How much better is Carquest brand synthetic oil than Valvoline synthetic?

[SynisterQ]

I bought a little Saturn 6 months ago and did an oil change on it. I went to Carquest to buy some synthetic oil for it and the cashier suggested I buy the Carquest brand, which was about $3.XX (I forget the exact price) but it was easily $1 and some change cheaper than the Valvoline Synthetic that I always use. I had always used Valvoline synthetic in my Mustangs in the past.

My Q needs an oil change this weekend, so I'm wondering if I should just buy the Carquest or Valvoline synthetic. Since the Saturn was just my beater car for daily driving, I had no qualms about getting the Carquest brand. However, the Q is my baby so I don't mind paying the extra $1 and change per quart. What do you guys think and what would/or do you do when its time for oil change service?Both oils are SM rated by the API, so I'm wondering if its just the name on the bottle that makes the price a little higher.

[konatown]

I don't know much about either of those brands but I used to put Mobil1 in my Q. Now it has Royal Purple 10w30 and I must say that it is the best motor oil I've seen. RP is not cheap but for the Q45, everything is expensive, why shouldn't the oil be?

[BadQ45t]

My drinks the Royal too, I cannot say that I see a huge diff, but the engine sure runs cool and very smooth on it. Since I don't drive more than 4-5k a year total I figure might as well get one of the best oils. The RP price is about half between Mobile 1 or Valvoline (good stuff too) and Red Line. I use Red Line in my 84' 300ZX just because I started using it 10 years ago and stuck with it.

Personally, for the Q I go Valoline, Mobile 1, Castrol Syntech or better, on the Saturn run the house brand.

[nandrolone]

I have a 94 Q45 with 145,000 miles. I switch between royal purple and mobil one extended performance every other oil change. Also, I switch between puralator pure one oil filter and mobil one oil filter every other change. I have never used regular oil. I think any full synthetic would be far superior to any conventional motor oil.

[Q451990]

I actually researched RP when it became available at my local Wally World. It is not well regarded at the forums over at http://www.bobistheoilguy.com

I don't normally point people to other forums, but oil discussion is so highly specialized that it is worth a head-spinning visit!

To the original question, my understanding is that store brand oils are typically just bulk overages from other production runs... or just repackaged from the "lowest bidder" - so I don't know what you're buying. I personally stick to M1 extended performance, since it's readily available at a good price in the 5qt jugs at Wal Mart.

Heath

[Jesda]

At other forums they say Carquest is supplied by Valvoline, but who knows if its as good as Valvoline's own products.

[Rex]

There's been LOTS of great detailed oil discussions. I suggest you search for older (archived) threads about oil including posts made by the 2 quoted below.

The following oils meet MB229.1 and MB229.3 specs.

Those are Mercedes benz oil specs that are very tight for volatilty, deposit control, lubricity, anti-foaming and are somewhat biased toward hard driving environment w/o being racing oils (which carry their own penalties).

1)Kendall GT-1 FullSynth 5W-402)Chevron Supreme Synthetic 5W-403)Valvoline Synpower 5W-404)Havoline Synthetic 5W-405)Pennzoil Synthetic Euro 5W-406)Mobil 1 0W-40 and 15W-507)Quaker State Synthetic Euro 5W-40 8)Castrol Syntec 10W-40 and 5W-50 (editdont use the 5w-50 in extended drain)

The majority of those oils listed are NOT group IV PAO oils anymore(which are becoming rarer by the month).

Redline and AMSOIL some excellent group IV+ V oils, are not listed, cuz they use additional anti wear additives that the auto industry doesn't like, for catalytic converter warranty reasons (tho many feels they protect engines at <least> as well as API oils).(This keeps them from API certification, which means they can't meet MB229.1,MB229.3 for this reason only)

But in all fairness it does show, that you can meet some pretty tough specs, using group III base stocks, despite what many group IV enthusiasts such as myself say.

