Anyone use AEM EMS?
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sorrowfulkiller
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Anyone use AEM EMS?
Next Spring I'm buying a s13 for a summer dd/weekend car and I'm planning a full rebuild + suspension + turbo as soon as I get the car. I just wanted to know if anyone on here was running an AEM EMS and what problems (if any) you had with it. I understand the crank sensor is touchy in the early models... has that since been fixed? Do you need to buy a cas wheel with the new ones?
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sorrowfulkiller
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Re: Anyone use AEM EMS? (sorrowfulkiller)
I'm starting to think I didn't place this in the right forum now >_>
Seach for AEM cas wheel replacement KA threads on the aem ems forums.
Its kind of a pain in the butt. Reduced resolution, but AEM has been the only game in town for a while for the KA.
Until this: http://www.rpsport.net/haltech/36666/
Its kind of a pain in the butt. Reduced resolution, but AEM has been the only game in town for a while for the KA.
Until this: http://www.rpsport.net/haltech/36666/
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sorrowfulkiller
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Re: (johngriff)
what kind of map resolution does the haltech have? Also is it as easy to use as the aem ems? because I've used the aempro software before and I know how to work it.
I was actually going to ask a bit more about the haltech in your thread earlier today. What kind of wideband does it use usually?
I was actually going to ask a bit more about the haltech in your thread earlier today. What kind of wideband does it use usually?
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chaosli
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Re: (sorrowfulkiller)
i have a aem ems but it not in the car at the moment i figuar the sensors and orther stuff but i still dont know how to adjust fuel map but i think the auto map in aem will help alot
Map Resolution:P1000/2000 is 32x32Sprint 500 is 16x16
Haltech Halwin and ECU manager software is EASIER than AEM software. I have always felt the aem software a bit clunky and "Fast and the Furious" themed for tuning.
Haltech software for older ecus, like the "K" Series (basically everything that is DOS based), STAY AWAY FROM. I hate those older haltech tuning softwares.
Newer softs are awesome, cleanly organized, stable and straight forward.
DL Links here: (ECU manager is like 100mgs which you may not want to wait for, but definitely look at halwin)
Halwin: http://www.haltech.com/downloads/halwin_1.89.zipECU Manager: http://files.haltech.com/downl...e.zip
widebands Any. As long as you know, or set the output voltage reference for your wideband, then place the same values in the haltech soft, the haltech can utilize any wideband. There are also a number a factory pre-set values for common widebands already preloaded from haltech. Typically a wideband V setup is 0v=8.0af/r 5v=20.0af/r, and values in between.
Haltech used the Innovate stuff for a long time, and that was their oem equipment. Now they have their own line of widebands. Mostly, I didn't like the Innovates or AEM's because their frame rates were too slow for street/track tuning, they work good for dyno tuning. Haltech's new wideband has a much higher frame rate (especially run as single sensor) and are very good for street tuning/track tuning.
Basically, the information did not update fast enough on those widebands to accurately graph events against engine data in data logs.
Auto tune, but not knowing how to tuneThis is not going to work. Yes, auto tune is very cool, especially if you have long stretches of road to create "constant" load enviroments for the ecu to tune to. Otherwise you really need a dyno to tune (a dyno gives you critical enviroment of "constant contraints").
But if you don't really understand square one of tuning, auto tune isn't going to help you get to where you want to be.
A GREAT forum to start to get up to speed on EFI tuning is EFI101.com . I cannot say enough good stuff about that website / organization / or their classes for that matter. If you attend one of their workshops, you will walk away with invaluable specialized knowledge you will NOT have gotten anywhere else.
Hopefully that answered some q's.
Haltech Halwin and ECU manager software is EASIER than AEM software. I have always felt the aem software a bit clunky and "Fast and the Furious" themed for tuning.
Haltech software for older ecus, like the "K" Series (basically everything that is DOS based), STAY AWAY FROM. I hate those older haltech tuning softwares.
Newer softs are awesome, cleanly organized, stable and straight forward.
