Q45 Cold Air Intake - No One Has Developed One Yet?

Post by **halfoffautoparts** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 4:43 am

I have been searching around trying to find a cold air intake with a heat shield for my '90 Q. The only product I can find is the JWT intake, which I believe is an adapter and a cone filter (without shield - breathing hot engine bay air).

With the nice factory cold air delivery duct, I think a cold air system would work excellent on these cars.

Who makes these? Or who has made there own?

Post by **Q45denver** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 5:46 am

I understand that the factory OEM installation is designed and works pretty well and there is little if any gain from adding a K&N or going with a cone type with the potential for damage to the engine.

Post by **HeavyDuty** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 5:46 am

I have one of these, just put it together the other day & I'm going to use it with an inline MAF adapter. The filter's in the box.

http://www.comptechusa.com/com...0.jpg

Post by **halfoffautoparts** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 5:54 am

Q45denver wrote: ...with the potential for damage to the engine.

You have to be joking.

Post by **halfoffautoparts** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 5:57 am

It comes with a cone filter inside? What application is this from? I see they sell Acura and Honda parts - also - what is the price?

Post by **Q45tech** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 6:37 am

Measure the air flow restriction thru oem cold air intake, even after the oem filter...............you will faint that it is so low ~~ < 5.0" of water at 6900 rpms while the MAF is 7.0" and the tube to throttle body is 2.0" and the throttle plate to plenum is 4.0"...............WOT total loss to plenum is 18.0"

18/27.7= 0.6498 psi or x 6.8%= 4.4% density decrease ~~14 psi atmospsheric pressure get fully inside the plenum.

While a well designed cone filter mounted to MAF is only ~~1.5" saving 5 minus 1.5= 3.5" 0r 0.86% is hardly worth the effort.

Everything about the Q45 intake is BIG for the engine size Big throttle body diameter, Big MAF, Big Air Box for a BIG FILTER [measure oem pleat depth and number per inch......or cut one up and stretch it out].

If you use a heat shield on a cone filter, you must have a 3.5" diameter air tube to feed the contraption this tube will restrict the air flow so that the cone drops from 1.5" to around 3" water column so net net you may gain 2"

inches of water column is a fine tune method of measuring air pressure1.0" WC = 1/27.7=0.036 psi. The manometer is referferenced to outside air pressure [29.92 or 14.7 psi at sealevel] so it is self calibrating for differences/changes in earth's barometric pressure.

All that counts is how much outside air pressure makes it to the plenum.

Both the MAF and a manometer are averaging devices because the air flow in from external air pressure takes a sine wave shape with overlaps as the intake cam duration 248 degrees is longer than the time between cylinder starts of ingestion [every 90 degrees] ^^^^^^^. Creates a sound tone of 40Hz at idle - 460 Hz at 6900 rpm.

Post by **911/Q45** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 6:40 am

Q owners never joke about engine damage! Damage might be a little strong, the filter oil can coat the MAF sensor and cause all sorts of odd running problems.(do a search on MAF)

Post by **squeefoo** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 6:55 am

Don't bother. My underhood intake temp was 160 Deg. with one on (outside temp 75), making the throttle feel "squishy" = much less responsive.

Put in a new OEM filter and clean the MAF (and connector) and TB as long as you've got it apart. Probably help more.

Post by **AZhitman** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 9:10 am

Only thing I've noticed that might help a TINY bit is...

I built a "scoop" (rectangular funnel-shape), mounted in the lower bumper in the opening, to a 4" tube, and ran it directly into the bottom of the airbox (sealed well).

Seems to increase throttle response somewhat and has a nice effect over 50 mph.

Post by **halfoffautoparts** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 3:36 pm

I made the cold air intake today, despite the sound advice. I can post some photos of the finished product if anybody is interested.

AZhitman wrote:Only thing I've noticed that might help a TINY bit is...

I built a "scoop" (rectangular funnel-shape), mounted in the lower bumper in the opening, to a 4" tube, and ran it directly into the bottom of the airbox (sealed well).

Seems to increase throttle response somewhat and has a nice effect over 50 mph.

Can you send me some photos of this and where you bought the materials - it would save me a lot of grief.

Post by **AZhitman** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 5:47 pm

Didn't buy anything.

