40hz octave. The subwoofer is Highpassed @ 40hz by 12db it seems. By boosting an octave lower (20hz) by 12db .. I essentially nulled that HPF set on the subwoofer.

I believe the Midbasses up front are crossed/highpassed at around 70-80hz @ 12db

mrnix
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Shtoops wrote:Reggie.. Not only did I have to sum the midbass and sub signals .. i also had to add +12db @ 20hz for the whole 20-40hz octave. The subwoofer is Highpassed @ 40hz by 12db it seems. By boosting an octave lower (20hz) by 12db .. I essentially nulled that HPF set on the subwoofer.

I believe the Midbasses up front are crossed/highpassed at around 70-80hz @ 12db
What did you use to sum the signals? I was planning on using an Audio Control LC2i, which I think you can only use 1 set of L/R speaker level inputs.

Shtoops
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I used my Zapco Z8 DSP .. Front midbass -> LOC -> DSP ch1/2 + Sub out -> LOC -> DSP ch3/4 .... Then sum DSP ch1/2+ch3/4 for all outputs to my amps.

Tomorrow im going to be RTAing the bose output signals to see exactly what its doing to the original source. I plan to EQ the bose signal via DSP + REW to get a flat response fed into my amps.

mrnix
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Shtoops, thanks for the info. I may end up getting the AudioControl L6 or L7 instead of the L2, just to have the summing ability and make sure I have what I need. I don't need the ability now to add amps for front speakers, but it will be nice to have the capability if I decide to in the future. Where did you grab the inputs for front midbass and sub? At the factory amp inputs, or outputs?

Shtoops
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I did some testing against the midbass output of the BOSE amplifier. I intercepted the BOSE midbass signal prior to it reaching my amp .. Unprocessed from the Zapco DSP, no EQ no XO no Processing... hooked the RCAs to an external sound card on my laptop and ran some pink noise.. recorded the output.

BOSE is leveraging massive amounts of processing on the signal to the midbass speakers. It looks like they are using a HPF at 80hz@12db .. An EQ Boost at 100hz-150hz .. An EQ Cut at 300hz .. and a LPF at 700hz@12db

With that said .. I attempted to correct the signal and realized that BOSE is processing the signal for good reason. The M37 cabin requires this EQ curve to get a flat response through the midbass frequencies.


Image

I also did some preliminary testing against the subwoofer output .. but I don't want to upload the picture just yet because apparently I need to do some level setting on my LOCs for an accurate depiction. What I can say is what I've confirmed. BOSE is using a LPF at 40hz@12db for the subwoofer... I was correct in recommending a Parametric EQ boost of 12db @ 20hz with a 1 octave Q.

mrnix
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Debonair wrote:
MY2J wrote:can someone please confirm how much feet in power and ground cable is needed for our vehicles. Thank you!
I used about 18-ft of power cable and about 2-ft of ground cable. Both of these will vary depending on where and how you mount your amplifier. I would get about at least 20-ft feet to be safe.
do you guys think there's enough room to run 4 gauge wire through the same path down the passenger side? My amp only requires 8 gauge, but I don't have enough length of 8 around, but do have about 20 feet of 4 I can run to a distribution block, then a small piece of 8 to the amp.

DocJim
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Great write up and excellent pictures.

schmantezuba
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Great write up and pics. Thanks. I know this is an older thread, but I have a couple of questions because I just got a used 2011 M37x with the Bose 10 speaker set up. I'm wondering if you think the following will work?

This is pretty much what I did with my old vehicle (2007 Honda Odyssey Touring). Except rather than pull from the speaker wire on its way out of the amp to the woofer, I took the pre-amp signal to RCA and then straight to the amp with no line converter necessary. Then I cut into the speaker wire post amp on the way to the speakers. I did end up adding a line converter, audio control lc7i, later though to make sure the levels were optimal pre-amp.

I intend to do the same thing on this car. I'm hoping to splice the wire on the way in to the amp, so I can use a component set in the front door with an aftermarket amp and let the Bose amp continue to power the mid speaker (probably unnecessary). But, I'll cut the wire on the way out of the amp to the locations I intend to use and be able to upgrade the speakers in the factory locations and use the factory speaker wire with an after market amp. So, I'm thinking a 4 channel amp with components up front and 6.5 in the rear doors and a sub setup like yours in the trunk. I'm hesitant though because this car is a bit nicer than the mini-van and I don't want to mess it up. I'll just have to take my time. If my install is 85% as clean as the one you posted, I'll be well pleased. The trunk space will become limited though, 2 amps, a large sub, and a fairly large line converter.

If it worked on my old Odyssey, it should work here.