DL Links here: (ECU manager is like 100mgs which you may not want to wait for, but definitely look at halwin)
Halwin: http://www.haltech.com/downloads/halwin_1.89.zipECU Manager: http://files.haltech.com/downl...e.zip
widebands Any. As long as you know, or set the output voltage reference for your wideband, then place the same values in the haltech soft, the haltech can utilize any wideband. There are also a number a factory pre-set values for common widebands already preloaded from haltech. Typically a wideband V setup is 0v=8.0af/r 5v=20.0af/r, and values in between.
Haltech used the Innovate stuff for a long time, and that was their oem equipment. Now they have their own line of widebands. Mostly, I didn't like the Innovates or AEM's because their frame rates were too slow for street/track tuning, they work good for dyno tuning. Haltech's new wideband has a much higher frame rate (especially run as single sensor) and are very good for street tuning/track tuning.
Basically, the information did not update fast enough on those widebands to accurately graph events against engine data in data logs.
Auto tune, but not knowing how to tuneThis is not going to work. Yes, auto tune is very cool, especially if you have long stretches of road to create "constant" load enviroments for the ecu to tune to. Otherwise you really need a dyno to tune (a dyno gives you critical enviroment of "constant contraints").
But if you don't really understand square one of tuning, auto tune isn't going to help you get to where you want to be.
A GREAT forum to start to get up to speed on EFI tuning is EFI101.com . I cannot say enough good stuff about that website / organization / or their classes for that matter. If you attend one of their workshops, you will walk away with invaluable specialized knowledge you will NOT have gotten anywhere else.
Hopefully that answered some q's.
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sorrowfulkiller
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Re: (johngriff)
Thanks for the very detailed response john, I've pretty much decided on the haltech now... I downloaded the software a couple days ago but haven't been home to actualy go through it yet.
I've never been a fan with innovate products either, I used to have an LC-1 from them with no gauge and it went bad, called customer support numerous times to try to get it fixed and they wouldn't even call me back... that and always had to re-calibrate it every couple months.... pain in my a**.
I actually used a J.A.W. for awhile for a wideband, which I highly recomend if you can get a hold of the guy because it reads as high as 50x per second and you can adjust it to do average values over a period of time also.
Do you know if the Haltech wideband and the Innovate use the same sensor?
I've never been a fan with innovate products either, I used to have an LC-1 from them with no gauge and it went bad, called customer support numerous times to try to get it fixed and they wouldn't even call me back... that and always had to re-calibrate it every couple months.... pain in my a**.
I actually used a J.A.W. for awhile for a wideband, which I highly recomend if you can get a hold of the guy because it reads as high as 50x per second and you can adjust it to do average values over a period of time also.
Do you know if the Haltech wideband and the Innovate use the same sensor?
That is an excellent question, my assumption would be yes, just because of the price point of the wideband.
Everyone uses the VW sensor.
Even NGK, in their NGK wideband kit.
And NGK, makes a wideband sensor.
But I think the cost of the sensor is (the NGK) is so much more, they defaulted to shipping the VW sensor with their controller. Then they marketed the controller being superior because everyone knows NGK widebands are superior (they are) but failed to mention it had the VW sensor with it..... mehh... thats why I don't go to sema any more, I just give their reps a hard time (innovates too).
I will shoot an email to aus and query what, how which sensor is packaged with their unit now, more than likely, because its less than $400 w/the sensor, its the VW.
I like the JAW. But, I don't want to recommend it to anyone because I can't be responsible for trouble shooting its compatibility with a haltech ECU. It should be really easy to use together, 5v output to wideband input on haltech ecu, put wideband ground on same ground as ecu.
But, since its "build it yourself", if someone wires a cap pushing 24v's out of it to their haltech, I don't want to be the guy responsible for telling them to use the stuff together. With the mass produced widebands i know that is not going to happen, so its easier for me to recommend those.
Modified by johngriff at 1:25 PM 10/17/2009
Everyone uses the VW sensor.
Even NGK, in their NGK wideband kit.
And NGK, makes a wideband sensor.
But I think the cost of the sensor is (the NGK) is so much more, they defaulted to shipping the VW sensor with their controller. Then they marketed the controller being superior because everyone knows NGK widebands are superior (they are) but failed to mention it had the VW sensor with it..... mehh... thats why I don't go to sema any more, I just give their reps a hard time (innovates too).
