Q45 swaybar

[GuidoInc]

I've seen some talk on here about getting a swaybar for a Q45 from salvage yard. I've have a 96 plain vanilla Q45. What should I look for? Does my Q have a swaybar and the replacement would be a larger diameter? Thanks all.

[PalmerWMD]

Moved to Infiniti general..

Fred..

[PalmerWMD]

Your base Q has a front (anti-) swaybar, but not a rear (anti-) sway bar.

If you find a "a" or "t" 90-96 Q45 you can get the RSB off it and attach it to your cars supension for less body lean, in many driving situations

Fred..

[elwesso]

You can order one from Joe at scottsdale, which includes ALL bolts and rubber pieces, brand new for $260......

Im going to do one to mine someday......

Basically all you can do to the front is add a strut tower brace..... Stillen sells one for like $100 (maybe more, cant remember), or you can get a cheap maxima bar off ebay and modify it to work with the Q..... Works good!!!!

[Q45tech]

The oem front bar on all standard Q is 29 mm in diameter, the oem rear bars are designed assumming that the front bar diameter is REDUCED to the 28 mm version used on "T" and "Active" Q.Why just adding the 15.9 mm rear "t" bar does little good without the 13% reduction in front roll bar stiffness [the total springs plus bar drops by 6.5% at max roll = 3.5"].

Hard to feel a 6-7% rear increase in Net total stiffness from a 15.9 mm bar, HARDER yet to just feel a 3% change without the smaller front bar] but a 20-25% rear increase from the 20 mm bar is noticeable...........but more noticeable with the smaller front bar.

The ideal [aggressive] rear bar size is 22mm [with a 28 mm front bar] but that doesn't exist.

The rear bars are rubber isolated [mounts and end links] so little happens in the 1st inch till all the rubber compresses. Why the above numbers are not 10% and 33%.

Nothing wrong with front body roll since the upper link compensates for tire camber changes........if the tires can stand it [sidewall stiffness].

See the 6.5% from the front reduction and the 6.5% from the rear addition make a 13% shift towards the rear but 13% of say 75% [forward bias] is not much ~~ say 67% and the 20mm addition gets you to 61-62% forward stiifness ratio with a 54% front vehicle weight.................7-8% above the critical level [when dry is neutral steering]........enough to still be safe in rain and power on curves at 0.55G lateral [if the tires can handle it].

[elwesso]

So basically the rear bar does little???? Or at least not worth the $260 from scottsdale??

[Q45tech]

You can buy either/all bars from Scottsdale, most people chose the larger diameter 20mm ACTIVE REAR bar to purchase..............which is a significant increase the rear oem stiffness [ 25%>32.5% if installed and coupled correctly].

You can also purchase the smaller diameter front bar and center support bushings. For the further 6.5% change most people skip this step as it is counterintuitive and they don't understand the benefits.

Active cars are rarer in the junk yards since only 15% of total 90-94Q were sold in US with that option [maybe 9,000 were sold].

Balancing the chassis: changing the gross understeer more towards neutral is MUCH MUCH MORE EFFECTIVE THAN 1-1.5" LOWERING SPRINGS which tend to carry/maintain the understeer rato except at the extremes and are aburpt [progressive] in the last 1" of rear compression.

[fxjackso]

I have the 28/20 setup, with poly bushings and shimmed rubber endlinks. Also front black, rear blue Tokicos, and stock springs. It's a different car than stock. The only negative is that it can be bumpy on secondary roads as the bars don't have the dead zone to absorb bumps on one side of the car before they twist. But it's worth it.

[Q45tech]

The 24 mm solid [not available new anymore Stillen] rear bar could be manipulated to have the "dead zone" by using one or two rubber [out of 4] [urethane bushings supplied] on each end link.One inch of wheel movement translated to 1/4" of movement at the endlink attachment point so 1/8"/2= 1/16" of variable rubber squish per bushing..............hard to get right , harder to keep right but a pleasure between the weekly adjustment periods...........Perfection is hard to achieve and harder to maintain.

Hate the way Nissan chose to attach the bars [changed on the 2002 Q/M]...........not really stable in adjustments as the precision required was just too great for most ........a quarter of a turn on a nut was radical change!

Gives me something to do each week, tweek the bars to compensate for changes in the bushings......temperature and wear.

The rear sway is designed to warn/stop non professional drivers from out driving the tires they chose.A properly adjusted set of bars should be feelable in transistion, you should be able to feel the bars load up and resist the sway in even a 10degree change of steering wheel [the 90-92 rack ratio] maybe 15 degrees in the 94 and later racks.

[maxnix]

One inch of wheel movement translated to 1/4" of movement at the endlink attachment point so 1/8"/2= 1/16" of variable rubber squish per bushing..............hard to get right , harder to keep right but a pleasure between the weekly adjustment periods...........Perfection is hard to achieve and harder to maintain.

Hate the way Nissan chose to attach the bars [changed on the 2002 Q/M]...........not really stable in adjustments as the precision required was just too great for most ........a quarter of a turn on a nut was radical change!

So as I am intending to install an a 20mm anti-sway bar next week, is there a specific torque to which the end link nuts should be tightened, or is it sufficient that they are even?

[AZhitman]

Stop the presses!!!

Anyone interested in a 22-24mm rear bar (like the one Stillen used to produce)?

I have a source, just need to check to see what the demand would be for one, manufactured by a company that's been doing suspension modifications since before Steve Millen got his learner's permit....

Let me know and I'll get it going.

[elwesso]

Id be interested in one....... What price are we looking at, because Im not sure Id go much over what Joe's kit is....

