Solenoid actuated Boost Controller

[fo0manchu]

Just had an idea in making this. I received some pieces for making my h20 injection kit. I got a water solenoid that can also be used for air. Here is the one I got:http://cgi.ebay.com/1-4-Electr...1f4eb

Anyways, I was thinking about hooking this up to a pressure switch and then using the solenoid to control the air pressure. Any one ever do this? I made the diy ball/spring type one but I don't really like it. It would cost about $40 bucks to make this.

What do you guys think.

[neverlift]

in theory sure I am gonna do something similar with a csi that has the nozzle removed, should work like a charm, and give better boost control along with better spool time. MBC typically reduce the amount of air going to the waste gate allowing more boost to be run before the waste gate FULLY opens. With a solenoid the WG can not start to open till the hobbs opens the solenoid could knock 3~500 rpm off spool time.

I'm sure wd can chime in on this.

[fo0manchu]

With my ball valve one on there I noticed a big difference in spool time, however it was hard to find the right spring and adjustments were tricky. I hooked it up to my air compressor and a boost gauge. The valve would flutter at lower boost levels, because of the little ball bearing, and sometimes not open at all. I guess at higher boost levels it worked fine.

Neverlift, you are the king of JunkYard ghetto. I love it, cause thats how I roll as well... well, not so much any more. But a large part of my car is built with JY parts

[240SXmotoring]

how would you maintain solenoid duty cycle?

[WDRacing]

No need, it's normally closed and powered open. I was going to do something like this, but it's way easier just to do my Ultra Cool Soup Can Mod which delays the vacuum signal from prematurely reaching the wastegate.

That way you don't have to worry about any part of the solenoid system taking a crap on you. Perhaps that valve, when not cooled by flowing water, will heat up if kept open for to long. I wouldn't want to find that out the hardway.

I suggest a boost controlled ignition cut. That way you never spike and pop the motor. To easy not to install IMO.

Anyway, solenoid actuated boost control isn't new, it's how all electronic boost controllers work. So you know the theory works, you just need to make sure the solenoid is up to the job.

WD

[trackslut240]

with the ultra cool soup can method, u cant raise the psi can you? or will it raise automatically? i tried the manually adjustable controller which i got eons ago, it was impossible for me to go just two psi over the 7psi t25 wastegate. i just want ten psi max, i am gonna try that soup can. but this hobbs switch to operate a boost solenoid is awesome. i am gonna need a boost solenoid anyway to tie in to my bikirom. time to hunt for a cheapie...

[fo0manchu]

Did some searching around and like WD said, this is how electronic boost controllers work. However, this method doesn't cost an arm and a leg. Total cost, Solenoid = $20shipped, pressure switch = 19shipped, a couple barbs and were at about $40ish.

A perrin one is like 100 bucks. And they just get more expensive from there. And I'm assuming that was just for the solenoid.

After I order some parts, I'll post a review up on it. Should be a good DIY electronic boost controller setup.

Thats a good point in testing the solenoid.

The thing I like about a boost controller is that you can run the smallest spring in the wastegate and then adjust for boost, knowing that the gate is going to open instantly. When testing out my wastegate, at 7psi with an air compressor, it does open, but not 100% and not as fast and as much as if I put 15psi to it. So i figure, smaller spring at 7psi will give much better response.

[eazye2000]

Definitely keep us posted! I've wanted an electronic boost controller for a while. But couldn't grasp the concept... Didn't realize that the solenoid just kinda 'chattered'.Post up some results and links. I'm definitely down to be #2 guinea pig. I guess it's better than unplugging the wastegate like in the past. lol

[eazye2000]

I found some air solenoids at work in the parts room. I have no idea if they will work or not. I don't want to snag one if it's not going to work. They say NO/NC which is normally open/normally closed I think. But I don't know how they could be both....They are for large garbage trucks. And I don't know a whole lot about the air systems and stuff on them to judge what they are or do.

I'll snap a pic and post them up. See what you guys think.

[neverlift]

do it!

