Timing belt change difficulty?

The Nissan 300ZX (Z32) general community discussion forum
hacyec
Posts: 148
Joined: Sun Jul 01, 2007 3:45 am
Car: 91 300ZX

Post

hey guys, i have to do the timing belt on my car so i figure i would change the pullys and tentioner as well, how hard is it to do for someone whos never done it before? also the dealership told me I'd have to change the seals too, what would that be? How much am i looking to pay for everything?


User avatar
NolimitZ32
Posts: 7112
Joined: Fri Jun 27, 2008 9:07 am
Car: 91 AG2 2+0 TTMT swap/E39 BMW 540i6/E53 4.6is Dinan S3
Location: Houston, TX

Post

You don't have to change the seals but as long as your in there you may as well change the cam seals, you have to remove the cam gears to get to the seals, its not too bad thought, however seeing as how you have never done a timing belt before I'd try to find someone experienced to supervise you and before you touch anything read through the engine mechanical/timing belt section of the FSM.

hacyec
Posts: 148
Joined: Sun Jul 01, 2007 3:45 am
Car: 91 300ZX

Post

ive never understood seals, in my mind when i think seal i think tape lol no worries though not going to use tape on a z. where would i buy the seals? would the engine have to be pulled to do this?

User avatar
NolimitZ32
Posts: 7112
Joined: Fri Jun 27, 2008 9:07 am
Car: 91 AG2 2+0 TTMT swap/E39 BMW 540i6/E53 4.6is Dinan S3
Location: Houston, TX

Post

You don't have to pull the engine, http://www.300zx-twinturbo.com/cgi-bin/manual.cgigot to engine mechanical then to page 13.

as far as the oil seals, i'm not sure if you have to pull the upper plenum off, I donth think you do but dont quote me.

User avatar
BigTDogg (MA)
Posts: 4322
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2007 8:26 am
Car: 1990 300ZX Twin Turbo
Location: Boston MA

Post

No need to remove the upper or lower plenum for a 60k or 120k service.

There are 5 seals on the front of the engine. One for each cam and one on the crankshaft behind the timing sprocket.

A 60K service (timing belt job) is not terribly involved, but it is intimidating your first time through it. Definitely reach out to a local more experienced Zer to help.

TTZofD's Tech Article. A good supplement to the link NolimitZ32 provided

A good place to get the 60K parts.

Personally, I'd only recommend OEM parts. It's a fairly involved job, so do it once every 60k and do it right, IMO. I'd get the silicone hoses for the water bypass as well.

Replace those once and reuse them for your 120k service. Silicone will never go bad.

If you can follow directions and you're not scared of working on your car, it's not a difficult job if you have the tools, time and patience.

hacyec
Posts: 148
Joined: Sun Jul 01, 2007 3:45 am
Car: 91 300ZX

Post

Would this be the best time to do a pully kit as well?

hacyec
Posts: 148
Joined: Sun Jul 01, 2007 3:45 am
Car: 91 300ZX

Post

Or is there any other performance type things to install at this point? I already have a Nismo therm in there already.

User avatar
es.biggs
Posts: 2120
Joined: Sat Feb 20, 2010 10:32 am
Car: 1990 300ZX 5sp NA
Location: Charlotte, NC

Post

The kits you buy for timing belts usually include a thermostat. Everything is easier to reach with the radiator and fan out. You have to remove all the accessory belts (alt, power steering, fan) to do the timing belt, so that would be a great time to do the pulley kit.

Make sure you use the overdrive water pump pulley along with the underdrive crank pulley to avoid a diminish in cooling efficiency.

I think the main difference in the 60k and 120k kits are the idler pulleys. That is, the pulleys that the timing belt wraps around. They are expensive, but it's something you do once and your done (unless your car is still going at 240k.) The extra money for the pulleys is definitely CHEAP insurance to prevent engine failure. If a pulley fails, your timing could go off, and most likely your engine would be toast.

So if it comes down to money issues, just make sure you at least do what is in that kit BigTDogg posted up before you do pulleys, or other performance mods. Don't skimp out on this part man! Stuff is wayyyy important.

User avatar
Z-owned
Posts: 3487
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2008 8:56 pm
Car: 93 N/A Z32
90 VW Corrado
01 mr2 spyder
Location: Auburn, WA.