It was all crap laying in my garage.

NOTE: Think 'old shop-vac'.....

Post by **elwesso** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 6:00 pm

I have home made CAI too.. Someone cut the air horn so that I get air rammed in right after the grill...

Ive got an extra airbox, and Im thinking about trying to take out some of the baffles and stuff like that... not for anything but a little extra noise!!!

Will post pictures!

Post by **squeefoo** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 8:48 pm

halfoffautoparts wrote:I made the cold air intake today, despite the sound advice.

So I really gotta wonder why did I (or anyone) bother to post anything?Obviously the "advice" wasn't sound enough, why did you even ask then -in the first place?I really have to wonder about people......

Just so you know... " There isn't much you can do to a Q45, that will get you a whole lot (1-2%) beyond what it can do already"

Post by **HeavyDuty** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 3:09 am

Halfoff, it's an icebox intake for a 98-02 Accord V6. It just so happens I had one on the shelf & I was playing around a few months ago when I noticed it would work on my car. I'll post some pics tonight with measurements & construction. It even has a one-way built in water bypass valve to avoid ingestion of water and subsequent hydrolock.

All sides have good points to be considered.

The learned express that after incredibly detailed research, there are no gains to be achieved.

The original post describes the desire for one, but wasn't necessarily inviting a debate.

Wes says he knows there might not be any gains (negligible at best) but wants a different intake tone.

AZ states at speed, he believes his ram air setup does yield tiny gains.

I had a ram air setup on my 91 SE-R, and there were small gains there as well.

So what's the harm if someone wants a different tone, or even a miniscule gain? If they do it poorly & lose power, no one else but the owner is affected. If there are small gains that make the owner perceive it was worth the trouble, how does it impact anyone else?

Post by **pito11213** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 3:35 am

Yo half please post some pics....

It is nice to see something like that to further inspire people to go against the grain.

Post by **halfoffautoparts** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 4:11 am

squeefoo wrote:So I really gotta wonder why did I (or anyone) bother to post anything?Obviously the "advice" wasn't sound enough, why did you even ask then -in the first place?I really have to wonder about people......

Just so you know... " There isn't much you can do to a Q45, that will get you a whole lot (1-2%) beyond what it can do already"

I never asked for your opinion - I asked where I could buy one. So you have to ask yourself, why do you give advice when no one wanted it?

I like the look, I like the sound, in my mind there is no way this is less efficient than the factory set-up. Here's a photo. I had an old cheap air filter that I am using now - the last step is to buy a K&N unit that is a little larger and better quality.

Post by **HeavyDuty** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 4:22 am

Please everyone, let's not start arguing.

Tech has devoted *years* to all systems on Q. That is not to be disregarded.

I've been opinionated in the past where I knew better from experience & it's frustrating when someone states "I think you're wrong, just because." With no data to back it up.

What he & others are stating is; "Be advised there are no gains."

Aside from that, knock yourself out & have fun.

Post by **halfoffautoparts** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 4:42 am

HeavyDuty wrote:

... when someone states "I think you're wrong, just because." With no data to back it up.

I agree, and this was never stated.

If anyone wants one, e-mail me and I can send you the template.
Modified by halfoffautoparts at 7:53 AM 11/10/2004

Post by **pito11213** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 5:15 am

I dont agree with the particular setup that your have half off. I think it would be more beneficial to have the filter element more towards the ground to get true cold air.

Post by **halfoffautoparts** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 5:36 am

Cold air is delivered through the air duct seen below the air filter in the photo.

Post by **maxnix** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 5:46 am

Actually, Nissan did a very good job researching and building one. No one else has done both to the extent that Nissan did.

Well, if one doesn't have the data, then what's the point? You're just urinating into the wind. Squeefoo is just saying this path is well worn and previously trod. Sorry if the "news" pops anyone's fantasy.

If that "tone" of sucking air through a less efficient (dirtier) cone filter is important to you, then go for it. Wooo woooo! My car sounds sound faster because it makes more noise!

Numbers from repeatable controlled experiments tell the truth. Only Nissan and Q45tech have produced any such data, or valid analysis.

Post by **halfoffautoparts** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 6:08 am

I am not of the opinion that the car would be faster. It gives a throatier note to the engine on acceleration, which I like. I also like the look under the hood.