I will shoot an email to aus and query what, how which sensor is packaged with their unit now, more than likely, because its less than $400 w/the sensor, its the VW.
I like the JAW. But, I don't want to recommend it to anyone because I can't be responsible for trouble shooting its compatibility with a haltech ECU. It should be really easy to use together, 5v output to wideband input on haltech ecu, put wideband ground on same ground as ecu.
But, since its "build it yourself", if someone wires a cap pushing 24v's out of it to their haltech, I don't want to be the guy responsible for telling them to use the stuff together. With the mass produced widebands i know that is not going to happen, so its easier for me to recommend those.
Modified by johngriff at 1:25 PM 10/17/2009
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sorrowfulkiller
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Re: (johngriff)
That's what I figured.... doesn't AEM use a different sensor though?
I understand your take on the JAW, if you don't know what you're doing especially if you are working with a standalone at the same time then you definetely shouldn't mess with it.
In any case I'm guessing you have used the haltech wideband before... any issues with losing calibration over a period of a month or two? because thats the last thing I wanna do is calibrate it every 2 weeks!
I understand your take on the JAW, if you don't know what you're doing especially if you are working with a standalone at the same time then you definetely shouldn't mess with it.
In any case I'm guessing you have used the haltech wideband before... any issues with losing calibration over a period of a month or two? because thats the last thing I wanna do is calibrate it every 2 weeks!
Re: Anyone use AEM EMS? (sorrowfulkiller)
The AEM cas wheel problem has long since been resolved. It's a problem that you may suffer from any standalone due to the fact that they operate differently compared to a factory ecu.Here is a site that explains it pretty well http://triggerdisc.com/FAQ.htm#Q1 The AEM ems is a very good system for the price, and i for one, have not had any issues with it.For the money, it's very hard to beat and as of recently, the prices have fallen quite a bit.
I'm not sure if it's because of the economy or if it's because of the new series 2 ecu that they recently released but all i have to say is that it's a plus for anyone looking to run the older one.
The resolution is pretty good. I don't work for AEM or anything so i'm not 100% sure but i think it's 18X22.
The thing that i like about AEM the most is that it is a true plug and play and that's a big plus for me living in California.
Even with the early issues with the cas wheel, they never deviated from the promise of it being a plug and play. They could have offered other solutions such as making sr, ka, and all the other nissan engines that run the optical trigger to run a mag trigger wheel but they didn't. They also offer base maps and full support of their product as well as a forum. I am using the 1610U on a stock ka24de with a gt35r. It's managing 810cc injectors on speed density with a 3.5 bar map sensor at 12psi.I've had the setup for quite a while now and everyone comments on how they can't believe how well it starts, runs, drives and idles like it was completely stock until the boost kicks in. That is the most impressive part in my opinion.
I'm not sure if it's because of the economy or if it's because of the new series 2 ecu that they recently released but all i have to say is that it's a plus for anyone looking to run the older one.
The resolution is pretty good. I don't work for AEM or anything so i'm not 100% sure but i think it's 18X22.
The thing that i like about AEM the most is that it is a true plug and play and that's a big plus for me living in California.
Even with the early issues with the cas wheel, they never deviated from the promise of it being a plug and play. They could have offered other solutions such as making sr, ka, and all the other nissan engines that run the optical trigger to run a mag trigger wheel but they didn't. They also offer base maps and full support of their product as well as a forum. I am using the 1610U on a stock ka24de with a gt35r. It's managing 810cc injectors on speed density with a 3.5 bar map sensor at 12psi.I've had the setup for quite a while now and everyone comments on how they can't believe how well it starts, runs, drives and idles like it was completely stock until the boost kicks in. That is the most impressive part in my opinion.
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sorrowfulkiller
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Re: Anyone use AEM EMS? (sorrowfulkiller)
Okay I looked at the Haltech software and I am extremely impressed at its simplicity and good looking interface. Two things I can't figure out though... what are the fuel tables (linjection time or VE) are these values just values made up by the ecu or are they actually like how many ms's the injector opens or the injector duty cycle?
and do you know of any way you can use boost control vs tps in haltech?
