Available ignition upgrades for SII RB25?

[cvc9216]

I know there are similar threads about this, but my problem is a little different so I figured I'd start my own thread. I've been having intermittent problems with my RB25 for a while, but it's much worse now that I'm running more boost with a bigger turbo. Here's my setup:

SC61 turbotial 38mm wastegate440cc injectorsgreddy manifold w/ q45 TBZ32 fuel pumpSAFCZ32 MAFSFMIC3" exhaust turbo-back, no catrunning copper 7 NGKs gapped to 0.030"

I dynoed it today and after a couple pulls on the dyno it started to break up and lose power (when the car started to get hot?). Seemed like the motor wanted to run lean, anything under 12:1 AFR and it would break up really bad. I also noticed this when I was running the stock turbo, but not as bad.

I let the car cool down and the last couple pulls were strong, 12:1 across the board, made 380hp at 6800rpm with 17 psi. Took it for a little spin afterwards and it felt strong. But on the way home, after 10 min. of driving it started to break up again. I couldn't even get into boost in 5th gear, it would just stutter and backfire. So I'm guessing all this points to an ignition problem? The AFRs stayed pretty consistent, didn't see any problems there.

My question is what can I do to upgrade the ignition system on the stock computer? I'm considering an AEM EMS, don't know if that will help me any. I don't want to go to a full standalone because I spent so much damn time rewiring the harness already. Anyone have any info on coilpack upgrades?

sorry for the long post, thanks for the help

[Andrew85cm]

Those are still pretty good numbers but you should be seeing a little bit more I would imagine at that psi since I think the sc61 flows 10 more lbs than the gt30r that Carl is running. Plus you have a rb25. Funny though I am planning on that exact set up with some minor differences with my rb20. Maybe I will turn out with those numbers and I would be pleased. Only differences is stock intake manifold, q45 maf and cams.

Good luck on sorting your ignition issues out. I don't have too much to say. For that much power I would imagine a better engine management is in order to help you with your timing maps and ish. I don't know if that is your issue but the SAFC has it's limits. I have read some posts about this issue recently with the RB26 you might want to check that out. The guys were talking about some system that uses 3 coils and wires that go to your plugs. I think splitfire or something of the like. You may want to look into that. Some source might be some supra forums they might have good options for high out put ignition sources. I think HKS makes an upgrade system but it might cost you a arm and a leg and your third leg to buy it.~ANDREW~

[Yellow4g63]

dose it idle funny after it starts to break up? could be bad coils that can't take the heat anymore.

[eh?]

Maybe not enough timing? Buy my PFC . Probably gain 50rwhp with it :p

[cvc9216]

It occasionally idles a little rough or high, but I figured that was because I had the decel air function setup in the safc. I was having issues with stalling I think because I made the intake pipe to the turbo too short. Anyway, I'm going to take a closer look at the coils today. I want to rule that out before I buy a AEM EMS or Power FC.

I'm thinking of going with an AEM C2DI and RB25 SI or supra coilpacks? any reason that wouldn't work? would I still need a standalone to control them?

[SillyRB]

Supra coil packs will now work atleast not as a direct replacement. The S2 RB2 coils have internal igniters in them so the only direct replacement are the splitfire coils. I heard many people are using XS Engineering power pack (Mckinney Motorsports etc) i have a BRAND New one for sale that did not work with my application. Any the other thing i think is that you are running lean, 444cc injectors are not much bigger than the stock 370's. So you might want to upgrade the fuel system. What is your timing @ ?

[SillyRB]

you might also want to reduce the gap of your plug ..I'd use a NGK plugeither the 3330's or a BKR.GO with an "8" range plug or atleast a 7 and gap at approx .020 to prevent spark from being blown out.

[cvc9216]

Supra coil packs will now work atleast not as a direct replacement. The S2 RB2 coils have internal igniters in them so the only direct replacement are the splitfire coils.

well I would use the AEM C2DI with the 2JZ coils, or would I still need a stock ignitor also? And I'm pretty sure it's not lean. I tuned it on the dyno to 12:1 and the 440's should be good for well over 400hp.

[cvc9216]

I'm using BKR NGK plugs, heat range 7. I regapped them today to 0.65mm and it did not help. I also wrapped the coilpacks with electrical tape after reading in the aussie forums that the coilpacks can get hairline cracks that allow arcing to the head. But that didn't help either.

[SillyRB]

If you change your coils you are going to need a way to ignite the mixture. The CDI is an ignition enhancer. I have similar problems the power pack would fix your issue more than likely because it increases the voltage in the coils, it didnt fix my problem due to me having a microtech.

[cvc9216]

anyone have a known-good set of coilpacks they would be kind enough to let me borrow? I will pay shipping both ways

how much do you want for the power pack?