Lets go back the the beginning and the original simple question - Where can I buy one of these? I never doubted the design or the the data or the advice and do appreciate all of the knowledgeable input.

squeefoo on the other hand can jump in the lake for his attitude!

Post by **AZhitman** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 6:26 am

Woo hoo! I wanna go to the lake too!

(j/k)

I like the design, half - As long as you like it, that's all that matters.

Again, I noticed a seat-of-the-pants improvement in acceleration by simply allowing a larger intake area than what was provided by the factory. Didn't expect much, and that's exactly what i got.

The Q's OEM setup, while brilliantly designed, has some built-in compromises for noise reduction and aesthetics that (I believe) hamper performance (1-3 hp in my est).

Again, the bottom line is, no topic is beyond discussion, and we're all here to enjoy. Let's not quibble over something that doesn't negatively impact us one way or another.

p.s. I will be working on expanding my little "ram air" mod to incorporate 2 scoops, 3" tubing with a Y connector into a single 5" tube directl into the stock airbox.

If nothing else, it's satisfying to spend a couple hours playing in my garage with my #1 gal.

Post by **halfoffautoparts** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 6:35 am

I did really enjoy building this - I would much rather do this type of project than regular wrenching. This was fun.

If you can snap some photos of what you built, I would like to see them and build my own.

Post by **Q45tech** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 7:00 am

Just as a check for air [engine bay heat ] LEAK which can quickly overcome all the less restriction GAINS. Do yourself a favor and buy one of Radio Shacks inexpensive digital outdoor thermometers with a 20 foot tiny cord to the sensor........that way you can monitor the real time temperature going into the cone filter.

Every one of the 4 homemade systems tested had air leaks which negated the gains and more........after testing some were sealed up and tested again and again until a adequate closed system was created then they achieved the real 1-3 HP gains.

Post by **AZhitman** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 10:19 am

Dennis - Should the sensor be placed inside the bottom of the airbox?

YouTube · Post by **Jesda** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 10:45 am

Why does a K&N filter have to be oiled? Does it have moving parts?

Post by **elwesso** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 10:49 am

Because of the fibers... Really, the oil is what does the filtering... The little fibers hold the oil, and the dirt particles stick to the oil......

Post by **HeavyDuty** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 7:04 pm

elwesso wrote:Because of the fibers... Really, the oil is what does the filtering... The little fibers hold the oil, and the dirt particles stick to the oil......

Uh, Wes, maybe you didn't get the memo.....it was a rhetorical question.

C'mon, you guys are buds, ya shoulda known he was fishing.

P.S. (edirt)

The 'oil bath' technology only came about in the last half-century or so, my 52 Studebaker P/U had one OE, and I'm pretty sure it wasn't the first.
Modified by HeavyDuty at 12:33 AM 11/11/2004

Post by **elwesso** » Thu Nov 11, 2004 11:00 am

Q45 Cold Air Intake - No One Has Developed One Yet?

Q45 Cold Air Intake - No One Has Developed One Yet?

Re: Q45 Cold Air Intake - No One Has Developed One Yet? (halfoffautoparts)

Re: Q45 Cold Air Intake - No One Has Developed One Yet? (halfoffautoparts)

Re: Q45 Cold Air Intake - No One Has Developed One Yet? (Q45denver)

Re: Q45 Cold Air Intake - No One Has Developed One Yet? (HeavyDuty)

Re: Q45 Cold Air Intake - No One Has Developed One Yet? (halfoffautoparts)

Re: (AZhitman)

Re: (AZhitman)

Re: (halfoffautoparts)

Re: (halfoffautoparts)

Re: (squeefoo)

Re: (HeavyDuty)

Re: (pito11213)

Re: Q45 Cold Air Intake - No One Has Developed One Yet? (halfoffautoparts)

Re: Q45 Cold Air Intake - No One Has Developed One Yet? (maxnix)

Re: (AZhitman)

Re: (halfoffautoparts)

Re: (Jesda)

Re: (elwesso)

Re: (HeavyDuty)

Nissan Forums

Infiniti Forums

Datsun Forums

Technical Forums

Classifieds / Marketplace

Nissan Motorsports

General Forums