S13 OR S4? This is a LONG thread!

[gr8bryt]

Greetings NICO Family, Gr8bryt is back! I've been gone for quite a while since my last 240 burned to the ground a couple of years ago. I've just been getting around in my Plymouth Acclaim until I was able to get something else. I'll try to get to the point quickly because I have a tendency to digress. This is my dilemma:

I currently have an rps13 that I am considering turning into my project. I just got my s13 running again today because it needed a new starter when I bought it. Prior to today the car has been sitting in my mothers yard for the past year and it's now in pretty rough shape. Lots of rust and corrosion in various places, the interior is mildewed and moldy from all the moisture, and I have no idea of how well the car actually runs. I let it run today for about 10 mins before it cut off, and from what I can tell it needs new motor mounts and a full servicing of all the major components (fuel,trans flush, coolant flush, etc). I'm somewhat handy for D.I.Y but not really, plus I don't have a lot of time to do the work myself so more than likely I'll take it to Precision Tune or someplace like that for the general stuff.

I've put together a Powerpoint presentation of how I want to build it up and all that kinda stuff. I've done my research and I feel that I've got a decent bead on Nissans, swaps, and all that. I've decided that I want to have a fully pimped car to include body kit, paint, silvia front conversion, big brakes, and RB25 to name the main stuff; like I said fully pimped. I realize that the project will run well over $15K, matter of fact, I believe I budgeted that much just for the engine bolt ons since I want serious power, but not necessarily a drag queen. I'm want show and lots of GO and in the end I suppose it will be closer to $20-25K! I know that the RB is a beast, but the chassis is 20 years old and I'm thinking that I want a newer car. The newest car I've ever bought was a '95 Civic back in 2000. I'm considering a B5(2000-2002) Audi S4. They are 2.7L v6 twin turbo, AWD, 6spd, and they have 4 doors. Specs are something like 230hp/215 ft-lbs tq. I'm married w/ 2 kids and right now I drive the aforementioned Plymouth and my wife has a '01 Ford Focus. If I were to get the Audi, I would still want to pimp it some: GT turbos, wheels/tires, big brakes, RS4 type performance basically. That type appetite is somewhere in the $15K range as well plus the purchase price of the car($10-15K). I've given myself a 5-year timeline to complete my Silvia project and around that same amount of time to pay off a $12K car. On a personal note, I'm looking to purchase a house and so I don't want to take on a car payment right now, with the 240, I could just save whatever I can. However in order to finish in the projected timeline I would need to save between $400-500/month which is analogous to making a car payment and having full coverage insurance. Anyone on this forum knows how awesome an RB can be for sheer power, but I want a DD too and the Audi has class and can be just as much of a beast as the RB, plus the advantage of AWD. Most of the people I have asked suggest the Audi route since its newer and likely to have less problems. Since more and more people are going w/ RB's replacement parts are more accessible and not quite as expensive as they used to be a couple of years ago when I first had the notion of an RB powered S13. What do you all think? If I do go for the S4, then I'll sell both the plymouth and the nissan to use as a down payment. Sorry to be so long winded, but this is something that's really been a burden for me and I don't know a lot of people where I live that can get on this level w/ me. Thanks in advance. Btw, please provide intelligent responses. Give some basis for your opinions if you don't mind.


Modified by gr8bryt at 7:04 AM 1/19/2010

[samxini]

Wall of text, learn to use paragraphs.

It' up to you, choose what you feel is right, quit asking people to make choices for you.

[gr8bryt]

I know it's up to me, I'm a grown man and I know how to stick to my decisions. I'm not asking ANYONE to make a decision for me, I'm asking for opinions based on other peoples experiences. I've been in an Rb powered car but I did ride in an S4 and it was awesome. I don't recall being able to pull my head from the headrest until we actually came to the red light. I've always believed that you should learn from other peoples mistakes since we will never live long enough to make them all ourselves. Wisdom is the product of learning from your past experiences.

btw I didn't use proper formatting since it was already a mouthful, but perhaps now it will be an easier read.

