Mckinney Motorsports RB Swap Kit

[datdude407]

http://mckinneymotorsports.com/prod_300zx+RB+SWAP
I saw that they have an kit now. I have heard in the past that there kits for the rb25/6 for the s13 were less than par. I personally had a s13 with a rb20 with all of their products (motor mounts, downpipe, intercooler and radiator). If i decide to get rid of the NA VG, I may consider this. Anyone know about the quality of the of their rb 25/6 parts?

[DCaff300ZX]

Interesting...but the mounting tabs for the intercoolers looked pretty ragged so it makes me wonder.

[PAintballa45]

mckinney is a pretty reliable source, far as my knowledge goes. my buddy actually just picked up an rb25 in hopes of doing this swap. after an oem rebuild with larger injectors, turbo, and a clean body he was over $10k in parts without including the full exhaust or suspension. Needless to say hes looking into an sr 240 haha

[300ZXttZMAN]

Hmm very interesting the intercooler mounts do look a little shotty.

Def something the NA guys should look into when their NA VG quits on them.

[TTkickedin]

I'd look into it, and I have a twin turbo! ^

i'd so rock a RB25 in my z. All day long.

I'll swap the vg30dett in a go kart if i do My buddy has a gixxer kart looking for a new engine sooner or lata.

[TTkickedin]

What Mckinney should do is fabricate the crossmember necessary and work on a core basis and provide those as well. 500 is NOT bad.

500 for the kit, then you need a crossmember, RB engine, rb bellhousing (buy a trashed transmission,) RB ecu, rb to vg engine harness, and pretty much all set? That's a 3000 dollar swap right there if you do the work yourself.

Curious if the rb works with the 300zx gauge cluster?

[Z-owned]

Good luck at doing it for anywhere close to 3k.

[TTkickedin]

Anywhere close to 3k? certainly.

rb25det engine only = 900 http://www.jdmtigerjapanese.com/nissan- ... ts-93.html

z32 or rb ecu + nistune = 1000 (can run rb25 off vg30dett ecu, which either you should have OR can be had around 150-200.) and a new Nistune license would cost 700 installed or less.

rb25det bellhousing = 300 http://www.rawbrokerage.com/RB25DET-Man ... ousing.htm

vg to RB wiring harness = 500 from wiring specialties.

We'll call it zero, since it's just cutting and rewelding. Or maybe 10 bucks for a spool of welding rod, assuming you have argon/c02 for your welder and other necessities of welding.

the kit from them = 500

Sounds like you can do it for around 3200 to me, actually.

factoring shipping in, it has to be closer to 3500ish... but still, you said close to 3k. which, that still seems to be pretty close to me. And this isn't items on classifieds either, which tend to be cheaper.

[TTkickedin]

...though tiger japanese pays for shipping anyway...

[PAintballa45]

i dno about just dropping in a JDM motor after all of the custom stuff. You forgot to add in the radiator / mounting, intercooler piping, trans support, driveshaft and downpipe eli

edit: when my buddy called mckinney they told him you need a custom intake manifold aswell because the cold pipe goes over the motor, it will not clear the hood even with their mounts. big bucks.

[Z-owned]

Lol like I said good luck being anywhere near that price. Every rb swap in a z32 i have seen ended up costing thousands more than the person expected even with them doing the work and fabrication. As for tiger Japanese they suck and that is all I have to say about them....

[TTkickedin]

i dno about just dropping in a JDM motor after all of the custom stuff. You forgot to add in the radiator / mounting, intercooler piping, trans support, driveshaft and downpipe eli

edit: when my buddy called mckinney they told him you need a custom intake manifold aswell because the cold pipe goes over the motor, it will not clear the hood even with their mounts. big bucks.

Sounds like a 3k (+-) based on skill level. i feeel that this is what you all are prodding at.

Sounds like a 5-6k swap with a moderate skill level.

Sounds like 8-15k if you don't know jack s*** about welding, or cars period and go to a shop and have it done for you.