Also one more question, who would I talk to about a base map... or startup map?
and do you know of any way you can use boost control vs tps in haltech?
Also one more question, who would I talk to about a base map... or startup map?
The fuel table, you are looking directly at the injector open time in Milliseconds per cycle. The map that loads is just a factory default with values in them.
Boost control vs TPS is featured in the platinum ECU's, so it is a feature included in ECU manager. Boot ecu manager, in the "ECU navigator" menu on the left, second drop down under "Boost Control" is "Target Boost" and that will take you to Target Boost @ RPM/TPS.
Base maps? Tons. I have some factory setup perfect maps for the E8 and E11, P1000 and P2000, as well as our own private collection of various customer tunes. Also over the last few years I have included a free custom base map with every ecu we sell, and have gotten pretty good at making approximated maps, based off previous customer cars, and new variables for the new customer.
If you want a really smoking base map, Steve Shadows (www.shadowerks.com) can whip you up something incredible, weather its PowerFC, AEM or Haltech. His services are renowned.
Haltech Wideband performance has been really good compared to the LC1. I have recalibrated it and not noticed a difference in readings, meaning it didn't get out of calibration. The haltech wideband uses the VW/Bosch sensor most other widebands use.
Boost control vs TPS is featured in the platinum ECU's, so it is a feature included in ECU manager. Boot ecu manager, in the "ECU navigator" menu on the left, second drop down under "Boost Control" is "Target Boost" and that will take you to Target Boost @ RPM/TPS.
Base maps? Tons. I have some factory setup perfect maps for the E8 and E11, P1000 and P2000, as well as our own private collection of various customer tunes. Also over the last few years I have included a free custom base map with every ecu we sell, and have gotten pretty good at making approximated maps, based off previous customer cars, and new variables for the new customer.
If you want a really smoking base map, Steve Shadows (www.shadowerks.com) can whip you up something incredible, weather its PowerFC, AEM or Haltech. His services are renowned.
Haltech Wideband performance has been really good compared to the LC1. I have recalibrated it and not noticed a difference in readings, meaning it didn't get out of calibration. The haltech wideband uses the VW/Bosch sensor most other widebands use.
Re: Anyone use AEM EMS? (sorrowfulkiller)
Must be nice to be asking questions about an add on fuel computer. I would be too if you hadn't ripped me off. I'm making it my lifes mission to let everyone know what trash you are. Sorrowfulkiller took my money for an ECU on ebay and has run with it. Don't have any dealings with this guy.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...%3AIT
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...%3AIT
Re: (johngriff)
So this is the type of person you want to help your forum? Just trying to spread the good word on our boy here.
And no paypal does not mean you are getting money back. I've lost hundreds to people like this in the past. As soon as they pull the money out of their paypal account you can't get it back.
And no paypal does not mean you are getting money back. I've lost hundreds to people like this in the past. As soon as they pull the money out of their paypal account you can't get it back.
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sorrowfulkiller
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Re: Anyone use AEM EMS? (sorrowfulkiller)
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Modified by sorrowfulkiller at 4:57 PM 10/21/2009
Modified by sorrowfulkiller at 4:57 PM 10/21/2009
Greg, good to see you here. I was looking for a "report this thread" button... didn't want to just email you at random.
On the auction, it says it is covered.http://pages.ebay.com/paypal/buyer/protection.html
And you only purchased it on the 13th? Its only been 6 days, still lots of time for it to be shipped to you... or is this not the same auction?
On the auction, it says it is covered.http://pages.ebay.com/paypal/buyer/protection.html
And you only purchased it on the 13th? Its only been 6 days, still lots of time for it to be shipped to you... or is this not the same auction?
Re: (AZhitman)
I live in Austin now, used live near boston.
I hate to clog your board like this, but this guy has taken my money. I have tried to contact this guy through paypal, ebay, nasioc forum multiple times and no response. If some one stole $200 from you on the street you'd be livid and doing everything in your power to get it back. Even if the cops got it back a crime has still been committed. Like I said even with buyer protection I've gotten zero money back.
And sorrow come on..... Your not fooling anyone. Same screen name, same car, same city. I even emailed you two days ago through the email I found on your profile here with no response.