[SillyRB]

anyone have a known-good set of coilpacks they would be kind enough to let me borrow? I will pay shipping both ways

That is the same post i made a couple of weeks ago. If you just want to test your coils to see if they are sparking to it the old school way. 1) Unplug your injectors / Fuel Pump2) Pull out all of your coils3) Plug in one coil @ a time stick a spark plug in the bottom of the coil and have the other end of the spark plug on a valve cover.4) Make sure it sparks, if it doesn't spark you know the coil is bad5) Make sure your coil pack harness is grounded

[ehacker01]

That is the same post i made a couple of weeks ago. If you just want to test your coils to see if they are sparking to it the old school way. 1) Unplug your injectors / Fuel Pump2) Pull out all of your coils3) Plug in one coil @ a time stick a spark plug in the bottom of the coil and have the other end of the spark plug on a valve cover.4) Make sure it sparks, if it doesn't spark you know the coil is bad5) Make sure your coil pack harness is grounded

this just tells you if one is not firing not if it is losing voltage or a weak spark. definately not a good indicator in this situation.

[SillyRB]

this just tells you if one is not firing not if it is losing voltage or a weak spark. definately not a good indicator in this situation.

You are rightHowever its a process of eliminationOne step at a time

[SillyRB]

http://www.xs-engineering.com/...t=604

Call Mack @ Mckinney he will tell you himself that it helps with many mis-firing problems on the RB25's.

cvc9216 - I paid $305 Shipped Make an offer as i want to help you out, Anything reasonable its yours !!

[SillyRB]

http://www.xs-engineering.com/...t=604

Call Mack @ Mckinney he will tell you himself that it helps with many mis-firing problems on the RB25's.

how much do you want for the power pack?

cvc9216 - I paid $305 Shipped Make an offer as i want to help you out, Anything reasonable its yours !!

[SillyRB]

Post Below Sorry !

[cvc9216]

will you take $250 shipped? email me [email protected]

[Sky240PWR]

you can get the SplitFire Super Direct Ignition System for the RB25!!!...but it will cost you around $430.00 shipped

[cvc9216]

but where can I get it? cheapest I've seen is 660 shipped from AU. Do you know where I can get it cheaper?

[SillyRB]

will you take $250 shipped? email me [email protected]

I sent you an e-mail with good news Trying to help you out man, kill 2 birds with one stone.

[SillyRB]

but where can I get it? cheapest I've seen is 660 shipped from AU. Do you know where I can get it cheaper?

I dont know if he still gets on this board much, but ask a few people who have used that system and it does not work very well. Quite a few people have had some not very nice things to say about the Direct Splitfire. But then again that is just an opinion. Over-priced and does not always work due to voltage problems with those coils.

[Andrew85cm]

Just a note on the whole 444cc injectors good enough for well over 400 whp. They often say on RB motors since we have 6 injectors that the cc of the injectors is approxamately the amount of hp you can squeeze from them. It is my understanding that this is crank horse power and not wheel. So with 444cc injectors minus 15% drivetrain loss that gives you an available 378whp minus the 66 hp through the drivetrain loss. Now this might be overcome with more fuel pressure but you don't want to max out the duty cycle. Keep it under like 90% if you dont want one to crap out on you. Anyway, my point is that you are making 380 at the wheel I assume so that its really close to the limitations of your injectors. You may want to look at getting more fuel or getting some other engine management unit to help with timing.~ANDREW~

[Sky240PWR]

but where can I get it? cheapest I've seen is 660 shipped from AU. Do you know where I can get it cheaper?

well this is where I founf them for around $440 shipped to my door!http://www.nengun.com/catalogue/product/5

[cvc9216]

fuel doesn't appear to be an issue, but I may upgrade to 550cc injectors. I want to get the ignition problems figured out and then up the boost a little maybe. Shooting for over 400. Anyone want to buy a set of top feed high-imp. 440s with 200 miles on them? rb20 guys?

Just a note on the whole 444cc injectors good enough for well over 400 whp. They often say on RB motors since we have 6 injectors that the cc of the injectors is approxamately the amount of hp you can squeeze from them. It is my understanding that this is crank horse power and not wheel. So with 444cc injectors minus 15% drivetrain loss that gives you an available 378whp minus the 66 hp through the drivetrain loss. Now this might be overcome with more fuel pressure but you don't want to max out the duty cycle. Keep it under like 90% if you dont want one to crap out on you. Anyway, my point is that you are making 380 at the wheel I assume so that its really close to the limitations of your injectors. You may want to look at getting more fuel or getting some other engine management unit to help with timing.~ANDREW~

well this is where I founf them for around $440 shipped to my door!http://www.nengun.com/catalogue/product/5

They appear to be out of stock and it doesn't look like they carry the RB25 SII coils anyway. they do have some good prices though