*** Implied below, is best case scenario cost-wise: The would-be RB swapped 300zx owner is a very skilled fabricator with access to the lowest cost merchandise. get's amazing deals on scrap metal and tubing. Has a plasma cutter/mig/tig, knows how to weld various metals accordingly, knows how to make adapter plates (not hard to make one anyway.)

if you are not the above, do not consider doing an RB swap for anywhere close to 3k. (Anywhere close to 3k means below 4k.)**

However, at that level, one would wonder why a skilled fabricator would want to go cheap anyway.. but for the sake of argument:


Radiator : used TT radiator will cool a low power RB engine. Fabricate the inlet and outlet to match rb's location, or find a cheapo skyline radiator off ebay. 100 on the classifieds? (bad idea, but good enough.)

driveshaft : This can be made at home, if going with RB transmission, probably shorter than the vg's driveshaft, so all you need to do is shorten it. (didn't i mention BAD idea to go cheap?) if not, the fabricator knows what tubing to make a driveshaft out of, and what yokes to use on either end.

If it's a vg 5 speed to an rb26, no driveshaft shortening would be necessary, most likely. Don't quote me on this. I have no idea, just going off a hunch based on: same transmission means same transmission mount, stock mounting locaiton. Also means the same z32 TWIN TURBO clutch, NA clutch will not hold this power.

Also means: an adapter plate to the RBXX. Plate of steel at a junkyard, 5 bucks? drilling holes, zero, doesn't everyone own a drill?

Adapter plate means a 1/4 inch (+-) forward mounting rb engine. Well, massage Mckinney's kit to fit..

Downpipe/transmission brace: no transmission brace necessary if using a z32 transmission. Metal tubing off ebay or a local home depot and another 10 bucks for welding rods: 110 at the most to create the downpipe and a tubular manifold.

if RB transmission, scratch massaging the mckinney kit, fabricate transmission brace out of scrap metal.

Who says you need a custom intake manifold? the RB works well with it's OEM manifold, so...

...Cut the hood, put a DIY cowl over it = problem solved, probably costs nothing to do. Mr. Skilled fabricator guy might even be able to fabricate one for the price of some aluminum sheeting and maybe some more welding rods.




It CAN be done for close to 3k, if you're a very skilled fabricator. If not, and you want it done right, 5-6k at the least.

[z32pilot62]

Anywhere close to 3k? certainly.

rb25det engine only = 900 http://www.jdmtigerjapanese.com/nissan- ... ts-93.html

z32 or rb ecu + nistune = 1000 (can run rb25 off vg30dett ecu, which either you should have OR can be had around 150-200.) and a new Nistune license would cost 700 installed or less.

rb25det bellhousing = 300 http://www.rawbrokerage.com/RB25DET-Man ... ousing.htm

vg to RB wiring harness = 500 from wiring specialties.

We'll call it zero, since it's just cutting and rewelding. Or maybe 10 bucks for a spool of welding rod, assuming you have argon/c02 for your welder and other necessities of welding.

the kit from them = 500

Sounds like you can do it for around 3200 to me, actually.

factoring shipping in, it has to be closer to 3500ish... but still, you said close to 3k. which, that still seems to be pretty close to me. And this isn't items on classifieds either, which tend to be cheaper.

You left out maintenance in that little estimate there... Figure in another 1k+ to get all the maintenance up to date, it is a JDM motor mind you so you should treat it like any other JDM motor.

I'm in the middle of an RB swap on my Z and for less than $500 I can and will make my own mounts. I'm going to use a single SMIC on the drivers side to do all my boost cooling with either a GS or Ash IC, should be plenty for my particular motor. So far I'm about a grand in before any fitting has been done and I still don't have gaskets, timing set, water pump, exhaust manifold studs, oil pump, bell housing for the conversion, or exhaust figured out. All of that will be close to 2k when all said and done. This number still doesn't include IC's and piping... I'm doing the wiring myself as its about 7 wires and I'm using the Z32 ecu so everything will work as factory. When I'm done I should be close to 4k. There are always bound to be hick-ups in any well laid out plan and I get that, but I'm still trying to do it as cleanly/quality as possible on a low budget just to say it can be done.

[bartZ32tt]

I'd guess about 8k MINIMUM. Don't forget, the rb is longer than the vg so you need an undermounted radiator - the stock one wont fit. You'll also need custom intake/intercooler piping, driveshaft, exhaust, etc as well as no-brainer maintenance items like full timing belt kit, misc gaskets, clutch/flywheel kit, wiring harnesses, etc. It boggles my mind why anyone would consider this for anything other than just to be different..the vg30dett is a very capable engine, and at $8k you could've bought a built longblock, brand new turbos, tuning, and supporting mods needed to get 550hp+. The $8k you spent for the RB was just to get a STOCK RB in the engine bay running. Woop-dee-do.