[eazye2000]

I hate to be a post whore. But I went back in and checked out what we had. It looks like it will work. It has 3 holes in it. You have to change it around to use it NO/NC. Didn't trigger it, but it didn't let squat through when I blew through the corresponding hole for normally closed.Anyways, I'm having a hard time getting my phone to send a picture. I'm lucky I even know how to turn the damn thing on. But as soon as I figure it out, I will post it up.

[eazye2000]

Still at work, so trying to do this quietly..

[WDRacing]

Some noids are rated for air and some aren't. It's fairly important for it to not leak, or else you're not actually accomplishing anything. But it's easy enough to test E with a compressor. The cool thing about doing this is the ability to mount the pressure switch in the cockpit so you can adjust the boost while your driving.

I have the TurboXS Dual Stg mounted inside and it rocks...but I had to run 1 thousand feet of vacuum...lol.

WD

[eazye2000]

I'm going to mess with it this weekend. I think I'll just have to plug up/off the exhaust part of it. I think it exhausts the pressure that would be on the wastegate side when it closes back up. I'm not sure though. Gotta play with it.If it does work, I'll see what a bunch of these suckers would cost.

[trackslut240]

i got the hobbs switch and bought a train horn solenoid, will hook it up thursday, hopefully and post up results.

this is what i gothttp://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...02eb1

I'm going to mess with it this weekend. I think I'll just have to plug up/off the exhaust part of it. I think it exhausts the pressure that would be on the wastegate side when it closes back up. I'm not sure though. Gotta play with it.If it does work, I'll see what a bunch of these suckers would cost.

i think so too on the exhaust part. but what happens if u blow thru the in or out, with it not open?

[eazye2000]

but what happens if u blow thru the in or out, with it not open?

I think if you blow into the 'out' port, in the 'normally closed' diagram, air leaks out the exhaust. Which is hopefully normal. It makes sense to me...But if you blow in the 'in' port, nothing goes by.

Just need to find a hobbs switch, and I'm good to go. Don't know what they look like, or I would dig around here for one. lol

[trackslut240]

here are a couple of types[IMG][/IMG]

this is the type i got, can be used either way nc/no..., they are adjustable too, can go down to 2psi to 25psi i think.

another type of hobbs switch, i think this one should be available at your work. some are adjustable some are not, have different psi settings too.[IMG][/IMG]

go hunt em down...

[eazye2000]

Couldn't find any of the boost or 'hobbs' switches. I called the distributor today, and they said "Hobbs switch? They are a manufacturer and make thousands of switches!". So I felt kinda dumb.Anyways, they only have normally closed ones at the shop. And we don't have any here.

So I'm still looking. I WILL find a cheap solution to this eventually!

[fo0manchu]

Hobbs is the brand of a pressure switch. Ask them for an adjustable pressure switch.

[eazye2000]

Hobbs is the brand of a pressure switch. Ask them for an adjustable pressure switch.

I'm aware of that. And I asked them that. They have what I need, it's just normally closed instead of open.

[fo0manchu]

so I finally had some free time and put together this idea. I have been running it for the past week so far and it works well. I'll snap some pictures soon.

Pros: Quick response at set boost level. Compact design and easy to install. Setting the pressure switch is pretty easy, I just "t'd" it to a pressure gauge and shot some air from my air compressor slowly until the desired boost level.

Cons: I have my pressure switch set to 8.5, kicks in at 8.5 but doesn't switch the solenoid off until about 6.5. So it has about a 2lb differential between closed and open circuit. So I can actually hear my wastegate opening at 8.5 and then closing at 6.5 and then boosting till 8.5 again.

I wonder if all pressure switches have that big of a differential. I wouldn't mind 1lb or .5lb differential. I'm using the non "hobbs" kind, like the picture posted a couple posts up.

[trackslut240]

interesting, which kind of pressure switch are u using? the screw on type or the pipe connector type? i believe this is where an electronic circuit comes in handy where it can pulsate the solenoid to give it a duty cycle. still a much cheaper alternative to an ebc, i think we want it to pulsate every time the pressure threshold is reached, so it can close the wastegate earlier. adding more electronic gizmodry to this will prolly put it close to cost of an ebc. post up some pics. i still have to set mine up. using the pipe type pressure switch and a train horn solenoid. good job, thanks for sharing.