[zacmil]

Honestly, if you're considering purchasing a house, maybe this isn't the best time to be pouring a lot of money into a car. A house is a pretty huge investment and it's one that you will have to live with (no pun intended) much longer than a car. If you really need a new car maybe you should look into something a little cheaper until you are in a better position to build the car that you really want. But if you are absolutely set on this than I would probably say do whatever is best for you. An RB powered S13 would be awesome but you are going to have one heck of a time trying to get a wife and two kids into it. Audi's are pretty cool too, but they are pricey. If it were me, I would probably just build the S13 because you can do a little bit whenever you have the money.

[gr8bryt]

I'm not so concerned about making the 240 a family car, that's why I have the Acclaim. My wife and I are both working and making decent income for what we do. I have budgeted that my living expenses can increase by another $400/mo, and I would still be able to swing my project budget. I know that stuff happens as homeowner and you have to be prepared to deal with those things. I'm expecting to close on my house by Mid March. I've done all the pre-qualification and all that stuff, so I know what I'll be paying for my mortgage including P&I.

[gr8bryt]

Is there a Mod that could move this thread to Gen Chat, I believe it is better suited for that forum.

[Dattebayo]

RB rps13?

Man, you're so mixed up...

[flohtingPoint]

Problematic project car S13 or a S4? No brainer, S4.

[Jesda]

Old used paid-off cars that still run well are harder to find than reliable VW products. If you want the Audi, try to keep your other cars.

[breadbox]

Buy S4 first. You may be surprised at its stock form with a chip and tune.

Then if its too slow then upgrade the bish. But the S4 isn't puss.

[SHIFT_Z]

I have a friend with a built S4, and the thing is a beast. Audi specialist in Michigan built it and live-tuned it.Can't blink when you stomp the gas, or you'll be E. Honda 1000 hand slappin' the redline.

I was close to buying a used one (about a year and a half ago) for about 12.5k Had 54,000 miles on it.. But soon decided that it would be out of my budget once I included insurance and the cost of premium gas @ 18mpg.

If you have the $$$, go with the S4.. Sounds like the bodywork and interior work needed on the Nissan could be spent putting in some extra hours at the job. Make some OT and pay off the Audi quicker.

[intermilanrox]

I'd be a little weary of the s4, only because I've heard alot of complaints about Auid's electrical work. Not specifically with the s4, but I hear alot of the A4's get electrical problems constantly. Other than that I think the s4 is one hell of a car, a kid at my highschool has one, and man is it fast.

If you're looking for a fast awd car, why not a wrx/sti? AWD, fun and you can make some put down some pretty sweet numbers.

If you want something just as a nice more family car as opposed to a project, you should take a look at the 07+ g35. My cousin just picked up a 07 g35x for about 19k, and that car would smoke my z32 any day, and it looks good doing it.

Just my $.02

[gr8bryt]

I'd be a little weary of the s4, only because I've heard alot of complaints about Auid's electrical work.

If you're looking for a fast awd car, why not a wrx/sti? AWD, fun and you can make some put down some pretty sweet numbers.

If you want something just as a nice more family car as opposed to a project, you should take a look at the 07+ g35. My cousin just picked up a 07 g35x for about 19k, and that car would smoke my z32 any day, and it looks good doing it.

1.Yea, I've heard the same thing. I've been in the classifieds like auto trader and run across a few w/ dash cluster instrumentation out.

2.I considered an evo/wrx, but I prefer the larger displacement of the 6.

3.I prefer being able to shift w/ a clutch, plus my insurance company would own my a$$ because it's so new

[Zydeco]

I looked into S4's before I got my STi. All I can say is stay away from the turbos models. There turbos go out quite frequently and cost a boat load to replace. I say Evo or STi.

[breadbox]

I was trying to convince a guy at school to give me his A4 for free that he broke but not changing the oil. WTF is wrong with people?

VWs have always been in famous for s***ty wiring. Just Like all DSMs Crankwalk.

I'd still rock the s*** out of the S4.