I don't think I am the only one he is scamming. His profile on Nasioc.com has been viewed 90 times today. I'd say other people are looking for him too.
I hate to clog your board like this, but this guy has taken my money. I have tried to contact this guy through paypal, ebay, nasioc forum multiple times and no response. If some one stole $200 from you on the street you'd be livid and doing everything in your power to get it back. Even if the cops got it back a crime has still been committed. Like I said even with buyer protection I've gotten zero money back.
And sorrow come on..... Your not fooling anyone. Same screen name, same car, same city. I even emailed you two days ago through the email I found on your profile here with no response.
I don't think I am the only one he is scamming. His profile on Nasioc.com has been viewed 90 times today. I'd say other people are looking for him too.
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sorrowfulkiller
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Re: (banzairx7)
Well... not only did I embarrass myself infront of the people of this site and make a fool out of myself, I ruined any credibility that I had in the process.
Yes I did try to "sell" my old Engine management to banzairx7 and I feel like a** for doing so. I have come in contact with him and want to and need to right the wrongs I have committed against this man. I wanted to let everyone know I'm in the process of getting this issue between us resolved.
That being said I feel like an a**
Modified by sorrowfulkiller at 6:56 PM 10/21/2009
Yes I did try to "sell" my old Engine management to banzairx7 and I feel like a** for doing so. I have come in contact with him and want to and need to right the wrongs I have committed against this man. I wanted to let everyone know I'm in the process of getting this issue between us resolved.
That being said I feel like an a**
Modified by sorrowfulkiller at 6:56 PM 10/21/2009
Re: (AZhitman)
Money has been refunded to my paypal account. Now paypal holds onto it for 7 days, sole purpose of holding the money is to earn interest IMO, then it goes back in my account.
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WDRacing
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Re: (johngriff)
If PayPal knows a way to make a % in 7 days, sign me the F up...lol.johngriff wrote:It couldn't be, interest rates are so low right now, there is no way they could earn money on it.. (financial industry joke)...
Good to hear everything got straightened out.
As well you should, I'm glad you handled it, but scamming people is a crimesorrowfulkiller wrote:That being said I feel like an a**
Re: (WDRacing)
Kind of off topic but I believe a big part of the Paypal business model is earning interest on the money going through the service. My $225 sitting there for seven days doesn't earn anything. Times that by a million other people and that interest adds up pretty quick. Also that pool of money is constantly refreshed as people send and receive money. They also hold money for 2-3 days before it goes to your bank account when you request it.
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WDRacing
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Re: (banzairx7)
True enough...
This thread is pretty far gone off topic...lol.
My personal feelings are that AEM EMS (which I've used) is an awsome plug n play standalone.
Haltech has been an industry leader for years, you don't get to say that without making a great product. I just have no practical experience with them.
This thread is pretty far gone off topic...lol.
My personal feelings are that AEM EMS (which I've used) is an awsome plug n play standalone.
Haltech has been an industry leader for years, you don't get to say that without making a great product. I just have no practical experience with them.
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redhb240SXS13
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Re: (WDRacing)
hey john does the haltech have any kind of launch control? I read through everything on the link you posted but i didnt see anything about it
Yes it does, my site is more geared towards people already familiar with the haltech, and we are just bringing out our own products.
Read more about the features of the haltech ECU here:http://www.haltech.com/index.p...id=77
The cool launch/ rpm control stuff is.
Rev Limiter, Soft and hard cut, Ignition or fuel, tripped at a defined by the user RPM.
Two Step, essentially a rev limiter, set up via your own custom switching solution. You set an input as two step, then wire that input with a switched ground. When you ground the circuit out, it activates the two step. From there your "activation" circuit can be anything you dream up.
Anti Lag, Oh mother yes may I have some more? Haltech's anti lag is fully tunable and one of the best, bear in mind, anti lag is for beefy motors and turbos, because by its nature it gets things uber hot.
Flat Shift: One of my personal favorite. I wire this to a toggle on/off switch and then to the clutch pedal switch, acts as a rev limiter between shifts, so I keep my foot planted on the gas the whole time. Keeps the turbo/engine loaded between shifts, creates huge intimidating fireballs, its the bees knees.