MOBIL1 is still PAO, even in the newer formulation.It seems the supersyn is for real and not a step back, like we had when MOBIL1 switched to trisyn, which was a step down in some PPL's opinion.Valvoline includes some PAO group IV, and some esters (group V but is now (recent change) mostly group III in its base oil.

Chevron Supreme synthetic it seems to be made in 2 places one of which uses PAO base stock and the other group II+.All others are group III now, (some were recently group IV).

Group I: traditonal refined lube stockGroup II: well refined oil, tighter fractions achieved with some chemical functional goups modifed, invloving more refining steps originally came about as a method by which refineries could utilize less desirable fractions for lubrication oils.Better heat resistance than group I, but less inherent detergency than group I.They have much in common w/ group III except a lesser VIndex.Group III: hydroisomerized paraffinic base stocks, are excellent lubricants, approach many of the abiltiies of PAO, not considered a true synthetic (outside of marketing depts) because , parafinic fractions oils are taken/refined and with the action of a catalyst modified, so as to optimize their properties as lubricants as well as their uniformity.An easier ( and cheaper?) process than making tru synthetics like:GroupIV: PolyAlphaOlefins, created by taking ethylene gas and using addtion reactions to combine the ethylene gas molecules into a lubricant oil with purpose designed properties.famous for their cold flow abilieties and innate multiviscosity behaviour (meaning less VII's need to make a multi-vis oil)Group V: All other kinds of real synthetic oils, usually this means ester base oil formulations , performance smiliar to PAOs (or better)

I know there is a lot of confusion about Group III vs Group IV base oils. A group II base oil has a viscosity index as high as 120. Group III base oils are more than 120, as are Group IV's.

In lubrication aspect, there is no measurable diferences between good Group I, Group II, Group III, and Group IV. In fact, in very high loads like on camshaft lobes, plain Group I works better than plain Group IV.

What you get with Goup II is lower sulphur, lower unsaturated compounds, and better control of volatility. Low sulphur content is being pushed for 'protection of emission contol systems (catalysts)' Lower volatility is being pushed so Auto Mfg claimed fuel economy does not deteriorate of life of the recomended oil change interval (the Fed' are getting wise to all the 'tweaks, bat wings, pinch of skoal etc. the auto guys have been using). Lower unsaturated compounds tends to mean longer life in the crankcase before deposits and crud start forming and the oil thickens. ( less amounts of the detergent additives are needed, again reducing the risk to catalysts.)

Group IV base oils are well known for excellent flow properties at low temperatures. Group III base oils are not quite as good there, but are very good. In the engine, the 2 base oils (grp III and grp IV are identical in performance. Both are essentially isoparaffins (grp IV's have one double bond between the last 2 carbon atoms. They look the same physically, and behave the same almost completely. Grp III's are much more environmental friendly since they come from oil rather than being synthesized from natural gas (it is insane to take a clean fuel like nat gas and process it into a compound which is easire to extract from petroleum.

The REAL performance is mostly determined by the additive package in the finished blend. grp IV's have poor solubility, and the additive packages actually must contain some of the lower quality Grp I and Grp II diluents to keep the additives dissolved. Grp III base stocks are better that Grp IV, wors that Grp II. In my opinion, Grp II base oils are the all around best for engines in most conditions.

I personally run Valvoline semisynthetic. In my opinion its higher solvency is desirable in my higher mileage engines (92 Q45a, 113K, owned 3.5yrs since 90K, 94 Q45a 103K , owned 2 years since 90K), 94 MBZ sl600 (V12), owned 2 yrs, since 79K) All have Valvoline semisynthetic 10W 30 now, 20W50 summer (Houston Tx)

I used to run Mobil 1 exclusively, but discovered clear varnish laydown in my previous MBZ 560sel with 5000 mile changes! Cleaned right up with the Valvoline semisynthetic. Since I continue to use Chervon premium exclusively, it was not gasoline causing the problem, but the oil detergancy and my driving habits (too much short trip for the drain interval). Now 6 month or, 3500 miles max.

