Intake Butterfly Removal

Information on the naturally-aspirated KA24E and KA24DE engines.
veil_side_
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2002 11:09 am

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Hey everyone I'm new here which I guess is obvious by my post count. I don't plan to be a ricer here. Just get and share information like everyone else.

My question is about Intake Manfiold butterflies in the KA's. I've heard of people removing them and getting noticable HP gains but I don't know if this can be backed up by numbers or if its worth the trouble only to receive about 1/2 of a horsepower at 6500 rpms. Anyone? This is on a KA that may be running boost eventually.

-thanks


veil_side_
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Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2002 11:09 am

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anyone?

R240NA
Posts: 462
Joined: Sun Sep 15, 2002 7:43 am

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First off, the secondary butterflies are only found on 91-early 93 DOHCs. They are located right at the end of the upper plenum by the head, and actuated by a vacuum pump mounted behind the head by the firewall. Removing them requires removing the intake manifold. Each plate is screwed into a long rod, the rod is held in place by a set screw in the center and a bolt at the end. You'll ned to remove each plate first, then draw the rod out the back end. Replace the center set screw and tap or seal the bolt hole at the back and you're done. Pull the vacuum actuator off and cap the line going into it, or trace it back to it's originating point and cap it there. While you've got it off, you might as well ditch the TB cooling lines, as well as the cooling loop on the lower plenum. Whole job takes a few hours if you're a novice, and you'll need to order the upper plenum gasket to replace the existing one, it usually tears when the manifold is removed. Enough info for you?

veil_side_
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2002 11:09 am

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Yeah, I have a '92 so I guess I should have them. Um. Is there any point to removing this. I plan on running boost eventually, I was wondering if this would help in any way? Or if its just one of those useless mods like Altezzas?

R240NA
Posts: 462
Joined: Sun Sep 15, 2002 7:43 am

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Couldn't hurt, it's not useless, just a lot of time to do a small change. If you have time, go for it.

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Dattebayo
Posts: 33297
Joined: Sun Aug 25, 2002 10:04 am
Car: 2004 Frontier Desert Runner
Location: NE DC

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how many hps do you gain on average??? i have an early 93 and actually like to work on my engine (even if there are minimal gains its still a gain) and besides i might as well when the new pistons go in.

veil_side_
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Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2002 11:09 am

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Hey 2BN_S13, how much did you bore out your Throttle body. I've been looking to get that done too. And is it possible to stick on a Z32 TB in there. I mean I don't know how much of a difference it would make or is it even possible.

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Dattebayo
Posts: 33297
Joined: Sun Aug 25, 2002 10:04 am
Car: 2004 Frontier Desert Runner
Location: NE DC

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well mine was a custom job done by a local shop, and it cost like 200 (it was a hook up). I have it bored to 64mm and there had to be a custom butterfly made. I dont know how big the z32 tb is though. If it is bigger than that, i dont see how you could incorporate that without getting a custom manifold done...anything is possible with $$$

R240NA
Posts: 462
Joined: Sun Sep 15, 2002 7:43 am

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veil_side_ wrote:Hey 2BN_S13, how much did you bore out your Throttle body. I've been looking to get that done too. And is it possible to stick on a Z32 TB in there. I mean I don't know how much of a difference it would make or is it even possible.


KA throttle body is plenty big. Boring it out will give slightly better response, but not much power. The Z32 uses a smaller one IIRC.

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lucas_420
Posts: 222
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2002 3:16 pm
Car: 92 240 hatch

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What is the origional purpose to the butterflies and whatare the negatives, if any, removing to removing them?

Will it hurt emissions?

I live in an emissions controlled area and it seems every mod I come across is illegal

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1991240xs
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Joined: Wed Jul 24, 2002 6:51 pm
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We should get dauntless to do this and take tons of overly informative pictures and sticky it for a couple weeks :)

jrc90240sx
Posts: 455
Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2002 9:21 am

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Well I wont to just add a couple of things if i may. First the secondary butterflys are also on the 89-90 SOHC KA engine. they are located derectly below the injectors. I showed it to the guy at the machine shop, and all he could think of was that it was a stupied thing to do. but anyway, i am taking them out, along with porting my intake, and inlarging the TB. with my ported head, new cam, and 11-1 compression, every bit will help.

The reson they put them in is to help the air flow into the engine, it almost helps it ack as a short intake runer a low RPM and then a long runer at high RPM. not really a bad idea to help the over all power band, but with what i am doing its not needed.

Boehm
Posts: 22
Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 11:46 am

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How do you tell the diffrece between an "early" 93 and a "later" 93?

R240NA
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Joined: Sun Sep 15, 2002 7:43 am

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Boehm wrote:How do you tell the diffrece between an "early" 93 and a "later" 93?


Look on the back of the head, you should see a large gold-colored vacuum solenoid, this is the SCV that controls the butterflies. If you don't have it, you're a later car.

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lucas_420
Posts: 222
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2002 3:16 pm
Car: 92 240 hatch

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What is the origional purpose to the butterflies and whatare the negatives, if any, removing to removing them?

Will it hurt emissions?

R240NA
Posts: 462
Joined: Sun Sep 15, 2002 7:43 am

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lucas_420 wrote:What is the origional purpose to the butterflies and whatare the negatives, if any, removing to removing them?

Will it hurt emissions?


No negatives. They're supposed to help build lowend torque, but not to a great degree. Emissions will not be affected.


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