The AEM has been the only game in town, and people have been forced to use it. The nissan cas and oem ecu work by home window +/- tooth offset of the trigger.
So on the "home" signal, there are 4 windows(aka slots), each of these align with the tdc positions of each cylinder.
The "trigger" signal, is 360, and the ecu watches the trigger count after or before a consecutive home window to perform an event.
The event is "open injector 3ms cyl 3" or "fire ignition cyl 3". The injector open time is determined by the map, and the injector "angle" or timing of when it opens is calculated by the tooth offset from the home window. If you open the injector at the wrong time in the stroke, the fuel will pool on the valve.
Same goes for ignition, angle determined by the map, and counted off the trigger signal.
The haltech ECU reads the Nissan CAS EXACTLY like the OEM ecu.
The AEM, requires that you change the cas wheel for the lower resolution wheel. Because of its lower resolution, the AEM is using a theory called Home + Rate of accel. The aem picks up the home window signal, then calculate the rate of acceleration in the engine, to guesstimate the exact angle to trigger fuel and ignition events.
And because, SO many other things can happen to a performance engine than just accelerating flat out, predictably, the AEM invariably makes ignition and fuel errors, when delivering fuel this way. That is my BIGGEST BEEF. Other wise I would sell AEM's too.
The other thing I don't like about AEM is the software, its a little Fast and the Furious for me, Halwin and Ecu manager are solid, straight forward, and stable.
You can DL them for free from haltechs site:Halwin: http://www.haltech.com/downloads/halwin_1.89.zipECU Manager: http://files.haltech.com/downl...e.zip
John
Read more about the features of the haltech ECU here:http://www.haltech.com/index.p...id=77
The cool launch/ rpm control stuff is.
Rev Limiter, Soft and hard cut, Ignition or fuel, tripped at a defined by the user RPM.
Two Step, essentially a rev limiter, set up via your own custom switching solution. You set an input as two step, then wire that input with a switched ground. When you ground the circuit out, it activates the two step. From there your "activation" circuit can be anything you dream up.
Anti Lag, Oh mother yes may I have some more? Haltech's anti lag is fully tunable and one of the best, bear in mind, anti lag is for beefy motors and turbos, because by its nature it gets things uber hot.
Flat Shift: One of my personal favorite. I wire this to a toggle on/off switch and then to the clutch pedal switch, acts as a rev limiter between shifts, so I keep my foot planted on the gas the whole time. Keeps the turbo/engine loaded between shifts, creates huge intimidating fireballs, its the bees knees.
The AEM has been the only game in town, and people have been forced to use it. The nissan cas and oem ecu work by home window +/- tooth offset of the trigger.
So on the "home" signal, there are 4 windows(aka slots), each of these align with the tdc positions of each cylinder.
The "trigger" signal, is 360, and the ecu watches the trigger count after or before a consecutive home window to perform an event.
The event is "open injector 3ms cyl 3" or "fire ignition cyl 3". The injector open time is determined by the map, and the injector "angle" or timing of when it opens is calculated by the tooth offset from the home window. If you open the injector at the wrong time in the stroke, the fuel will pool on the valve.
Same goes for ignition, angle determined by the map, and counted off the trigger signal.
The haltech ECU reads the Nissan CAS EXACTLY like the OEM ecu.
The AEM, requires that you change the cas wheel for the lower resolution wheel. Because of its lower resolution, the AEM is using a theory called Home + Rate of accel. The aem picks up the home window signal, then calculate the rate of acceleration in the engine, to guesstimate the exact angle to trigger fuel and ignition events.
And because, SO many other things can happen to a performance engine than just accelerating flat out, predictably, the AEM invariably makes ignition and fuel errors, when delivering fuel this way. That is my BIGGEST BEEF. Other wise I would sell AEM's too.
The other thing I don't like about AEM is the software, its a little Fast and the Furious for me, Halwin and Ecu manager are solid, straight forward, and stable.
You can DL them for free from haltechs site:Halwin: http://www.haltech.com/downloads/halwin_1.89.zipECU Manager: http://files.haltech.com/downl...e.zip
John