[z32pilot62]

Don't forget, the rb is longer than the vg so you need an undermounted radiator - the stock one wont fit.

NOT true, it all depends on how you mount the motor.

You'll also need custom intake/intercooler piping, driveshaft, exhaust, etc as well as no-brainer maintenance items like full timing belt kit, misc gaskets, clutch/flywheel kit, wiring harnesses, etc.

If going from NA to TT intake and IC piping is a moot point... Have you seen where an RB20/25 factory intake pipes for the turbo and manifold end up? It is almost perfectly in the OEM TT orientation so one could get away with using OEM TT pipes. R32's were single SMIC...
Driveshaft again depends on how you mount the motor, DOES NOT have to change.
Again going from NA to TT exhaust will have to change atleast the front half and with that I COULD leave my rear half of my factory exhaust as well on an RB so, moot point...
Maintenance items, moot point agian, will need those with a TT swap too...
Wiring is not that difficult if you do a little research, it is literally depinning about 5 wires and switching them around, and adding 2 to the RB harness and it will run on the Z32 ecu.

TT swapping an NA is not cheap either but everyone seems to want to try and justify that it is "cheaper" when in reality it would end up costing me about the same as this RB swap that I am undertaking just to get a Factory TT motor in the car. Now going from TT to RB yes that is definitely working in reverse.

[bartZ32tt]

Don't forget, the rb is longer than the vg so you need an undermounted radiator - the stock one wont fit.

NOT true, it all depends on how you mount the motor.

OHRLY? Explain how you plan to route the water lines when it's crammed in between the upper radiator support and the engine. The rb is a much longer motor - a straight 6 vs a v6. Guarantee you need an undermounted radiator unless you feel like hacking the front or rear of the engine bay. notice how far back into the firewall that engine is. Also notice the throttle body/intake piping being in the way of the stock vg radiator.

If going from NA to TT intake and IC piping is a moot point... Have you seen where an RB20/25 factory intake pipes for the turbo and manifold end up? It is almost perfectly in the OEM TT orientation so one could get away with using OEM TT pipes. R32's were single SMIC...

This argument only applies when going from vgtt-rb - no existing intercooler piping to use when going na-rb. And even then, you'd still have to choose either the hot side or cold side to custom fabricate and you'd still be stuck with a frankensteined pos single side mount intercooler. Not really sure what argument you're trying to make here but my point is far from "moot"...

Driveshaft again depends on how you mount the motor, DOES NOT have to change.

Proof, please. You can only mount an rb25 in a z32 so many ways. Most people would try to mount the motor as far rear-ward as possible for better weight balance/distribution rather than trying to preserve the stock driveshaft.

Again going from NA to TT exhaust will have to change atleast the front half and with that I COULD leave my rear half of my factory exhaust as well on an RB so, moot point...

Moot? It would still leave you with the task of creating a one-off piece vs choosing from a selection of new or used exhausts that'll fit like a glove. I guarantee I could find a used vg30dett exhaust for cheaper than what you could make a custom rb25-z32 one for.

Wiring is not that difficult if you do a little research, it is literally depinning about 5 wires and switching them around, and adding 2 to the RB harness and it will run on the Z32 ecu.

Sorry, but this statement is horribly wrong. Here is a highly detailed write up on rb25-z32 wiring. Feel free to count how many wires are needed to depin and let me know. More than 5? Soldering required? You betcha.
http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php/top ... ntry438576

TT swapping an NA is not cheap either but everyone seems to want to try and justify that it is "cheaper" when in reality it would end up costing me about the same as this RB swap that I am undertaking just to get a Factory TT motor in the car. Now going from TT to RB yes that is definitely working in reverse.

Well, I truly hope you prove me wrong and I don't intend to discourage you; i only stand to inform. But please report back with the ending cost

[z32pilot62]

OHRLY? Explain how you plan to route the water lines when it's crammed in between the upper radiator support and the engine. The rb is a much longer motor - a straight 6 vs a v6. Guarantee you need an undermounted radiator unless you feel like hacking the front or rear of the engine bay.
Notice how far back into the firewall that engine is. Also notice the throttle body/intake piping being in the way of the stock vg radiator.