Post

I did my pully's when I did my 120k easy since the stock ones have to come off anyway. The 120k job is alot easier than it looks mainly just alot of having to remove parts to get to the timing belt. The tt.net write up is a very good write up to follow. Nissan also made things easy by putting timing marks on the belts which helps alot with making sure everything stays lined up right. You can see them in this pic I took when I did mine.


Z31toZ32
Posts: 1673
Joined: Fri May 23, 2008 12:43 am
Car: 1999 Infinity QX4
Location: Denver, CO

Post

yeah all the tm belt failures ive heard of are snapped idler pulleys and the whole thing comes off track. rameyz makes a reinforced idler pulley combo - http://www.conceptzperformance...0&UID=

hacyec
Posts: 148
Joined: Sun Jul 01, 2007 3:45 am
Car: 91 300ZX

Post

BigTDogg (MA) wrote:
A good place to get the 60K parts.
Doesn't the concept Z version give you more bang for you buck:

http://www.conceptzperformance...12.42

User avatar
Z-owned
Posts: 3487
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2008 8:56 pm
Car: 93 N/A Z32
90 VW Corrado
01 mr2 spyder
Location: Auburn, WA.

Post

I would make sure to get new idler pulleys with whatever kit you get. It's not worth taking the risk with the old ones.

User avatar
nissanracer300zx
Posts: 93
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2008 2:19 pm

Post

hacyec wrote:hey guys, i have to do the timing belt on my car so i figure i would change the pullys and tentioner as well, how hard is it to do for someone whos never done it before? also the dealership told me I'd have to change the seals too, what would that be? How much am i looking to pay for everything?
Its easy as long as you have the parts the original timing belt.You dont have to change the seals..if its not leaking dont change it.The reason the Dealership told is because they just rip off peoples money by telling them "oh your going to need this and this and this' which is not necessary.

User avatar
nissanracer300zx
Posts: 93
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2008 2:19 pm

Post

Z-owned wrote:I did my pully's when I did my 120k easy since the stock ones have to come off anyway. The 120k job is alot easier than it looks mainly just alot of having to remove parts to get to the timing belt. The tt.net write up is a very good write up to follow. Nissan also made things easy by putting timing marks on the belts which helps alot with making sure everything stays lined up right. You can see them in this pic I took when I did mine.
Hello how did you get all the cam pulleys to stay in place with the timing marks when you installed the timing belt?I lined up the cam pulleys and crankshaft to all the timing marks and installed the belt, but what happend is that the cam pulleys moved out of alignment with from the timing marks.

Did you use a cam pulley tool to hold in place the cam pulleys?

User avatar
Z-owned
Posts: 3487
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2008 8:56 pm
Car: 93 N/A Z32
90 VW Corrado
01 mr2 spyder
Location: Auburn, WA.

Post

I used the old belt to keep them from turning well putting the new one on. The timing marks on the dust cover on the back aren't important though as long as the sprocket marks line up with the belt, I just kind of set mine that way since I like everything tdc when possible.

User avatar
nissanracer300zx
Posts: 93
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2008 2:19 pm

Post

Z-owned wrote:I used the old belt to keep them from turning well putting the new one on. The timing marks on the dust cover on the back aren't important though as long as the sprocket marks line up with the belt, I just kind of set mine that way since I like everything tdc when possible.
I see..Okhow did you use the old belt too hold the cam pulleys?have you used the tool that holds the cam pulleys in place?

User avatar
Z-owned
Posts: 3487
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2008 8:56 pm
Car: 93 N/A Z32
90 VW Corrado
01 mr2 spyder
Location: Auburn, WA.

Post

Never used the tool to hold it in place though it would make it easier. I just used the old belt wrapped around one and applying force in the opposite direction it wants to turn well lining all the others up. Once they are all lined up the belt is still loose enought to slide the old one off and making sure that mark is still in the right spot before letting the screw out of the auto tensioner to fully tighten the belt on.

DokkTekk
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu May 20, 2010 8:29 am
Car: 1990 300zx NA - 5 speed
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Post

Yea I'm on the same boat. 18k miles to go and she needs 120k service. I can hear the cam sprockets so they're gonna need replacing as well. So basically I'm looking at about $900 more or less for parts. I'm a little nervous about tackling this job since getting the timing/alignment right is crucial. I've done most of the maintenance on my Z but never did this one before. What is the usual price for labor on this? I'm willing to give it a shot if I manage to get someone knowledgeable to lend a helping hand.