One must remember the PAO's are a mix of molecules, not exact copies of each other. They have nearly as much variation as good grp III stuff. People far more knowledgeable about the details of these molecular types have assurred me they are essentially identical. There is no such thing as 'pure component' in higher hydrocarbons. Entropy rules.

One interesting note-- when the PAO gets into the combustion chamber, it tends to 'burn' completely, making no 'oil smoke' and leaving no residue. Once it starts to oxidize, it goes completely.

I used to work in lubes with a major oil company, and every summer we ran test fleets in south Texas, 70 MPH 24/7, A/C on high, roof racks. Different oil formulations, different fuels, a host of test stuff. After 40K miles the vehicles were disassembled and inspected. (NO OIL OR FILTER CHANGEs mind you.) "old' Havoline 20w and 10W40 , running the Firechief and Skychief standard pump gasoline(the 'standards) routinely completed the tests with all parts within new manufacturing tolerances and no measurable wera. Even did radioactive tracer studies (irridate top piston ring.etc. ) Different fuels (no detergents) would often suffer engine failure before completing the test. Skychief engines were always cleaner though.

So, when I see/hear about 100,000 mile tests, (with regular oil and filter changes) run 24/7, I am not impressed.That's less than 2000 hours of operation. Give me a NYc taxi test for a full 12 months( winter and summer) with 25000 mile changes--then talk to me.

Me oil is cheap, hard parts expensive. Better to change more frequently than buy expensive advertizing and 'gee whiz magic' oil

[SynisterQ]

Thanks for all the extremely helpful info. I got lots of reading to do!! This stuff is really interesting.

[NightRiderQ45]

Pull up the MSDS on both of them and then compare what's "in" it. I've become quite the oil guru since joining Bob Is The Oil Guy. RP AND Mobil 1 5w-30 don't get great reviews there. Mobil 1 EP is great though. If I were to run synthetic again, I would use Pennzoil Platinum . With my 3-5k OCI, synthetic was a waste of money.

[Victor]

Last oil change I put in Mobil ! extended performance with a Mobil ! filter. It's supposed to be good for 15,000 miles. Now Kragen has two deals using rebates. Shell for 49 cents a quart or Valvoline Synpower synthetic for 99 cents a quart, limit one case. which if either would you buy?Any comments on Lucas power steering leak stop? Infinitis use Dexron II or III automatic transmission fluid in the power steering, would Lucas mix with it? Are power steering fluid and automatic transmission fluid essentially the same thing?

[NightRiderQ45]

Last oil change I put in Mobil ! extended performance with a Mobil ! filter. It's supposed to be good for 15,000 miles. Now Kragen has two deals using rebates. Shell for 49 cents a quart or Valvoline Synpower synthetic for 99 cents a quart, limit one case. which if either would you buy?Any comments on Lucas power steering leak stop? Infinitis use Dexron II or III automatic transmission fluid in the power steering, would Lucas mix with it? Are power steering fluid and automatic transmission fluid essentially the same thing?

I would go with the Valvoline Synpower! The additives in Valvoline are great. On my next oil change, I'm going to use either pennzoil dino which is a group II+ oil or valvoline maxline high mileage which have great additives not to mention it's syn blend!

Infiniti's use Dex-III but the GM licensed expired last year so it's better to use Dex-VI. SuperTech now makes Dex-VI for $3/qt and the product is licensed. You can use atf in your power steering but I've never done it. I don't know much about Lucas products, but I know the injector cleaner get great reviews.
Modified by NightRiderQ45 at 1:02 PM 4/28/2008

[Q45tech]

T3 has used Valvoline 10w30 in bulk for the past 13+ years works wonderfully if changed every 90 days or 3,750 miles per Nissan recommendations.

Regardless of marketing lies I sure wouldn't wait longer if longevity was an issue.

Usually the dirt build up occurs long before the additives are depleted.Now the use of 0-5w synthetics in winter is a different case entirely.

Waiting more than 90 days on an I4 is much worse than on a V8 due to smaller sump volume and the usual perpedicular heads vs the angled heads on V8 and V6............drain hole placement in heads...center puddling.