The way I'm planning to do mine is with the motor as far back as physically possible, run this: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/GRI-1 ... /?rtype=10 and E-fans on the front to maximize room in front of the motor. As stated before, I plan to run a single SMIC with OE piping and that should be more than plenty for the modest power goals I have for the RB20...

Seems to be quite a bit of room back there to me and his timing cover is in about the same place as your picture. Care to elaborate on "how far back into the firewall that engine is"?
So if you pulled the motor back the amount that there looks to be room for in my picture then I'm willing to bet there would be quite a bit of room for the intake/throttle body. Still if using the OEM RB20/25 intake then that would not be a problem even if you did do a FMIC with inlet/outlet on opposite sides.
Something like this would take care of that issue but I know "custom intake"

Proof, please. You can only mount an rb25 in a z32 so many ways. Most people would try to mount the motor as far rear-ward as possible for better weight balance/distribution rather than trying to preserve the stock driveshaft.

Most people that are looking to do the swap the inteligent way yes would mount the motor as far back as possible, those trying to make the swap as simple as possible are going to just swap bellhousings so they dont have to change driveshafts and mount the motor a little farther forward. Like I said, depends on how you mount the motor...

Moot? It would still leave you with the task of creating a one-off piece vs choosing from a selection of new or used exhausts that'll fit like a glove. I guarantee I could find a used vg30dett exhaust for cheaper than what you could make a custom rb25-z32 one for.

Must be pretty expensive to get exhaust work done in your area then, downpipe back to a y-pipe before the cat back is what 4 feet? I was quoted $135 to do that on my Honda... But you are right, it probably wont fit "like a glove" or maybe there are decent exhaust shops out there that can do quality work that fits proper.

Sorry, but this statement is horribly wrong. Here is a highly detailed write up on rb25-z32 wiring. Feel free to count how many wires are needed to depin and let me know. More than 5? Soldering required? You betcha.
http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php/top ... ntry438576

Okay, you got me on this one, I was basing my statement on the RB20 wiring integration which IS only about 5 wires and yes soldering... Oh noes, not teh solders. IMO, if you are even considering this swap then you should already know how to read a wiring schematic and be able to solder competently.

Well, I truly hope you prove me wrong and I don't intend to discourage you; i only stand to inform. But please report back with the ending cost

Thanks, I stand to inform as well from an insiders perspective. I do not know if you have bought an RB or not but your statements tend to be one sided and I just want to let people know that there are other opinions out there and other ways to do things.

[bartZ32tt]

The way I'm planning to do mine is with the motor as far back as physically possible, run this: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/GRI-1 ... /?rtype=10 and E-fans on the front to maximize room in front of the motor. As stated before, I plan to run a single SMIC with OE piping and that should be more than plenty for the modest power goals I have for the RB20...

Seems to be quite a bit of room back there to me and his timing cover is in about the same place as your picture. Care to elaborate on "how far back into the firewall that engine is"?

totally mis-understood my comment about the engine being against the firewall (for the picture I posted). My point was that even with the engine as far back as it was in the example I gave, there was little to no room for a traditionally mounted radiator. My argument was in response to ttkickedin's remark about running the stock vg rad, but it appears that you're planning to drop $270 for a rad anyways, so this doesn't apply to your plans. However, the radiator you plan to get is 3" thick..doesn't look like you'd have enough room with the engine all the way back still...

Most people that are looking to do the swap the inteligent way yes would mount the motor as far back as possible, those trying to make the swap as simple as possible are going to just swap bellhousings so they dont have to change driveshafts and mount the motor a little farther forward. Like I said, depends on how you mount the motor...

apples:oranges comparison picture; still doesn't provide proof. this is in an s-chassis and my argument was regarding the rb25; not rb20.

Must be pretty expensive to get exhaust work done in your area then, downpipe back to a y-pipe before the cat back is what 4 feet? I was quoted $135 to do that on my Honda... But you are right, it probably wont fit "like a glove" or maybe there are decent exhaust shops out there that can do quality work that fits proper.

another apples:oranges comparison. You're going off of an exhaust quote you got for a honda and applying it to a one-off FI piece. what material do you plan to use for the downpipe..aluminized steel? have fun replacing it later down the road

Thanks, I stand to inform as well from an insiders perspective. I do not know if you have bought an RB or not but your statements tend to be one sided and I just want to let people know that there are other opinions out there and other ways to do things.