[gr8bryt]

Well I'd be looking to upgrade to a pair of garrett GT's pretty quickly anyhow. If I do my research and take my time I should be able to find a tt that has been well maintained.

The dyno charts for S4 is pretty nice as well, you've got 75% max tq by 3500 rpm. The power and torque curves on the S4 are complementary to one another, whereas on most of the RB dynos seem to have a larger disparity. Yes I realize this is due to the fact that tq is only being supplied by the rear wheels.

I really like the looks on the S4, clean lines and very much a sleeper if you retain the smic setup and just upgrade them to larger cores.

I started doing a comparison for how far could I get into the RB project given just the purchase price of the audi. Motor swap, brakes and suspension work, wheels and tires was about as far as I figured I could go. I went to the shop today where I would have the swap done and requested a quote. I guess he will get back to me tomorrow. I'm thinking somewhere around $5K (Full motorset w/ transmission and harness, auto-to-manual conversion, driveshaft, s-afc tune, and labor).

Based on the condition of the 240 I have right now, I would suspect that a body shop would charge me a grand just to get all the rusty spots taken care of.
Modified by gr8bryt at 11:55 PM 1/19/2010

[Zydeco]

Im sure you'll be happy as long as its got at least 1 turbo and AWD.

[gr8bryt]

I have a lot of respect for both the Subbie and the Evo, but where I live they are pretty ubiquitous. I have never liked to blend in and be part of the status quo. I realize that the S4 market has also been exploited heavily, but here not so much.

[sbird1]

I agree with Jesda and the others about the VW/Audi wiring issues. If you're a mechanical whiz, it doesn't matter which car you go with, just depends on the amount of time you want to spend on it. As a guy that works at an import repair shop, I can say that we see a whole lot of messed up VW/Audi's. If you want a turbo v-6 that is AWD and hauls a**, why don't you just get a GT-R?

No, but seriously, I think there are better routes than either of your choices. Ya' know, if I had your budget, I think I'd be rather inclined to check out FD RX-7's with maybe an LSx or something...

[HashiriyaS14]

This thread sucks.

S4's are nightmares. Anyone who owns a biturbo S4 and says everything on their car works is a liar.

Why wait to buy a house? This is a fantastic time to buy. If you have $25k to dump into an S14, use that as a downpayment now, keep driving Plymouth, and buy "fully pimped" (lol) car later.

[Zydeco]

This thread sucks.

S4's are nightmares. Anyone who owns a biturbo S4 and says everything on their car works is a liar.

Why wait to buy a house? This is a fantastic time to buy. If you have $25k to dump into an S14, use that as a downpayment now, keep driving Plymouth, and buy "fully pimped" (lol) car later.

QFT

[Dattebayo]

I just liked how rps13 and RB powered were used together. If you're gonna be so specific use the darn chassis code, at least know what you are talking about.

Pet peeve!

I would like a house.

[gr8bryt]

Here you go, take your pick as to which one you would prefer that I useRB25det powered: 1989-1990 Nissan 240SX HS13.5 KA24E (H for KA24E) 1989-1990 Nissan 240SX RHS13.5 FB

Yes I'm planning a Silvia conversion

[QUOTE=Dattebayo I would like a house.[/QUOTE]

That is priority #1, I'm going to do that notwithstanding anything about my car situation. Gotta have somewhere to park and work on my new ride right?

I'm thinking that I'll just enjoy not having a monthly car payment and go for the swap in the hatch. I can get a nice cruiser bike from one of my co-workers for about $2000 if I were just looking to get in something fun now. I've got my 4-door family hauler and my 2-door fun car and the ability to put all my extra funds towards whatever I want to with the 240 whenever. For the price of the RB swap, I'll have similar performance #'s to the S4 and I can just slowly build it to handle better too, albeit not not better than AWD. Once I get settled into my house after a couple of years, perhaps I can have some other options for something else like a RS4 Even if I haven't finished the 240, I will always be able to do a little here and there while still having the newer car option too. Thanks for everyones inputs.

Modified by gr8bryt at 7:48 AM 1/20/2010
Modified by gr8bryt at 7:52 AM 1/20/2010