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Debonair
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schmantezuba wrote:
Sat Jan 27, 2018 10:57 pm
Great write up and pics. Thanks. I know this is an older thread, but I have a couple of questions because I just got a used 2011 M37x with the Bose 10 speaker set up. I'm wondering if you think the following will work?

This is pretty much what I did with my old vehicle (2007 Honda Odyssey Touring). Except rather than pull from the speaker wire on its way out of the amp to the woofer, I took the pre-amp signal to RCA and then straight to the amp with no line converter necessary. Then I cut into the speaker wire post amp on the way to the speakers. I did end up adding a line converter, audio control lc7i, later though to make sure the levels were optimal pre-amp.

I intend to do the same thing on this car. I'm hoping to splice the wire on the way in to the amp, so I can use a component set in the front door with an aftermarket amp and let the Bose amp continue to power the mid speaker (probably unnecessary). But, I'll cut the wire on the way out of the amp to the locations I intend to use and be able to upgrade the speakers in the factory locations and use the factory speaker wire with an after market amp. So, I'm thinking a 4 channel amp with components up front and 6.5 in the rear doors and a sub setup like yours in the trunk. I'm hesitant though because this car is a bit nicer than the mini-van and I don't want to mess it up. I'll just have to take my time. If my install is 85% as clean as the one you posted, I'll be well pleased. The trunk space will become limited though, 2 amps, a large sub, and a fairly large line converter.

If it worked on my old Odyssey, it should work here.
Thanks. I guess it is an older thread although it doesn't feel that way. Time fly's.

If your Amp has high-level imput built in, adding a LOC not required.

I am pretty sure this car may feed a digital signal to the amp which is then converted to standard audio output, which would make tapping into the wires pre-amp not an option.

Adding a signal summing processor like the LC7i is a good idea and one I will be getting to eventually, maybe :chuckle: . The Bose amp definitely does some undesirable things to the audio output.

As far as this car being too nice to modify, its not. Just a big Nissan. You will probably feel more comfortable with it once you dive in and see its not much different then other cars. Also, the trunk is huge and modern Amps are small. The box size is likely the only threat to trunk space. Go with a small sealed box and you should be ok.

schmantezuba
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Debonair, thanks for responding. I'm almost finished gathering my materials. I misspoke. I used an Audiocontrol EQL on my Odyssey. Ill probably either use an EQS on this or a signal processor.
Ill post my findings as to whether tapping in pre-amp works. On the Odyssey, the pre-amp wires were regular low-level signal. I'm hoping this is the case here, if not I'll just have to go post amp.

The pics in this post are great. Definitely give me some confidence running the power wire. The rest aren't long runs, everything is in the trunk. So, that should be easy. I've only had the car a little over a week now. I'm enjoying it. Sounds pretty good as is. If I didn't already have speakers, a sub and 2 amps, I might have decided to just do the sub. Between a 2 amps, eq/dsp, a capacitor and a 12" sealed sub, I'm losing a lot of trunk space.

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hokiruu
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You are the MAN for this! Thank you!

On side note, does anyone know whether the forward trunk area on the M37 is similar enough or the same as a G37 to use this in it?

https://www.zenclosures.com/Infiniti-G3 ... 9q5014.htm

From pictures, they look identical. Waiting to hear from Zenclosures on it. I would love to fabricate a fancy custom enclosure but for the time and money in tools alone to build one how I would want it, this one could be worth it.

Darthswan
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It has been awhile since I’ve been here. I’m noticing a problem that i’ve never had before. The sub seems to go out at high levels, during both acceleration and braking. Anyone else having this problem, or experience this? Thanks in advance.

K

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reggiebrown40
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Darthswan wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 5:52 pm
It has been awhile since I’ve been here. I’m noticing a problem that i’ve never had before. The sub seems to go out at high levels, during both acceleration and braking. Anyone else having this problem, or experience this? Thanks in advance.

K
If you have autopilot on it will raise and lower the volume automatically as you speed up and slow down. Also, are you talking about an aftermarket sub? If you installed your own sub you have to cut the green wire that Debonair mentioned.

coffeyface2000
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I'm in the process of installing my loc converter on my 03 q45 and I'm trying to figure out how to splice into the factory sub according to your diagram when it only has the one + wire and the - wire. My converter requires left +/- and right +/- inputs for signal. Sorry for the stupid question but I just can't figure how you would do that lol.

mrnix
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coffeyface2000 wrote:
Sat Aug 31, 2019 6:11 pm
I'm in the process of installing my loc converter on my 03 q45 and I'm trying to figure out how to splice into the factory sub according to your diagram when it only has the one + wire and the - wire. My converter requires left +/- and right +/- inputs for signal. Sorry for the stupid question but I just can't figure how you would do that lol.
The sub input I believe is 1 channel Mono, so your LOC would just get one side. or I suppose you could splice the two + together and the two - together and get the same input in each side (L/R)


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