Isn't that the definition of a debate - 2 or more groups representing two different sides? Nobody's arguing that there are alternative options out there. Still doesn't make them more cost effective though; especially for modest power goals, but more power to ya (no pun intended) for going against the trend and trying your own thing. That's ultimately all I'm trying to say - an rb swap into a z32 is not gonna be $3-4k.

[z32pilot62]

However, the radiator you plan to get is 3" thick..doesn't look like you'd have enough room with the engine all the way back still...

We will see when the time comes, that particular radiator is the same dimensions as a TT radiator and if all else fails then it will be put just in front of the core support and the locations of the inlet and outlet will be very easy to route for the RB(either engine). There are a couple guys using the 13" tall version of that same radiator and it is supposed to fit inside the core support so I may go that route as well, it will probably end up being the better option with the rather small RB20.

apples:oranges comparison picture; still doesn't provide proof. this is in an s-chassis and my argument was regarding the rb25; not rb20.

And there lies our difference of views, the 20 is actually a tad shorter than any other RB. Most people think they are exactly the same block and motor which is not true, the RB20 is basically a CA18 with 2 more cylinders.

another apples:oranges comparison. You're going off of an exhaust quote you got for a honda and applying it to a one-off FI piece. what material do you plan to use for the downpipe..aluminized steel? have fun replacing it later down the road

Pwnt me again, but yes I do still think I could get a stainless piece done up quality for cheaper than you could buy quality new parts, Imo I think its unfair to try and price the swap on being able to buy used parts even though that is the most cost effective route for someone doing a VGTT swap.

Isn't that the definition of a debate - 2 or more groups representing two different sides? Nobody's arguing that there are alternative options out there. Still doesn't make them more cost effective though; especially for modest power goals, but more power to ya (no pun intended) for going against the trend and trying your own thing. That's ultimately all I'm trying to say - an rb swap into a z32 is not gonna be $3-4k.

We will see, since I'm doing the work myself rather than buying parts that I can make myself. I will be able to drastically reduce the cost of the swap overall. I'm on track with my budget as of now and I am looking at buying anything used that I can modify to work as well as new in an effort to save myself money. Research and deal getting is key in any swap. Ill put it this way, I joined NICO due to their RB section and bought my motor about 2 months after my join date on here, been doing research and parts collecting ever since. I dont plan on spending a dime I dont have to and I want as many parts as I can get to make the swap take as little time as possible. This is not my first motor swap and wont be my last either so I do have the mind set to think out most of what im going to need to get the job done ahead of time.

[TTkickedin]

Everyone should know there's multiple ways to do everything. There's not one way to do anything. There's cheap ways, lucky ways, then by the book. Everyone will have their own opinion on each way.

but as much as most would not like to admit it, theres a CHEAP way to get this RB into the 300zx engine bay. Is that necessarily saying that's the best way? NO, but that's what some people can afford, not a swap containing titanium forged everything and a custom mandrel bent shop from the godliest exhaust manufacturer in the world, and a harness with gold connectors.. and a stand alone ecu for stock engine for right now...

obviously this is a severe exaggeration but you get the idea.

And as far as this whole exhaust issue comes in, which is the only one i really wanted to spend my time on due to the honda vs nissan comparison...

If you mount an rb into the 300zx, the only part of the exhaust that would need changing is the part before cat... And you could have the choice or running a single exit exhaust, or dual exhaust. if dual, a y pipe would have to be made, and this would put significant bending in the exhaust, i'm sure, and would be more costly.. if single, a single custom pipe would have to be made before the oem cat to the rb26 downpipe, and
the existing 300zx exhaust on the left side would be used after cat. there would be no need to fabricate an entirely different exhaust system when the problem can very well be sorted out pre cat.. one could do it, but that's for the person performing the swap to consider. highly unnecessary but possible if you have an endless supply of cash.

(ive been away from nico for a while, if this has already been said, disregard.)

Theres users on here with RB swapped 300zx'es if anyones interested. I have ONE as a facebook friend. I'll try to get his input as to how much he spend, and what he had to do, or have done..

[TTkickedin]

oh and by the way, dunno if this has been said, but you can use the rb26 intake manifold on a rb25 with an adapter, either custom or bought from this manufacturer.. i forgot. but if you search, you might find it. this might easily avoid a hood modification.