User avatar
Z-owned
Posts: 3487
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2008 8:56 pm
Car: 93 N/A Z32
90 VW Corrado
01 mr2 spyder
Location: Auburn, WA.

Post

DokkTekk wrote:Yea I'm on the same boat. 18k miles to go and she needs 120k service. I can hear the cam sprockets so they're gonna need replacing as well. So basically I'm looking at about $900 more or less for parts. I'm a little nervous about tackling this job since getting the timing/alignment right is crucial. I've done most of the maintenance on my Z but never did this one before. What is the usual price for labor on this? I'm willing to give it a shot if I manage to get someone knowledgeable to lend a helping hand.
Get Keith to come over and help you when you are ready to put the belt on if your worried about it not lining up properly. It's really not that difficult though, doing my friends mr2 imo was harder than the z's. The Z just sucks cause there is so much crap to remove first.

User avatar
tg
Posts: 3090
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2006 7:15 am

Post

hacyec wrote:ive never understood seals, in my mind when i think seal i think tape lol no worries though not going to use tape on a z. where would i buy the seals? would the engine have to be pulled to do this?
seals are rubber seals that go behind the cam gears... Anyways, http://www.conceptzperformance.com/Cart ... ype=NIS300

that + the amount of labor they're gonna charge you... If you've already done this job before, you're talking 3, maybe 4 hours to do the whole thing, assuming no surprises. First time will be a bit longer, could easily be twice as long.


take off the fan shroud and fan (15 minutes including the 'standing around just looking at it/having a beer' period)
drain the coolant system (5-10 minutes, 20 if you have to clean up all the coolant that went all over the floor)
take off all accesory belts (2-5 minutes if you have a good set of wire cutters)
move the PTU off to the side, unplug the cas and the coolant temp sensors (5-10 minutes)
remove the timing belt covers (5-10 minutes)
remove the timing belt and tensionners, pulleys (20-30 minutes)
remove the coolant hardpipes, thermostat, water pump, crank pully, crank gear (45-60 minutes)
(total removal: 1.5 hours - 2.5 hours)

put it back together with the new stuff. (2 - 3.0 hours depending on how many times you have to re-align the timing belt to get it right, heh)


Not sure what Nissan charges to do it, but its likely 8-10 hours or so.

User avatar
raremotive
Posts: 3581
Joined: Sun Oct 07, 2007 8:54 pm
Car: 04 G35
Location: Stuck in the middle.

Post

FSM is always handy to have around. Even the pros keep them around.

DokkTekk
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu May 20, 2010 8:29 am
Car: 1990 300zx NA - 5 speed
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Post

He's really busy though and he's way too far, not fair for him to drive down my way and I sure isn't going to drive up Acton. Just not a practical thing. A couple of questions: 1) Once all lines are aligned on the t-belt and cam sprockets, how do you tighten the sprockets down using the old t-belt? 2) How do you remove the darn crankshaft timing sprocket?
Z-owned wrote:
DokkTekk wrote:Yea I'm on the same boat. 18k miles to go and she needs 120k service. I can hear the cam sprockets so they're gonna need replacing as well. So basically I'm looking at about $900 more or less for parts. I'm a little nervous about tackling this job since getting the timing/alignment right is crucial. I've done most of the maintenance on my Z but never did this one before. What is the usual price for labor on this? I'm willing to give it a shot if I manage to get someone knowledgeable to lend a helping hand.
Get Keith to come over and help you when you are ready to put the belt on if your worried about it not lining up properly. It's really not that difficult though, doing my friends mr2 imo was harder than the z's. The Z just sucks cause there is so much crap to remove first.

Nismo686
Posts: 112
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 4:31 pm
Car: 1991 Fairlady Z32 Twin Turbo 2+2
1998 Pathfinder R50

Post

Book time is 6.3 hours with water pump and all seals. Which should most definately be done everytime your in there. I dont mean too be the only negative person in here but by reading the comments in here I would advise that most of you not even attemp it because it sounds way above your heads. Start saving to pay someone to do it for the sake of the car you love.

User avatar
BigTDogg (MA)
Posts: 4322
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2007 8:26 am
Car: 1990 300ZX Twin Turbo
Location: Boston MA

Post



Return to “300ZX (Z32) General”