[Q45tech]

Even I would be interested in a REAR 22.22 mm [7/8"] hollow bar, that followed precisely the oem shape...........and sold for $100 without end links................to save money and uses existing standard size [7/8"] after market rubber bushings and center mounts.

This combo with oem springs would increase the rear stiffness by 48.7-50% on a 3 " roll reducing a 3.5" sway to 2.2".With rear Eibachs it would reduce to 1.9".......Significant. yet still streetable unlike the 24 mm solid bar.

[elwesso]

If its Q45tech-worthy, then you know its good!!!!!

[1qckser]

Im also interested, please keep us posted.

[AZhitman]

Dennis - I'll consult with you before I have it manufactured... Email me a number I can reach you at if you don't mind.

Who made the 24mm solid bar you referenced, Dennis?

[maxnix]

Who made the 24mm solid bar you referenced, Dennis?

Stillen sold it and it was solid.
Modified by maxnix at 9:55 AM 1/27/2007

[Q45tech]

Have one [24mm] sitting out in the back yard. This was part of my first Stillen/Goldrush upgrade to the Q back in 1994.................drove with it [in various assorted couplings] till 1999 when I downgraded to the 20 mm rear bar! Toyed with the 15.9 mm one for 2 days, along the way.

It would be great if someone had the facilities to actually measure the 20 mm rear bar stiffness [alone and as oem mounted]...........instead of relying on my mathematical approximations and some simple tests I did years ago.!

My 160 pounds per bar inch [20mm oem] could be wrong by 10-20%.

Unfourtunately because Nissan chose the mid point lower rear arm and perpendicular/ endlink mounting method.......there doesn't seem to be the room to triple drill the 6" arm [5,6,7"] [+20, zero, -14% correction] for adjustablity.....the angles would be difficult with urethane and rubber defeats the purpose.

So we must get the bar diameter/arm length perfect, unfortunately everyone idea of just right is different, as Stillen found out with the maximal 24 mm solid bar.

[Jeff Williams]

Is $95.00 a good deal for a "a" rear sway bar, with all the mounting hardware, from a junk yard?

[AZhitman]

Not bad, considering the rarity.

[Jeff Williams]

I have requested the front sway bar, as well, since Dennis says this is a good balanced application.

Thanks!

[maxnix]

I have requested the front sway bar, as well, since Dennis says this is a good balanced application.

I believe it is the front t model bar he recommends.

EDIT: Corrected below to both a & t front bars are the same. Thanks, Dennis._________________________Brian1995 Q45 & Q45t & 2000 Q45

Discover the power of the button!

[Q45tech]

Both .......active and t .........cars use the same reduced diameter [28 mm] front sway bar!28/29=0.9655172^4 power=0.869 or 13% less stiff

Since the bar does little in 1st inch of body roll then at most 146 x 2=292 pounds of resistance in next 2 " combined we are speaking of maybe 38-40 pounds of reduced resistance to body roll............you won't notice it in body angle but can feel it slightly in the steering angle.

6.5% less steering turn in required [in theory].

Order new bushings for bars as the exposure to the junkyard [and air in general] degrades them after 4 years or so.

[szh]

Goldrush upgrade to the Q back in 1994.................

Now there is a name that I recall from the past! Is Goldrush Engineering still in existence?

Z

[Jeff Williams]

I got the rear "Q45a" bar from the junkyard, but the front was "unavailable". From pics of the car, it looks like the front was damaged in the collission.

I have new bushings on order from Joe for the front, and will get the rears, as soon as I get the bar, to see what is needed. (I have an assortment of Poly bushings around the house from my "racing" days).

New "blues" are on their way, as well.

I decided to forgoe the Eibach's, ans spend the extra $200 on repairs.

[Chrisfrend]

If a stiffer rear bar is unavailable for my 97 touring model, would replacing some or all of the bushings on the connecting rod to the rear stabilizer bar with urethane ones help limit body roll around corners? The service manual seems to indicate that the stock bushings are all rubber.

[Q45tech]

The rear end link bushings might compress 1/16 x 4 or 1/4" so a 3.5" body roll thru the midpoint of the lower arm might move the bar 0.875" less the 1/4" of bushing compression.

So instead of 160 pounds of resistance [if solid 20mm welded in place] the rubber might only allow 120 pounds and urethane might achieve 140-150 pounds.

Since the urethane bar will be active at even a 1/4"-1" bump vs the slop in the rubber the action will be felt........that's the purpose of the rubber bushings to isolate bumps up to 1.0"

[nuQ]

HITMAN,,,,I'D DEFINITELY BE INTERESTED IF YOU CAN DO IT, LET ME KNOW THE PRICE, AND EMAIL ME! JEFF

[AZhitman]

That's been a while... I need to get back on that project (among the 300 other projects I have going...)

I had promised someone my 15mm bar and can't remember who.

[ponzy]

Do you guys mind if I ask what happens to the project?.....this thread is verry interesting with RE: improving suspension and handling, might as well be considered if any front end suspension repairs' on schedule, right?>>>> still reading about suspension, i wanna get the most of repairing my front end (noise --- prolly spring, tension rod bushings, end links - might also consider a poly bushings in front? ) How bout this links about aftermarket 2 front swar bar link?:a.) http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...62596

b.) http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...sting

>>>> don't know if its just a regular rubber bushings included or there's something stiffer bushings available right now for 94 Q45.

>>>>thanks in advance, any reply will be highly apppreciated...

......wow it's been almost past 3 years now.....